As a third generation railroader I have to throw my support and agree with Wabash if the carrires have thier way we would lose our FMLA and pay in more for our insurance and lose most if not all of our benifits that we have fought to get and keep. I m sorry Mr Ash lost his job but and I know its a sad fact of life that these things happen but unlike most of you I am on call with the rairoad 24/7 so I go to work when ever the phone rings wether it it 2pm or 2am I live in a constant state of Jet Lag I have no set hours or shift and if you FRNS knew or understood this then this talk of a strike woukld make sense and you would be supporting the unions and not slamming them I have to go work there is a coal train going to Clunton Iowa with my name on it Be safe and Have a good day Larry
I was raised in a Union household and am proud of that fact. If you don’t like the protections that unions won for the working man like the 8-hour day, paid vacations, overtime provisions, etc.; consider working for Wal-Mart, Auchan, or other such anti-union firms.
it’s hard for some who have never worked for the RR to realize how different it is from most industry…because of the very nature of the danger involved, it’s not a question of “if” you will violate a safety rule, but “when”…depending on the severity of the infraction you could face termination or death/injury…it happens every day…factor in sometimes very unfavorable working conditions & relentless fatigue & the problems are compounded.sure, we have the government to keep a watchful eye on things…how’s that workin’ out? [:I] I’ll keep my union thank you very much, even though I know they have a shady history.some representation is better than none.
Will the last 22 posts on here, go back and read original question…I will assume I was only one that did…And ill repeat myself…You heard it here,SECOND time…NO AMTRAK STRIKE…[#offtopic] “ALWAYS PRACTICE SAFE EATING, USE YOUR CONDIMENTS”
why not have a poll?..“Will Amtrak Strike” yes/no …I have no idea personally, but I am always quick to respond to those that have very little idea of what it takes to do my job when they make statements like " they should get rid of the unions…if the employees don’t like it, let them quit & find another job"…people like that should have to “walk a mile in our shoes” they wouldn’t be so high & mighty after about 6 months of trying to live a railroader’s life. [soapbox]
I don’t mean to doubt what you say, but do you have proof as to your statement?
If you are a fan of the ends-justify-the-means philosophy, by all means be proud, but I for one cannot put my support behind a system that is so tyrannical. I know of more than one working man that was driven to death because of unions. One had serious medical conditions and could not afford to strike for a third time in 2 years, even with his wife and kids working. He was shunned and harrased until the day he died from that cancer. You can always say that so-and-so did great things because look at what we have now, but one should never forget the evils that were commited to produce it. Just because someone may disagree with union philosophy doesn’t neccessarily mean they hate the working man.
I hope that the Amtrak employees are properly compensated and work in a safe, comfortable environment. I’ll trust the government to make it so.
Wow there’s a lot of hot air in here…
For those of you who hate the thought of unions - they aren’t 100% bad 100% of the time. My trade union has provided me with a top notch education on how to do my job safely and efficiently. Yes I pay dues, but they help fund the apprenticeship program which I feel is second to none. I’m actually mighty proud of it. Unions have won some pretty stadard labor issues that we take for granted today - 8 hour day, overtime, holidays, etc. 100 years ago these were not normal characteristics of our labor force, and we have unions to thank for this. They also provide a good avenue for collective bargaining - one entity is answering for all the employees in the local - this isn’t always a bad thing. I am sure that railroad unions provide some level of protection to employees that are trying to do their jobs and go home every night - I know they do for elecrical construction workers.
One the other hand, there are those who adhere to the union the way one might subscribe to a religion. Unions can and do get too powerful for their own good. Collective bargaining works best when the employers and the employees come to the table on an equal footing. If one has more power than the other, the industry suffers (the brewery industry in Milwaukee is a prime example, or even the automotive industry today). Unions do not realize that they can gain enough power that they become the exploitive entity that they claim to be against. There are also serious corruption problems in some unions. Typically, these are the unions that are so powerful they worry less about collective bargaining and more about padding their own pockets at the expense of the membership - thus exploiting the very people they claim to want to protect.
In Amtrak’s case (at least the food service employees I’ve talked to on Empire Builder) the employees are paid very well for what they do.&nbs
I am soooo happy to get this news. I am sure that union leaders, Amtrak management, Amtrak rank and file, The White House, US Congressmen and thousands of travelers who don’t want their plans upset are just as relieved as I am. We can all sleep so much better knowing that there will be no strike.[:-^]
There are good and bad aspects of unions.
The fact however, remains that unions created the middle class, and continue to support a healthy American economy.
Unions can and do sometimes protect bad/lazy/incompetent employees.
But where unions exel is in the fact that they create a more equitable distribution of money. America’s economy is fueled by consumer spending, if employees don’t have money to spend, the industries, retail first (Wal-Mart, Target) will feel the pinch. This will eventually find its way to reduced levels of traffic and profit for railroads. I find it Ironic that Wal-Mart actually benefits from unionization in this manner. By doing this unions are playing a small part in the battle against corporate greed.
Unions also promote a more experienced and professional workforce. If you were to quit every job just because something made you unhappy about the job, you wouldn’t develop the skills that sometimes need years to hone. Just think of the condition of the railroads if they had the turnover of Mcdonalds. The skills needed to run a 15000ton or 8000ft train are not learned in a 2 day class.
Some Amtrak workers have been without a contract since the year 2000
Kudos to Rigel for the correct assessment of unions.
For the record, unions are at their worst when they collude (in secret, of course) with management. The government, remember, does allow for member recourse against such unions, whereupon such unions can be charged with (and convicted of) failure to represent. However, this requires, to be effective, members to form a sort of “union within a union”, which really should not be.
The government, though, has taken an active role in the interference with business practices throughout the years. Allowing businesses to outsource to other countries without punishment has severely undermined not only the middle class in this country but also our national security (by making us dependent upon other countries for raw materials related to defense and infrastructure, among many other things) and has turned this economy from a producer into a consumer, which is the ultimate expression of “false economy”.
Bring to the board real evidance that what you say is true. I have not heard any word if there is or is not going to be a strike, they can go on strike and there is always a presidential order that could sugest they stay at work, if you strike you strike let them sign all them orders they want how they going to arrest all of us. there is no jail big enough to hold us all. then let us go one step farther who gonna run them trains if we all in jail. I dont think there be a strike either but i think the engineers over there should get some better benifits.
[:)] I guess I won’t sell my Amtrak stock after all![:P]
I do not know if it will come to a strike or not, but disagree with Jeaton’s expectation that congress will step in. To the best of my knowledge there has never been an Amtrak only stirke. Most recent rail (freight and passenger) have been “settled” by congress. The most important exception being the N&W strike which went for most of 90 days before Carter intervened to save the union’s bacon.
A passenger strike would do yery little damage to the economy so congress should have very little interest in intervening and even if they did Bush might have the courage to veto it. I don’t expect congress to do anything and that thought should be weighing on union leadership.
Mac
Something really important seems to be overlooked in all of the responses - if there is an AMTK only strike, AMTK is “ashes to ashes, AMTK to rust”. The only parts to survive will be those that are funded by local and/or state governments and have hired AMTK to operate their service - such as CalTrans. Almost - in not everything else - will be gone. Some will get revived by locals putting up their money for the service desired, but that will take some time. Those who desire AMTK to disappear will have succeeded byond their wildest expectations.
Even" The Shrub" will not shut down Amtrak over something as silly as wages.
Employees and passengers are voters , and its getting to close to presidential election.
Using these scare tactics with industries may work, your work will just go to India Or Pakistan, but It would not wash with a semi Government company like Amtrak.
It might be useful here if someone would summarize the final positions/offers of both the unions and Amtrak, or a summary of the differences between them. I don’t think a lot of us understand precisely what the differences are.
Personally, I have doubts that the current Congress and Administration can come to enough of a consensus to impose a legislative settlement.
[(-D]
Well said!
Pro Union, Anti Union: scrambled or sunny side up. Personal preference, I guess. Anyway, has there been any new news on the strike(or no strike)?
http://www.progressiverailroading.com/freightnews/article.asp?id=11997
It seems that it is still in limbo. January 30th is the deadline when I guess a strike becomes a legal option. Based on what I read, they are looking for ~35% retroactive increase in wages back to 2000. It will be interesting to see where this money comes from, because we are talking about $4 billion in retroactive pay, not to mention what they would need to pay from here on. With only about $3 billion in revenue and government funds per year, I can see where Amtrak official may be reluctant to give in.