Post anything on America’s best western railroad. [8D]
Here are two great sites on the Great Northern Railway.
Well since you have that nice GN 4-8-4 pic…I’d be interesting in hearing comments about my idea of starting with a Spectrum Heavy 4-8-2 to model either a GN P-2 4-8-2 or an S-2 4-8-4 (as Sancho’s picture shows).
For the 4-8-4, the C&O Spectrum engine has the pumps on the front and the long vanderbilt tender of the GN engine, but of course you’d have to replace the trailing truck with a 4-wheel one. Otherwise, an undec 4-8-2 with an undec long vandy tender would come fairly close to a GN P-2 Mountain when decorated for the GN without having to make too many modifications.
Just a thought I’ve had in the back of my head for a while, any comments?? [?][;)][%-)]
p.s. Yes I know this is probably more a topic for the MR forum, but what the heck. [:I]
Depends how accurate you want it to be, as you said they would both come close is they were decorated but you probably couldn’t be accurate with either unless you scratchbuilt off those chassis.
I’ve found very few plasic model steam locomotives that are close enough to
the GN prototype to attempt any conversions. (O-3 Mikado excepted). So, I
bit the bullet and have aquired an adequate collection of older brass steamers.
If one was not a stickler for accuracy, (which affliction I happily acknowedge)
I suppose a creditable P-2 could be fashioned from the Spectrum Mountain.
I confess, I’ve never really looked into the project, as I have a pair of PFM P-2s.
My great grandfather worked for the great northern in 30s and early 40s
I have a question about the west’s greatest road(I know, I know my opinion). I am building several S scale wood sheathed box cars and am wondering what the color of the cars was. It appears brown, is that the mineral red that I have heard about?
Randy Johnson
Randy, the GN referred to the color as mineral brown. If that’s not confusing
enough, consider the sheer number of different shades on ‘mineral red’.
There must be dozens. From what I’ve seen, GN’s version runs to the dark
side of medium, though with weathering and aging, it can easily become
lighter. On wood sheathed cars, the paint will often not only fade, but chip
off as well, leaving visible weathered wood underneath-a variegated blend
of grays. I, myself, am happy using Floquil boxcar red, either mixed or
over sprayed with clear gloss to darken it. I am not very picky about mineral
brown,because of the changes it undergoes in weathering. Others probably
have different opinions.
Sounds about the same as the variations of orange and green for the Builder colors!
Ah well guess that leaves me some room for my discresion
Randy
The one thing I’ve learned (painfully) about orange and green, is to avoid
trying to match anything in a photograph as far as colors. The presence (or
absence) of filters, the light conditions, the general condition of the paint,
the age of the negative or print (or slide) and even the photographic develop-
ing process all conspire to make color matching from photos a very arcane
and difficult art. (Sure wi***he GNRHS could some way reissue reference
sheet number 28 with the paint chips). Then there are the differences in
formulating each individual batch of paint. Certain photos show, for example,
a consist of locomotives, all in EB paint, yet exhibiting 2 different shades of
orange[:O]. Volume 2 of the GN Color Pictorial series has just such a photo
on the bottom of page 15. Glacier green can be even worse. There were
definitely 2 different shades of that color. The early version, which appeared
in 1961 was rather light in appearance and had suggestions of a very small
amount of blue tint to it. It also faded very rapidly in service. Then, in 1965,
the GN took delivery of it’s well known order of 4-bay ACF covered hoppers.
These were painted in a much darker version of Glacier Green. This shade
tended to not fade much at all over time either. The 1967-built waffle-sided
boxcars numbered 4200-4399 were also in this darker shade. As our
GNRHS President Duane Buck says often: Never say never-or always-when
talking about the Great Northern Railway.
Yea, it all is very confusing with all of the various colors, i believe GNRHS has paint chips on their website.
Yes, GNRHS does have the reference sheet # 28 posted on their site. However,
exactly what colors you might see depends a lot on the quality of your monitor.
I have found it hard to match from that as well.
On another note, I just received the May flyer from Walthers. In it, is a
picture of what I belive is the upcoming GN-specific GP20 release.
If this photo is correct, Walthers has really done a magnificent model.
What I am seeing is Walthers is including the extra grab irons on each
end per GN practice, the correct front end mounted bell for the first
GN order of GP20s and the model appears to have the correct 4-step
corner wells-a feature never before modeled-other than in brass.
Only things missing are the winterization hatch (probably included
in the detail parts bag) and the two snow pilots-perhaps in the details,
or, easy to add with aftermarket parts. All in all, I am quite impressed
with what I am seeing. Wathers is doing GN modelers proud with
this one.
Of course some woodsided boxcars lasted long enough to be painted in the 50’s fire engine red scheme or the sixties glacier park green paint…I think a few even got the Big Sky Blue treatment !!
New Release! Precision Craft Models has announced the production of an
HO scale die-cast (or plastic) model of the GN S-2 4-8-4. These models to
be equipped either with open or vestibule cab. In 4 road numbers and with
or without sound and DCC. $399 with sound, $299 without. These are listed
in the Walthers online catalog.
I’ve never understood why Walthers would have something listed on their site before the manufacturer has it on their own site !! [%-)] Sounds like an interesting deal, not bad for a sound equipped GN 4-8-4. [:)] Unfortunately I suppose it will be a year or two until they’re actually released.
I agree. It is odd that PCM doesn’t yet list these releases but Walthers
does. However, Model Railroader’s website also announced these-along
with the new SP GS-4s and Daylight passenger cars. Two independent (?)
sources. Since it appears that PCM is a subsidiary of BLI (or a very close
affiliate) they have a great starting point for the S-2–BLI’s beautiful, but
very pricey brass one from earlier this year. Still hoping. . . . .
Walthers is forecasting these to be released around Spring 2007.
Oh, well. Patience is good to learn. Plus I can begin saving money now. . . .
Any insights on why GN decided it didn’t like Challengers? My understanding is they did try a couple, but they ended up on SP&S. They would seem ideal for GN’s profile, and a home built belpaire boilered Challanger, or even a modern 2-6-6-4 fast freight loco in GN green would have been interesting for sure.
No way! Southern Pacific was the best wetern railroad! [:(!][:P]
But, I do love GN northerns!
GREAT
NORTHERN
Streamlined Observations
by Al
The Great Northern Railway owned a total of twenty-two streamlined Observations, six from Pullman Standard, nine from American Car & Foundry and seven were rebuilt from heavyweight cars in GN shops.
In anticipation of the new lightweight streamlined EMPIRE BUILDERS about to make their debut in February 1947 the GN shops semi-streamlined an old heavyweight car 990 a 56 revenue seat Coach and remodeled the interior for a connecting service with the EMPIRE BUILDER between Great Falls and Havre, Montana. This car 1059 ROBERT S. FORD would be considered a blunt observation with diaphragm. Above the diaphragm was a red mars light. The car was painted in Empire Builder colors and even carried the EMPIRE BUILDER name in its letter board centered above the windows. The interior of the 1059 ROBERT S. FORD was fitted with a 12 seat Dinette and 14 seat Parlor section. The car operated for several years as the EMPIRE BUILDER connection and it is unknown what became of the 1059 ROBERT S. FORD.
The first lightweight streamlined Observations delivered to the GN were the five RIVER series for assignment to the streamlined EMPIRE BUILDERS of 1947. These were Pullman Standard built, as were all cars in the 1947 EMPIRE BUILDERS. Each RIVER series car featured 2 Double Bedrooms 1 Drawing Room Buffet 14 seat Cocktail Lounge and 16-seat lounge Observation. These Swallow-tailed Observations were both numbered and named 1190 MISSISSIPPI RIVER, 1191 MISSOURI RIVER, 1192 FLATHEAD RIVER, 1193 KOOTENAI RIVER and the CB&Q owned 1194 MARIAS RIVER.
They entered EMPIRE BUILDER service beginning February 23, 1947 providing daily service between Chicago and Seattle by way of the Twin Cities. The EMPIRE BUILDER also served Portland with through cars to and from Chicago operated by the SP&S between Spokane and Portland. The RIVER series Observations were always assigned as through cars to Seattle.
On June 3, 1951 the RIVER series Observations alon