Hello everyone! I am working on a layout based on the piggyback operations of the 50’s. Most of my rolling stock consist of the Athearn 50’ flat cars with 2 25’ trailers(been on a Ebay buying spree) while I like the way they look when consisting one after another, there are some things that bug me about them. 1. When put with other equipment from the same era from other manufactures, they look unscale like. 2. The scale measurements are not accurate. 3. Most of the trailers I remember seeing at that lenght had a single axle, not a tamdem. The first problem with the Athearn 25’ trailers is that there is no king pin, but that fix will come later as other issues need to be resolved first.I like the look of the single axle tractors vs. the tamdem axle tractors of that era.I am doing a freelance phanasty layout, so not everything is going to be prototypical. I am still learning how to do certain things in this hobby, so please bare with me. The stock landing gear seems to be to far foward to attach to a tractor if they had a kingpin, also if you place them on a flat surface, the stock landing gear is to short . The front of the trailers seem like they sit lower then the rear does. I replaced the stock landing gear with the short landing gear from some CMW trailers I had. Need to use a # 54 bit to driil some mounting holes for the CMW to work and also need to cut the ends off of the CMW gear to properly seat in the athearn trailer. I will post pics soon. To remove one of the axles, I pulled the wheels apart and nipped the axle holder with a pair of nips( wont notice the uneven cut unless you are a HO scale mechanic.
Sorry, buy I forgot to mention that this mod only works if the trailers are going to be free standing, the CMW landing gear is to wide to sit on the 50’ flat cars the trailers came with.
Some things sound real fishy to me any way…For one, never saw a 25ft trailer in piggyback service with tandems,32ft,38ft,yes,legs being too wide,no…50ft,flat cars,no,Born 1943,Chgo,seen all types of trucks…I think they were supposed to represent,two 20 footers,single axle on a flat car. Southern Pacific had them and Wabash,had 32 footers,one on a flat car trailers were tandem axles.
Cheers,
Frank
Actually, I meant that they are to wide to fit in the tray the stock landing gear sits in. You will need to shave some plastic of the tray for them to fit.
Found an interesting video about the PRR piggyback trains.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_embedded&v=Id6WSO9lT5A
Here is a pic.
The trailer on the left sits to low with the stock landing gear. The trailer on the rights sit level with the short landing gear from a CMW trailer.
I believe Athearn had a lot of stock,of trailers and flat cars laying dormant and decided to come up with something that they can sell,for those are not proto ,accurate…The railroads found out early on,that having the landing gear rest on the floor of the flat car,would not work well,too much forces going in two directions,when the car would sway,so they let the hitch do the work,of holding the trailer and raised the legs so they would not touch the floor… Being done that way today,a Intermodal crane lifts the trailer on the flat car moves forward so the kingpin locks in the trailer hitch and lowers the wheels to the car and then a ground man raises the legs so they don’t touch the floor…The old way was to drive the trailer on the flat car and two men would crank the hitch up to the kingpin,work intensive and dangerous,The railroads actually got that idea from the Circus Trains of old.the railroads just perfected the idea…Older 85ft flat cars have those hitches and they are called,Circus Hitches…They also found out that the grooves in the floor,were a waste of time…I was a Intermodal crane operator for CSX railroad,Bedford Park IL.
Cheers,
Frank
f
Thanks!! it’s my intention to by some standard flat cars and buy the detail parts to convert them to TOFC operation.
Soilwork,
I too model 50’s piggyback and use the Athearn flat cars with the 25’ vans. You may want to learn about my modifications before you do much more.
First, the trailers. You do not have to replace the landing gear. You can actually move the original landing gear rearward to the next rib location on the trailer.
Yes, most 25’ trailers had single axles, so I cut off the forward set just like you have. I take one of the left over tires and glue it to the bottom of the trailer - spare tires were common on trailers in the 50’s.
The flat car. I actually cut apart the Athearn “rub rail” piece leaving only the two side rails, then I glue them in place. Also, most cars of that type used a stake in the the stake pocket near the bridge plate to secure the bridge plate in the upright position with a chain - I add those stakes with Athearn factory stakes from their regular flat car kits.
I also add bridge plates, usually from Athearn 85’ cars. Athearn use to sell those parts packets seperately, not sure if they still do.
Not the best photos but here are a few of my cars:
Since early piggybacks did not use hitches, I use the left over tires with the axle end as a simulated fifth wheel jack - not exactly like the prototype, but looks OK.
I have built about 70 of these, some fro
A crankable hitch on a TOFC? <Monty Python “Four Yorkshireman” Skit voice>LUXURY!
THIS is the true old skool trailer securing fashion, so chop down that trailer tandem axle to one axle, get out your scale chain, jacks, cross-brace, and wheel chocks, and detail away!
Frank,
True, Athearn did not attempt to accurately model the attachment of the trailer, they just made a rub rail piece that would allow it to sit there. But I assure you it had nothing to do with “left over” anything. Athearn first offered those cars as a “yelow box” kit in the late 50’s. The current RTR item is exactly the same as those kits - but with better paint jobs.
Sheldon
Yes,Sheldon,I knew,Ive had quite a few and still do from the 50’s,The remark I made,was a pun,should not have made it,but what the heck…
Cheers,
Frank
Thanks!! I would of never thought of using the tires from the removed axles as spare tires for the trailers[tup] Thanks Sheldon for your post, the only problem I have is securing the trailers down to the flat cars, because I want to be able to move them on and off when I run a operations session. I think that eventually I would like to try adding a kingpin to them and get some kind of fifth wheel atachment. I am in the experiment stages right now. I ordered a couple of books on piggyback and intermodal operations from Ebay which will help me out .
Yes, Athearn got the single axle/dual axle thing wrong - easy fix with a saw.
That’s funny, I have all sorts of photos of 25’ and 26’ vans - B&O, C&NW, Southern Pacific, etc, etc, etc. Yes, most were single axle, especially the railroad owned ones, but I have photos of a few with tandems.
As well as lots of 32’ and 35’ vans on 40’ flats, 50’ flats and 53’-6" flats.
My father was a terminal manager for Carolina and before that a piggy back supervisor for the Southern RR - I grew up with trucks and piggy back.
After hundreds of hours of research, I have the early piggy back thing pretty well documented.
Lackawanna built 40’ flats with sliding bridge plates for their 32’ vans. B&O took old 40’ and 50’ box car frames and built many of their early piggyback cars. And of course many railroads converted the common GSC 53’-6" flat to piggyback service.
Then the PRR and the Wabash bought the 75’ cars from Beth Steel - and the long flat car revolution began.
But that is were I stop - its is fall of 1954 on my railroad andf the first few of those have just been delivered.
Sheldon
Well Frank it is hard to know when people are joking around when one is just reading.
Sheldon
I thought about being able to remove them, but decided my imagination can do that. I just shift them into the piggy back yard and pretend they get unloaded and reloaded - I have a few empties here and there for effect.
Sheldon
Sheldon,
Yes I can relate to trucks,when I was young more so than trains,also rode in many,my Dad,and two of my uncle’s were truck drivers …Do you recall ever hearing about a truck,called a ‘‘LaMoone’’ to name one of others,even rode in a solid rubber tire,chain drive ‘‘Mack’’ with a planetary trans,always grinding,if you will…
Will never forget those days…
Cheers,
Frank
I was always facinated with trucks and trains when I was a kid. I was born in 72, so much of the equipment that was used in the 50’s was obsolete by then, but I still seen some of those trailers being used as storage units in lots here and there.
Soilwork
Great thread! I just learned how to make my piggyback trailers and flats look much more realistic. The Athearn trailers never looked quite right to me but I hadn’t recognized why they looked too “heavy duty”. Cutting off the forward axle had never occurred to me.[D)]
Sheldon, the spare tires and bridge plates are excellent ideas.
Thanks!
Dave
Soilwork, an interesting thread, I hope you don’t mind if I hijack it.[:-^]
(1) Could a Southern Pacific Flat with SP trailers be found on , for instance, the (1950s)"Boston & Maine ??
(2) In the 1950s, could, for instance, a Southern Pacific piggyback trailer be found on another railroads flat ??
Thanks, the Bear.
Bear,
I would venture to say,that you have to remember,that,piggyback was relatively new in the 50’s,so I would guess,that anything was possible,I recall BAR piggybacks,they were not all pig trains they were mixed with freights…So based on my visual experience,I would say yes to both your questions,My thought Only…
Cheers,
Frank
Bear, Yes and no.
Some railroads quickly ventured into interchange operations with their piggy backs, other kept them mainly in captive service on their lines at first…
As Frank points out, most would not be solid trains of piggy backs, they were more generally just mixed in with other freight - BUT - as demand for the service increased, it was common to see them grouped together at the head end of a freight train so they could be easily switched to the unloading/loading ramps.
You used SP in your example. At first those were in captive service north/south on the CA coast. And while mixed with other freight, you would likely have seem pretty large blocks of them in a single train.
Mixing of one railroads flats with other railroads trailers did not happen at first - that took a while, but the carring of trucking company trailers was common early on on many, but not all, railroads.
I have given you a “general” over view, there are long detailed specific histories for each railroad that had early piggy backs.
In my modeling I do stretch some of the history to allow running most all the roadnames that had piggybacks, but I do tend to keep trailers in captive service with their railroad as that was more typical in the early days.
Keep in mind that in many cases, including the SP, these vans and flat cars were used t