Almost ready to buy my DCC System...a few questions

Model Railroader Electronics and DCC
1

Ok my layout is not tooo big, basically a dogbone that travels about 30 feet with a 4 foot loop at one end, and 6 foot on the other end…2 parallel tracks making up the long part between the 2 bone ends

also along the straight part, I have a 2 sidings that branch off of the main line…

I have feeder wires all along the main line and the dogbone ends…but no feeders yet on the siding spurs.

there is an atlas (I think 528) turnout coming off of the mainline to the siding…then the siding has one more turnout making 2 parallel siding tracks…

so would I also put feeder wires for the sidings as well? I might further branch the sidings off to make more of a yard …maybe 2 more branches if i can fit it in somewhere…

I live in Phoenix, Arizona, can anyone suggest a good place to buy the DCC equipment? I am looking to get the Digitrax Super Chief, and the 8 amp power supply. I typically shop at “An Affair With Trains” but I thought I would see if any of you that might be in Phoenix know of any other places?

thank you all!!

2

You only have one of the best DCC suppliers on the web right in your back yard www.litchfieldstation.com not sure if they have walk in business, but certainly worth the phone call.

3

8 amps?!?!?! Are you trying to weld something?

5 amps is plenty considering the average loco draws .2 amps.

David B

4

I have been using Blue Ridge Hobby or Tonys Trains, they seem to have the best price.

Joe Burden

5

David, im sorry, I was thinking the Super Chief was 8, I thought I saw that somewhere, maybe good up to 8?? either way, I want to buy with the ability to expand to a larger layout, and or more locos or accessories…

6

Simon and Joe, thank you for the tips on where to buy, I have checked out Tonys Trains and I was planning on looking into Litchfield station…

Any thoughts on what I need to do on the siding feeders?

7

The Super Chief is available as either a 5 amp or 8 amp version.

8

Chuck,

You should have ample power with a 5 amp Super Chief and a PS515 power supply. Have a look at Litchfield Station, Bruce doesn’t charge shipping on +$75 but in your case he may have to collect sales tax so that may be a wash with the shipping.

Now for the feeders. Yes, absolutely add feeders to those sidings. Basic rule is to have feeders every three feet. I recommend adding additional to any piece of rail that’s not soldered to a piece of rail that has a feeder.

Once you get the DCC system and connect it to the layout it will be time to do the quarter test. Named so because one can use a coin to short the rails. When the rails are shorted, the booster’s internal circuit breaker should trip immediately. Short the track all over the layout to make sure that there are enough feeders and the bus is substantial. If there is a delay in the booster’s trip response, add feeders or increase bus wire size, possibly both.

Martin Myers

9

Your going to like the Super Chief but get the 5 amp version.

10

Ok so 5 amps it is :slight_smile: So if the quarter does not trip, then I have some sort of loss going on, and I need another feeder. I have been afraid of the feeders as on my first couple I put on, I melted a tie or 2…after that I got the hang of it… So I was thinking i didnt want to over do it at the risk of messing up a piece of track. I guess I could always replace it if needed.

I will keep ya all posted on my progress :slight_smile: Thank you all!

Also thank you for the info on Bruce and Litchfield Station :slight_smile:

11

Hi!

I went to DCC last January, picking up a Digitrax 5 amp Super Chief, second booster, second DT400 throttle, two 5 amp power supplies, and to PSX4 circuit breakers. I have finished the lower level of my 11x15 HO layout, and am now working on the main level.

At 65, I’ve been playing with trains for almost 60 years, and while I’m “good” with electricity, I’m challenged with electronics. So far, I’ve been able to get excellent results from the system, mainly due to reading a lot and the good folks on this forum.

I checked prices at the recommended internet dealers like toytrainheaven, modeltrainstuff,nhshobbies, tonystrains, and caboosehobbies. I ended up buying the system at caboose hobbies (www.caboosehobbies.com) and got an excellent price, some valuable suggestions, and very quick delivery. I ended up spending close to $1,000, but if I had bought them at the local hobby shop it would have cost significantly more. I really try to give them as much business as I can, but I just could not “throw away” an extra $300.

Assuming you are in HO, the 8 amp system may be all you need. I would get a psx4 circuit breaker and have 4 blocks on the layout. That way a short in one would not shut down the whole layout.

I am using color coded wires, with 14awg for power buss, and 20 awg for track feeders. The feeders are placed about 3 feet apart, and while that is a lot of wiring, its fairly simple and assures good solid power to all points on the layout.

I don’t have any reverse loops, but DCC has a unit that automatically handles the situation - rather cheaply and very effectively.

By the way, I really studied a lot before I went to Dixitrax. Frankly, it was a close choice between

12

well I was a radio broadcast engineer for 25 years, so electronics is ok with me, so I understand current, voltage drops and all of that. I just am out of practice on soldering …most of my work was small circuit board soldering that didnt have plastic ties to melt lol. I have bought 3 of the kalmbach dCC books and understand it… I was just not sure on the turn out sections. I think the suggestion of getting the DCC system and doing the quarter test and some dry runs will prove out where my wiring is lacking. A fellow broadcast engineer has a DCC system and he didnt use many feeder wires at all, but I understand every system is different, and is dependant on whether you solder your rail joiners, how much flex vs sectional track, etc…

My layout is so early that adding feeders, more track, etc is easy. Last time I build all of the darn layout without ever checking the track much or doing any intricate wireing, so I am going slow on this one. Right now, I dont even have ballast on the track except for just one 2 foot section that I tested some ballast on… The track is just glued down so its easy to pull up if I have to fix something or add something.

i might want to put in a reverse loop or track crossover at some point, I probably ought to do that very soon before I get too much farther.

It would be really cool if ALL of you could come over today and look at my layout lol. Come on, airfare is cheap, and the weather in Phoenix is awesome hahaha

13

Mobilmann44, i meant to also say i too am using color coded wire, using the digitrax color codes…14awg for the buss and 22 for the feeders. I am going to check out 2 of the LHS in town, including litchfield station, as I do want to try to support the LHS if I can, but like you, im not able to spend a lot of extra cash, in fact I probably cant afford the circuit breakers and extra boosters…I have just enough for the starter set. Maybe for Christmas for the xtras :slight_smile:

14

Just quibbling a bit, Chuck, if you don’t mind me pointing it out. It isn’t so much a “loss” as a “not gotten there in the first place” problem. There is a substantial tolerance for variation in voltage in general terms in our hobby, but in the DCC houses, the signal to noise ratio is what matters when it comes to efficiency, both in terms of getting things to do what we want them to do, but also in terms of actually detecting that there is a fault way out…yeah…over there. As the voltage attentuates at the rail tops because of poor provision (for want of a better term), the signal propagation is not discerned as lacking in any one area, so the base station detection circuitry keeps on whistling in the dark as if nothing’s wrong. [:-^]

-Crandell

15

Crandall, I am with ya, I meant by loss as in the loss, whether it be a loose connection, high resistance, etc, would cause an issue…I am with ya on the signal to noise ration as well. I want to double check how my buss wires are run as well. Being a broadcast engineer, this sounds a lot like some of the black magic that RF creates.

Thank you all for your wonderful advise!

16

Hi again,

Perhaps there is no need to say this, but “just in case”, let me offer this final piece of advice…

A malfunctioning layout, or one that is trouble prone, will dampen your enthusiasm faster than anything. So, IMHO, the most important areas that need to get top priority are benchwork, trackwork, and wiring. Take the time to “do it right”, maintain high standards, and test, test, test. You will never regret doing this, and that’s for certain!

I also found that running stuff by the good folks on this Forum can really give you insight into what works, what doesn’t, and how to and how not to get stuff done. Without this Forum, I would still be in DC, and might very well have donated the train room for other uses.

ENJOY,

Mobilman44

17

This is excellent advice, and while it is perhaps obvious, it is not something that I followed when I first started to lay my track. The result a couple of persistent problem areas.

My secondary advice is don’t be afraid to rip something out and start again if it does not work to your satisfaction. I even went as far as to scenic and ballast an area that I knew was not bullet proof and suffered with it for months. I eventually bit the bullet and tore it out and resolved the entire problem and re did the scenery and ballast in an afternoon.

18

mobilemann and simon, oh yes, I know this all too well. Like I said earlier, my first layout was allll messed up. I had 3 sections of track on that first one that always caused a derailment, uncoupled cars, etc…I never tested it much and jumped right inot scenery. I got so frustrated with it I took it all down.

Now on this new one I have tested it…and as Simon suggested, I have already ripped out and put in 3 different sections of track that I didnt like. (luckily before ballast was applied). I had a kink on 2 sections, and another section I had a piece of flext that didnt look straight to me, it had just a slight S turn look to it…so I pulled it out and straightened it. Each time I do a repair, or fix something that has bugged me I am very happy… That is the main reason I even started this thread for the DCC questions… I would hate to go out and buy it and find out I didnt prewire it right and get frustrated.

This is truly a wonderful group of people here!

19

A Zepher would give you all the power you would need. I can run 4-5 sound units at a time with no problems. might be able to run more but haven’t tried. Five amps would be more than enough for your needs. So either way would work for you. One thing I didn’t do that I now am in the process of correcting is isolating most sidings so I can park an engine without any power going to the engine. I know with DCC you don’t have to do this but I like to be able to park a unit on a “dead” track, as it may sit there for a while, I also have a couple ABA units that are DC and without the “dead” track both take off when I go to DC mode with the Zepher. What ever you do you are going to love DCC…

20

Hey fellow Arizonain,

I know this is off topic but i’m curious, Do you like An Affair with Trains, I have only been to Roys Train World and sometimes I think there has to be a bigger Hobby Shop in AZ. Roys isn’t bad but they don’t have the largest selction, espically their scottsdale location which closed [:(] and their mesa isn’t opened on Sundays.

Thanks and Good Luck

Taylor