Hi everyone, I live in an area where I have frequent encounters with the Hickory Creek, which was a streamlined tail car of the 20th Century Limited. Does anyone know how many other cars from the 20th Century survive? If so, do you know where they are and what types of cars they are? Thank you everyone.
Not sure how many survived. I do know many were bought and sent to Mexico.
Post this on the RyPN interchange. “Rainier Rails” maintains an extremely detailed list of passenger-car histories, and will be able to provide you all the information on survivors, including those that may have recently been scrapped.
When you do your search , you will notice that by the early 60’s NYC was reducing its comminment to its long distance passenger service. Sleepers and lounge’s were sold off to various railroads. The 20 th century 4-4-2 Dr as well as mid train lounge’s came off the rosters from 1960- 1962. Other sleepers and parlors were converter to commuter cars.
Shortly thereafter the train lost its all Pullman status. Sadly the train disappear into the mist in 1966.
It most certainly didn’t fade away like MacArthur’s old soldier. And it wasn’t cut by some bean-counting attorney, either. Perlman made the conscious decision that if 25 and 26 weren’t going to be run as full red-carpet trains, they wouldn’t be run at all. And to this day I agree with his decision.
I ’ m not sure what your driving at since I never stated my opinion of NYC decsion to reduce the 20 th century losses. I simply stated the train was down graded twice before it’s was finally discontinued. And in my personal opinion perhaps not yours, the train was a shadow of her former past. And she did glide into the mist on her final run. In 1968 when the Penn central realigned its water level routes, all the remaining named trains lost their names. The PC still offered NYC/ bos service to chicago and detroit with sleepers, slumber coaches, diner and lounge services
In the early 60’s it was apparent that the NYC was bleeding cash on all of its passenger service’s including its commuter operations and something had to be done.
But thanks for your input just the same.
My mistake, the train was not discontinued until 1967. She was carded to arrive in Chicago at 9 am . on her final run, she was 9 hours late so she could have both literally and figuratively disappear into the early misty night at the la Salle St station.
No more, and perhaps less, than almost any other train of that era. Are you trying to claim that rolling out the red carpet, giving the women carnations on boarding, etc. demonstrates you have a cut-rate train?
You’re entitled to your opinion; I won’t say it was wrong. I do know, however, that Perlman and others on the ‘green team’ remained proud of the train, enough so that diminishing its amenities or its speed for cost-cutting was not considered an option. That’s well-established historically, whether you agree or not.
The train was late account of a freight derailment, as I recall, not because of any sort of dawdling or lack of enthusiasm on the part of her people.
What this has to do either with the Twentieth Century or with Perlman utterly escapes me. Had you forgotten, or were you ignorant of the fact that, Perlman was essentially summarily fired after the merger, and no one from the PRR driver’s seat was particularly concerned with ‘named trains’ on That Other Railroad? Did you think that an overextended, quickly-running-bankrupt operation like PC cared about obviously money-losing passenger-train conventions? The point is that none of that crap applies in the least to Perlman and the Century.
I thought it highly interesting at the time, and still do, that when Amtrak took over, they kept running a Broadway, b
According to The Twentieth Century Limited 1938-1967 by Richard J. Cook, Sr., 1995 printing:
Roster-Cars Purchased for Twentieth Century Limited-1938
- RPO 5018 went to Indiana Ry. Museum in 1971
- Diners 681, 682 and 683 went to NdeM in 1959
- Century Club went to Speno Rail Service Aug 1958
- 12 “Cascade” series 10-Rmt/5-DBR cars went to NdeM between 1958 and 1960
- Imperial Bay 10026 (4-Compt./4-Bedroom/2-Drawing Room) car renamed “Queensboro Bridge” (1949) before it’s 1968 retirement and susequent sale to New Orleans NRHS (date not listed)
- Imperial Chateau 10030 renamed “International Bridge” (1949) sold to Jones Prop, Sharon Lee (1965)
- Imperial Highlands 10032 renamed “Eads Bridge” (1949); sold to IC (1958) as Gilman; Ret. 1968; sold to Tempo Mfg. Co. San Antonio, Tx
- Imperial House 10033 renamed “Brooklyn Bridge” (1949); sold to IC (1958) as Galena; Ret. 1968; donated to Texas Transp. Museum, San Antonio, Tx
- Imperial Palace 10027 renamed “Thousand Islands Bridge” (1949) ;sold to NdeM (1959) as Gulfo de Mexico
- 8 “County” series 13-Bedroomcars were sold to NdeM in 1961
- Bedloes Island 10640 (I-Master Rm./1-BR/Buffet/22-Seat Lng.) rebuilt to 4BR/28-Seat Obsv/Buffet/Lng (1946); Ret. 1957-part used as half of tower at Beech Grove Shops
- Manhattan Island 10641 Reblt. 1946 as above; Sold to NdeM (1958) as Cuitzeo, later Club Metlac
- Pelee Island 10643 Reblt. 1946 as above; sold to Jones Tool and Die Co., later used as half of tower at Beech Grove Shops
- Thousand Islands 10642 Reblt. 1948 as above; sold to NdeM (1957) as Amacuzac, later Club Metrata
Cars Purchased for Re-equipping the Twentieth Century Limited-1948
- Hickory Creek- To NYC
Thank you Becky for the information.
Wabash River also went to the B&O in 1956, along with Maumee River and Genesee River.
Small correction: PC did not discontinue the Century, i was discontinued, along with all other name trains except the Laurentian and Montreal Limited, in 1967, still New York Central.
After the “downgrading” with coaches and slumbercoach, service was still excellent and food just as fine in the two-unit dining car.
PC kept the Broadway with its name. But PRR had essentially ended it and transfered the name to th General. I’d say it was the only train under PC where service was really good-to-excellent.
Dave,
I totally agree with you. After coaches and slumbercoaches (sleeper-
coaches on the NYC) the “Century” was still one of the best trains
in the U.S. The coach section even had it’s own diner-lounge and
coach passengers were not permitted in the first class portion of
the train. I rode the train several times and can say it was one
a wonderful experience. The coaches did nothing to downgrade
the train. Even the latter day “Super Chief” had it’s coach section
(the "El Capitan) and the great Atlantic ocean liners were not
all first class.
a
[quote user=“RME”]
ROBERT WILLISON
I simply stated the train was downgraded twice before it was finally discontinued.
No more, and perhaps less, than almost any other train of that era. Are you trying to claim that rolling out the red carpet, giving the women carnations on boarding, etc. demonstrates you have a cut-rate train?
And in my personal opinion perhaps not yours, the train was a shadow of her former past.
You’re entitled to your opinion; I won’t say it was wrong. I do know, however, that Perlman and others on the ‘green team’ remained proud of the train, enough so that diminishing its amenities or its speed for cost-cutting was not considered an option. That’s well-established historically, whether you agree or not.
And she did glide into the mist on her final run.
The train was late account of a freight derailment, as I recall, not because of any sort of dawdling or lack of enthusiasm on the part of her people.
In 1968 when the Penn Central realigned its water level routes, all the remaining named trains lost their names. The PC still offered NYC/BOS service to Chicago and Detroit with sleepers, slumber coaches, diner and lounge services
What thi
I asked the question via PM, and while “Rainier Rails” says he isn’t registered to post on the Trains forums, he provided this link to a relevant RyPN thread on all surviving NYC lightweight equipment with the comment that all the equipment from the Century is noted therein. Some of this will update, past 1995, what Penny Trains has so nicely provided.
Robert Willison, your last sentence is wrong because I rode the 20th century Limited from Chicago to New York on the first Sunday in September 1967. I remember it was Sunday because the promised free glass of champagne could not be served as the train was passing through Ohio.
The 20 th century last trip was December 3 , 1967. I hope the champagne was good.