So reads the title of one of Trains News Wire articles for July 17. Restoration of service east of New Orleans in any of the three manners proposed by Amtrak seems less than an optimal use of Amtrak resources given the relatively low population and low pre-Katrina patronage along this route. The superior patronage and revenue solution would seem to be to restore the N.O./Florida passenger rail link by adding service to the 5.5 million people of the Atlanta metropolitan region which presently sees only the Crescent. Restoring the C of G’s relatively short Nancy Hanks’ run (http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nancy_Hanks_(train)) between Atlanta and Savannah would make north-south passenger rail travel between Atlanta and Florida possible. By proper timing of the Crescent with both the New Orleans’ eastern terminus of the Sunset (either as at present or as the presently-under-consideration connecting train at San Antonio with the new Chicago to L.A. Texas Eagle) and the southern terminus of the City of New Orleans, passenger rail travel between New Orleans and Florida could be accomplished, albeit using a longer routing, but with a minimum of added cost and the potential for much greater patronage by tapping into the grossly under-served Atlanta population base.
If all goes as planned, the SouthEast corridor will eventually extend to Atlanta.
That will connect Boston / NYC / Newark / Philadelphia / Baltimore / DC / Richmond / Raleigh / Charlotte / Atlanta.
A quoite from the news item:
“The study lays out the options, but it will be up to Congress to decide which option, if any, Amtrak will pursue.”
The three options mentioned were 1) extend the Sunset east, 2) extend the CONO east, or 3) run a seperate train. No mention was made of a specific destination nor the route to get to (wherever). Nor is there any mention of how this coordinates with the possible rearrangement of the Sunset and the Texas Eagle.
It is possible the local paper just got overenthusiastic about what is being considered. However if the paper has it correctly, Amtrak is punting the decision back to Congress. Offhand, I can’t think of a body less capable of making route decisions. Perhaps Amtrak’s real motive is to put back the time when they actually have to operate a train – by saying it is up to Congress further postponement is inevitable.
Have you read the report on AMTRAK’s web pages? You will see that AMTRAK is punting the decision to Congress.
Dakguy wrote:
“Amtrak is punting the decision back to Congress. Offhand, I can’t think of a body less capable of making route decisions.”
Congress might not make the best parent for Amtrak, but this is not an easy world and they are what we have.
Our government-sponsored national rail system is having growing pains. Amtrak’s guardian, Congress, is like the parent of a child facing the “real world” for the first time. The child was neglected during its formative years, and is now presented with the rosy lifetime philosophy that its future is made up of small, simple jobs (that is, “corridors”). But the “real world” is not letting that happen. The corridors are growing and blending in to one another.
Congress needs to realize that Amtrak needs help. This requires a change in philosophy. Like a child who barely made it through high school, Amtrak is not ready to fulfill its destiny. This child needs to go to college: Amtrak needs the total support of Congress while it transitions from a bumbling teenager into the best-in-the-world national rail network.
Yes, we need a train from New Orleans to Florida. And San Francisco to Los Angeles, Concord to Montreal, Pittsburgh to Cleveland, Atlanta to Birmingham…
Ummmm…there already IS a train from Atlanta to Birmingham…#s 19 & 20, the Crescent!
Don’t forget that it was Congress, courtesy of Corrine Brown (D) from Jacksonville, FL that instructed Amtrak to study the re-establishment of the Sunset Limited East from New Orleans. No comment on the wisdom [:-^] of asking Congress to decide.
I took Blue Streak’s suggestion above on where to locate the report, downloaded it and have read it a couple of times.
A quick summary of the report is that it examines 3 alternatives for New Orleans/Orlando service, and Amtrak apparently doesn’t want anything to do with any of them but will do so if ordered to do it by a Congress willing to pay for it (at what appears to be an inflated cost and on a very foot-draggy timetable).
I’m neither an expert on Amtrak nor on the route but several items struck me:
$20 mil for PTC for the route. Surely CSX is going to install it anyway as it will be required for TIH hazmat, but it appears the report volunteers Amtrak to pick up the bill.
$24 to $63 mil for additional rolling stock. Granted, this is a wild card, especially if the City and the Sunset are to remain Superliner equipment; but after current plans are executed for repairing Superliners, there still remains a pool of repairable cars.
$3.2 mil for a new station at Sanford. This is close to being a suburb of Orlando. Does it really need a stop? I thought Sanford was already getting a new station for the Auto Train – is there not some local connection between the two rail routes?
It takes Amtrak 20 months to hire and train crews, station personnel, etc.? Surely, there are qualified people in the system who have run the route before or would welcome the opportunity to transfer to these locations. Sure, the system as a whole will have to do some hiring but the lead times here appear to presume it will be necessary to staff the operation exclusively with new hires.
The ridership projections show farebox recovery of operating expenses of between 56% to 23% depending on the option selected. I am prepared to accept Amtrak’s direct operating cost estimates, but wonder about
The Auto Train Terminal is off the mainline on a spur just before the site of the Sanford station. The station on the mainline at Sanford is way beyond its prime and needs major upgrading or replacement. I haven’t ridden the train that way in several years so I don’t even know if the Sanford station is still standing.
There are a couple of reasons that come to mind: The Sunset’s old schedule was competitive with bicycling, not driving or flying. The folks who live along that route don’t have money for Orlando vacations. They barely have money for Walmart.
I have taken the Crescent from New Orleans to Washington, and it is merely a ghost of viable intrastate transportation. If the Sunset competes with bicycles, then the Crescent competes with mopeds…
Development of efficient intercity transportation is exactly the kind of economic expansion that this region needs.
Dakguy201: Now that you read it I’ll give some background.
$20 mil for PTC for the route. Surely CSX is going to install it anyway as it will be required for TIH hazmat, but it appears the report volunteers Amtrak to pick up the bill.
this I agree with you. the alternative for CSX would be to divert the TIH traffic up to Montgomery and then to Waycross but there is still a dark section on that route. Maybe charge CSX a fee for every TIH car running on the AMTRAK route?
$24 to $63 mil for additional rolling stock. Granted, this is a wild card, especially if the City and the Sunset are to remain Superliner equipment; but after current plans are executed for repairing Superliners, there still remains a pool of repairable cars.
Sorry! The superliners at Beech Grove that are being repaired will be needed to cover the present routes and equipment needs. We have not seen a timetable for ordering additional conventional and superliners but if the 4 billion vs 1 billion HSR proposal goes through then maybe an order for rolling stock can be placed. Facilities for a large car order seem to be lacking although many proposals have been put forward. Any suggestions?
$3.2 mil for a new station at Sanford. This is close to being a suburb of Orlando. Does it really need a stop? I thought Sanford was already getting a new station for the Auto Train – is there not some local connection between the two rail routes?
Sanfor station is being expanded. Sanford is between Deland and Winter Park then onto Orlando. The regular Sanford station is a derilic hulk that has been condemmed. I see no reason for rebuilding that station. The Auto Train facility could be used and also by the Silver trains but it probably would take an ac
In regards Sanford:
The spur into the Auto Train Terminal joins the CSX mainline and heads North ONLY. If Amtrak were to use the Auto Train Terminal to load and unload Silver Service passengers a pull in, back out, or back in, pull out operation would be required. If Silver Service Trains were to stop on the main line, it is a considerable hike to and a sizeable drop down to ground level at the Auto Train facility.
The southern half of the Crescent is a bit better than the Sunset was in terms of speed and ridership (and demographics of area). The Atlanta - north half is way better in all 3 areas.
Explain. Once upon a time, there were enough Superliners for this train and all others in the system. No new Superliner trains have been added. In fact, the Cardinal has been un-superlinered. So, fix’em all and there should be plenty.
Ok! Here goes. Under AMTRAK’s web site under the heading for the stimulus funds here is their explanations for all Superliner (SL) rebuilds. These are listed under project # PRJ 29110043:
1 - SL b/c fill in daily equipment shortage
2 – Coaches no assignment listed but suspect to cover coach demand on some route (maybe CHI – MSP)
6 --superliner sleepers to add one to each EB equipment set.
Footnote: The AMFLEET restoration is the next report but is so complicated that you need a spread sheet program as to where they are going. It appears that they will provide for about 10 additional train sets but assignments not specified.
2 – transition sleepers to meet daily shortage.
4 – lounges to fill out all SL trains.
1 – Sleeper to Auto Train to fill in for demand.
1 – Dinner to go to fll in for EB
This leaves no repairable Superliner Equipment for any expansion. The limiting factor is enough Dinning and Lounge cars for a certain number of equipment sets. Read the AMTRAK site!!!. Frankly I support longer trains as the demand appears on certain routes especially the Empire Builder. The main thing is to build more cars as locomotive shortages appear to be covered by the rebuilding of the P-40s.
Note: The AMFLEET overhauls are going to be allocated for NEC service with some food service cars returned. The long distance coaches allocated to other single level trains but haven’t figured it all out.
Thanks. Very clear picture of the cars to be repaired. Though I still wonder where all the Superliners went. Consists in 200
The need for additional Superliner cars is difficult to see. The average load factor for Superliner equipped trains during the first eight months of FY09 was 54.6 per cent. Moreover, the number of sleeping car passengers on these trains declined .85 per cent from FY08 to FY09 and 3.6 per cent from May FY08 vs. May FY09.
Undoubtedly there are days, especially during the summer months, as well as select holiday periods, when the load factor is higher, but obtaining additional equipment to meet these relatively few peak periods is probably not a good business decision. A better decision would be to use stimulus money to buy or upgrade corridor equipment.
Some further thoughts. For normal turns on the Empire Builder it takes 5 equipment sets. With 6 sleepers going to the EB maybe one will be a spare maybe in Seattle? The same could be said for the sleeper going to Auto train for maybe a spare in Lorton? I know the last time I looked in Sanford that they had several cars laying over in several maintenance bays after the normal departure.
Also I wonder if AMTRAK keeps an extra dinner and lounge in Sanford for back - up.
Could it be that a more reasonable spare car policy has taken some SL cars out of normal turns and onto spare capacity? At the different holiday rushes the NEC uses every spare car at that time and maybe the same can be said for SLs. A few years back I was on a couple different trains that had a BO car removed and no spare added but lately a sub has been available to be substituted. Also the proposed daily Texas Eagle extension to LA may have equipment already allocated for that service ( 1 or 2 trainsets? ).