There have been instances where GG-1s ran at 100 mph on th e NEC. They seemed to do this pretty regularly both int heir prime and in substitution when MU Metroliners had problems. Has anybody had experience of their operating at higher speed?
I’ve never heard or read of the GG1’s going any faster than 100MPH, from what I’ve been told the gearing wouldn’t have allowed it, but then I may have been told wrong.
I’ve also been told no one ever knew how really fast they would go, the trackage available made going over 100 unadviseable. This one’s a puzzler.
Link attached to the actual PRR equipment diagram shows the top speed of 100 MPH.
http://prr.railfan.net/diagrams/PRRdiagrams.html?diag=gg1_dc_2.gif&sel=ele&sz=sm&fr=
I don’t know how often they actually got over 100 MPH, but the Metroliner-equipped GG1s used in the mid-1970s were allowed 105. The main modification was to the bearings on the non-motorized trucks.
Anyone got a spec instr showing 105 for GG1s?
In times past, Maximums were rarely if ever a written instruction. Wink, wink, nod, nod.
Perhaps it was understood that the speed limits indicated in the ETT would be observed–so there was no need to state how fast a particular class could be run? ----More smiles and winks.
A senior Division Official I knew well ‘back in the day’ stated that on Main Tracks the ETT maximum of 79 MPH was there for the benefit of the government. His engineers were instructed to move their trains as fast as possible when necessary to ‘make up time’. Curve and Train Order speed restrictions were to be observed.
Not related to GG1s but the situation was similar on the Chicago District of the Illinois Division of the IC (Champaign to Stunel Rd.) during the 60s. 79 on the books but whatever it takes to get/keep on schedule. Did a lot of 33sec miles along there!
[quote user=“daveklepper”]
There have been instances where GG-1s ran at 100 mph on the NEC. They seemed to do this pretty regularly both in their prime and in substitution when MU Metroliners had problems. Has anybody had experience of their operating at higher speed?
Reported speed of between 125-128mph during the Claymont tests, although I have not seen the actual paperwork. Dial speedometers registered only 100mph (same as the T1s) and I do not recall what, if anything different, was used on the engines modified for Metroliner service.
It was my understanding that the Metroliner permission was 110mph, not 105mph; they certainly ran at that speed on occasion, and were technically capable of reaching higher speed but were badly underdamped. There were some discussions of 120mph peak operation, but this would have required fairly extensive rebuilding and, of course, the problem with underbraking from the required Amfleet consists nipped the higher-speed GG1 experiment in the bud long before any of that testing was done. I suspect a considerable amount of the “Metroliner” road mileage was run at higher speed as I don’t recall any tire problem with the 100mph maximum.
The “156mph” is a particularly egregious wives’ tale, which I doubt anyone with even the least familiarity with a physical GG1 would swallow. But it makes an even better story than 6100 on the Trail Blazer.
The T1 Spedometers topped at 120mph, and there was a good website story of reaching that speed. “A good read for steamheads, Last Chance for a Pennsylvania Class T!,” by John L. Crosby.
My own top apwwsa on rhw NEC were nly 136 on a Metrolinier MU and 110 on the Turbotrain. Acela is faster than that.
GG1s, you mean?
Sometime after March 1978 the timetable increased GG1 speed to 100 mph. That’s the limit in the 10/78 timetable, then in 4/79 they’re back to 90. Has anyone found anything in print allowing GG1s 105 or more?
GG1s operating “Metroliner” service with Amfleet consists.
If I remember this correctly, “10 over” the highest employee timetable speed was required mechanically, and this is where the 110mph limit comes in.
Mr. Klepper, trust me when I say the original T1 speedometers only read to 100mph. I have copies of the drawings and have been researching how to duplicate the mechanism.
[quote user=“RME”]
In the spring of 1970 I rode the Metroliner from Washington to New York, and spent much of the time in the vestibule at the front of the train. I did not keep my eye on the speedometer all the time, but I do not recall noting any speed over 100 mph. There may have been times that we exceeded 100 mph.
Wasn’t that the speed reached by the modified Silverliners that were doing a proof of concpet test for the Mteroliner MU’s?.
My recollection was that the GE equipped Metroliners were good for 160 MPH and he Westinghouse equipped were good for 165 MPH. “Good for” meaning that the Metroliners being able to attain that speed in testing as opposed to being to operate at that speed in revenue service.
RME: This is from the article downloaded from this website, which I gave as a reference:
Our last scheduled stop was in Van Wert, Ohio. Again, Harry drove into the station, making a precise spot so that the various mail and express carts did not have to move far to find an open door. He called me over to his side of the cab and said, “Johnny, this may be our last chance at one of these beasts. What do you say about seeing just what she’ll do between here and Fort Wayne?” As he spoke, I noted that his face was completely covered with dirt, except for the two white circles behind his glasses.
My deferential reply was, “You’re the boss. My side of the cab is still attached to yours.” He nodded in reply to my answer, and issued a warning. “You’d better get your fire ready, 'cause we’re going to move out of here.”
With this bit of information, I began to work on my fire. I grabbed the No. 5 scoop shovel and filled the back corners of the firebox. I shut off the stoker jets and ran a big ward of coal into the firebox, right in front of the firebox doors. When finished, I felt satisfied that I was ready for what was to come.
With the first peep of the communicating whistle, Harry turned on the bell and sanders. A second later came the second peep. He cautiously opened the throttle. The first six or so exhausts were relatively gentle “chuffs” as we began to move. One of the exhausts blew a perfect smoke ring. When Harry was satisfied that we had a good supply of sand under the drivers, he pulled open the t
I should add that my all-time favorate locomotive is still the N&W J. But there is no question that the Pennsy T-1 WAS North America’s fastest steam locomotive.
Some T-1s may have gotten 100mph speedometers, but there certainly were some with 120mph ones.
The speedometers on Metroliner MUs were digitial. I am sure they could register 199 mph if that were obtained. I often rode behind the engineer and frequently saw 120mph. But only once 136 mph top.
If there was a T1 speedometer that read over 100mph, produce a picture, or a reference that shows one. I have done extensive research that appears to establish the contrary, but of course you can’t prove a negative, and I for one would be delighted to find legitimate evidence of a speedometer reading that high. (Of course, the same argument that was made in the Firestone 721 case – that having a speedometer reading that high meant the engine was good to operate that fast – might have applied…)
And there is no “N&W J-1”. Unless you mean the temporary wartime expedient with plain rods and little streamlining, which was mercifully corrected ASAP when materials restrictions were relaxed. The engine is simply “class J” just as its 2-6-6-4 sisters are ‘class A’.
I rode the Metroliner to Washington as a child (in 1969?) and the train frequently reached 100mph at that time - in fact, the engineer (he was NOT called a ‘motorman’ on PC) picked up the PA mike at one point to tell the passengers ‘we’re now doing a hundred’ when I mentioned it. I do not remember markedly exceeding that speed, though.
I was amused to ride a commuter train in from Landover a few years ago and having it regularly get up to 112mph, without much effort (or interest from the engineer). Call me old-fashioned, but I still find locals that go that fast to be interesting.
If I remember correctly, the first Metroliner service was introduced in December 1969. My 136 mph experience was in January 1970, on a southbound run from NY to Washington. I do not remember whether it was between New Brunzwick and Princeton Junction or between Newark and Perryville, where were the usual spots to see 120mph. It was tbe only time I recall 120 mph exceeded.
The article that I copied on to my hard-drive is the only source I have for a 120mph speedometer on T1s. Is it possible that they were applied retroactively, replacing originally-installed 100mph speedometers? Is the story fictional? At this point I do not remember whether it was a Classic Trains or Trains offering, but it was definitely from this website.
Possibly your computer skills are greater than mine and can pull up the original article on this website.
I visited the cab of a GG-1 once, and rode opposite in the Fireman’s seat from New Haven to Penn, NY. I don’t remember the speedometerv and take your work that it read only to 100. In any case, I doubt we exceededs 79 anywhere on that run.
Haa any reader been in a T-1 cab and can report on the speedometer that he or she observed?
When did numerical display speedometers come into use? Is it possible that some replaced regular circular speedometers in some T-1s at some point in time? But then again he said “the needle stopped…”