On part of a test table for my bigger layout I want to experiment a little bit and give the homosate a try. I would assume that it might be easier to apply turf, cinders and such on top of foam (am I wrong?)
And a few other questions about both… If you nail (instead of glue) your track, is it difficult to do this on either foam or homasote?
Can use track nails on foam at all? I would think with the stress of pushing the nails in, the foam would crack…
But anyway, generally once you lay the homosate on top of the plywood, what are the first steps in adding scenery? Painting the homasote an earth color maybe? As you would with foam?
Gererally the homasote is used as roadbed, especially if handlaying your trackwork. This is due to how well it will hold spikes. When using extruded foam track is preferably held with acrylic caulk.
It is not nec to cover the plywood completly with the homasote but if this is what you prefer, just seal the surface with acrylic earth tone paint before any scenery. You may find that the use of extruded foam may allow you to control track elevations and scenery contours much better than that totally flat homasote covered plywood. You could add scenery contours above the “base” homasote, however any depressions such as drainage ditches, gullies, ponds, streams etc: will require cutting out the homasote. This will allow only a 1/2" depression to hitting plywood. Anything deeper and the plywood and possibly joists will need cutting/ notching. Even the use of 1 or 1 1/2" foam over plywood will be much more versitile for your scenery. Of coarse you will need to use roadbed, but this can be glued directly to the foam. Any track elevations can be done by cutting inclines or using the WS riser system.
Other options for constuction would be open grid/ cookie cutter and then add sections of plywood and/or foam for the scenery. Hills and other scenic areas could also be done w/ the cardboad lattice if the layered cake (foam) is not used.
There are many different options to the type of layout construction. The pros and cons of each would generally determine the layout type, overall topography and your preference. I prefer “L” girder,and/or open grid with risers to cookie cutter subroadbed. Some foam is used for scenery purposes. I’m not into the foam covered layout, but it works quite well for about 1/2 of the layout builders these days. My issues with foam are the incline transitions and the supporting of elevated sections once you get to elevation. If you add elevated plywood for the raised section, why not just hold the elevated
So foam actually makes sound louder than it would be without it? Lets say you use WS road bed glued to foam, would this make any difference? Or would it actually be just as noisy, if not noisier than cork on plywood?
Homasote is easier because you can drive nails into it and it will hold track nicely. I think a combination would work best. Homasote for flat area’s, and foam for deep scenery area’s. My layout is flat, so I only used homasote. I filled the screw holes with spackling and painted it quaker brown. You don’t have to sprinkle ground foam right away either. It works great with diluted white glue afterwards as well.
Here’s a couple of pics to give you an idea what homasote looks like when used properly.
Doesn’t make any difference, you can apply scenic materials the same way with either base. Foam is easier to carve topography into.
It is easy to nail track using either. The difference is that in Homasote the nails actually hold the track down. You can push nails into Homasote using pliers.
Nope the foam won’t crack, its just the nails won’t hold. They pull right out of the foam.
You can do it pretty much any way you want, I paint my Homasote with a dirt color to cut dust and make it uniform in color. It makes it easier when I do go to apply ground cover. If you don’t want to paint it right away, that will work too.
My current layout was started in 1984 and is a three deck railroad. Flat yard areas are sheet homasote glued and screwd to 1/2inch plywood. I do this on major yard areas and lay the track directly on the homasote since they do not need raised roadbed. All mainline running areas are 3/4 inch plywood with commercial Homabed for roadbed. This system has been in use with no failures since 1984 and I have found it easy to repair and redo. Never tried foam and have no intentions of doing so.
I am of the other camp. My layout starts with 2" foam glued to 5/8" plywood, glued and screwed to 1x4 box-framework. It’s sectional and can be dismantled with minimal damage. The plywood base is for both long term structural stability and sound suppression. With the Woodland Scenics foam roadbed, (it’s a bit quieter than the cork), ballast and scenery, it’s not much noisier than homasote w/cork. Anyway, I’ve never found the sound of trains, large or small to be objectionable. Foam is very easy to carve and shape, glue, paint and add terain to.
Homasote is by far a superior way to go. For starters it’s no going to melt into a pile of goo if you happen to spill a few drops of C/A on it. It is much better for sound deadening as that is one of it’s intended uses from the manufacturer. Believe it or not it’s not specifically made for model railroading although the use in model railroading is recognized by the manufacturer. As mentioned it hold track spikes extremely well however my method of choice for securing track and roadbed to homasote is Latex adhesive caulking, DAP 3.0 to be specific. This stuff is unbelievable it sets up in under 3 minutes. What I do is use Homabed roadbed over homasote in some area’s this makes for ultra quite running. All you can hear is the click of the metal whels as they go over rail joints.and they are few and far between. On main and branch lines I now use Homabed over plywood subroadbed. The latex caulk also aids in sound deadening as it does not dry hard like glue but has some give to it which also has sound absorbing qualities.
Regarding applying scenery or ground cover the same methods apply as when using extruded foam. On large flat area’s such as yard I put down a coat of diluted white glue and water typically 70% glue 30% this just eliminates some of the thickness of the white glue allowing it to flow out smoothly. Then you apply what ever ground cover your using in the conventional way. Today I applied real dirt to one of the new yard panels using a tea strainer and dried in the oven dirt form my yard. If you choose you can stable screen wire to it or red rosin paper as well
I don’t see any need for foam on a layout. Have never used it and never felt deprived. There are older, reliable but “better”/cheaper/easier/less-dependent-on-oil/gas (if you care) alternatives. Read a “scenery” book for alternative-to-foam techniques. (OK, OK, foam can be useful for portable dioramas when weight is a major consideration.)
I’m a little surprised by the general opposition to foam on here considering Dave Vollmer has created such an excellent layout on a 3x9’ door using nothing but foam and woodland scenics road bed.
But…you all have made good points and provided me with useful information. I think for my test loop track area, (basically a 6x8’ table with plywood top), I will give the homasote a try and see how I like it, after all, I won’t need to do any scenery work here, no carving, or adding of mountains. I will just see how silent my trains can run, and then base my final decision on that.
A few more questions though:
I have seen videos on youtube of layouts with track layed (glued or nailed, I can’t tell) directly on the homasote base, with no cork or other roadbed underneath the track. What is the purpose of this? I thought you needed the track elevation that roadbed provides? (excluding the yard perhaps)
2)I recently visited the Cherry Valley 2 rail O scale club in Merchantville, NJ and I was very impressed with the homasote roadbed they had constructed on the entire layout. My question is, how do I make this? It seems very complicated, considering sheets of cork are traditionally alligned with the penciled in curves drawn on the table that establish the radius of the turn. Cork is very easy to lay because it comes in these very strips, how do you cut the homasote to match your curves the way that cork does?
3)I would like to paint the homasote road bed black in preparation for ballasting, will hardened paint greatly interfere with the sound absorbtion?
Precisely ; you don’t need elevation for a yard so I nailed mine down direct. I used both homabed, and corkbed for elevation. Corkbed is nice because you can use a rasp file for the rise in elevation.
