I have a Bachman Spectrum 4-6-0 DCC/Soundvalue (52" drivers). It has an intermittant problem where it looses electrical contact on turnouts. The wheelbase of the locomotive is longer than the dead part of the frog, plus the tender wheels pick up power.
2 questions
Does anyone have any idea about what could be wrong?
Has anyone disassembled these? I could not find disassembly instructions, just the exploded parts diagram.
Thanks
Are you sure that it picks up power on all axles and tender? Turn it upside down and give each axle power in turn and the the front and rear tender trucks.
There are wheel wipers on all 4 tender axles, and wheel wipers on all 6 drive wheels. A continuity test would then seem to be the first course of action, to determine if power is indeed getting from the wheels to the decoder.
Edit: It appears that the rear tender truck is not picking up power reliably. The wipers do not maintain good contact with the axles or the bolster.
When your tracks are on good condition, clean, and reasonably well laid, and if metering shows the power to be consistent and robust, the problem has to be the locomotive/tender. There is a wiper not making contact (or more than one if it’s an older engine with lots of use), a solder or wire has parted and makes intermittent contact, or a tether has a defect if there is one between the two components of locomotion on a steamer with tender.
Is your 4-6-0 N Scale? Sometimes I find the wheel whipers on Bachmann tenders don’t always make good contact with the bronze strips inside the tender. Another part of the problem is power collected by the drivers flows through the tender drawbar to the wipers on the lead tender truck, where it flows into the bronze contacts, then the decoder and back to the locomotive.
If the lead tender truck isn’t making good contact with the strips in the tender, you’ll lose all the current supplied by the drivers. One solution I’ve come up with is to hardwire the pickup wipers to the bronze contacts. This eliminates a lot of those unreliable middle men.
Hope this helps.
Power your frogs…problem solved. If you don’t want to power the frogs then consider keep alive.
HO scale 4-6-0
Powering frogs does not fix the actual problem. When the locomotive crosses a frog, it only ever has 1 set of drive wheels (out of 3) contacting a non-powered section of track. Additionally there are power pickups on the tender. Secondly why spend a lot of money and time powering every single Insulfrog turnout on my layout, when every other locomotive runs across them without any problems (including the Bachmann 44 tonner and 4-4-0)?
Using the continuity setting on my multimeter, I have determined that the rear tender truck power pickup wiper (say that 10 times quickly) does not make good contact with the wheels at all times. Addtionally it is loose under the screw.
New problem. I attempted to remove the screw and it just spins in its hole without coming out. Is there a nut on the back that is not locked in place? Edit: yes there is! Bachmann, why do you hate your customers?
Also the center drive wheel on the engineer’s (right) side of the locomotive has intermittant continuity. Why? I cant figure out, unless the wiper is stuck to the side of the frame with grease from the factory. This aggrivates the above problem with the rear tender truck.
Note:
Continuity was checked from wheels to the red/black 2 wire plug between locomotive and tender. This, I assume, is the power collecting circuit for the decoder. The exploded parts diagram was not clear on this.
Ok…I gave you the correct answer. Either power the frogs or add keep alive circuits to get better operation. Anything less is a bandage…
Can’t power Peco i sulfurous, there’s nothing to power.
are you sure it is losing power and not actually momentarily shorting where the two closure rails come together with the in sliver of plastic insulating them? This seems to be a fairly common problem with Peco Insulfrogs. Make sure all wheels are properly in gauge.
–Randy
If the wiper isn’t making good contact, simply remove it and re-bend it to correct the problem.
And yes, the screws holding the tender trucks in place have a nut on their upper ends. You’ll need to remove the tender shell to gain access. There’s a screw through the tender floor near the front truck which needs to be removed first (no nut involved there, other than the one operating the screwdriver [:P] ). Next, lift the front of the tender shell from the floor, and carefully disengage the two tabs at the rear of the shell from the two slots in the tender’s floor.
I suspect that the nut has worked its way right off the screw, which means that the electrical contact which is normally secured beneath it is loose, resulting in only intermittent continuity.
Bachmann tender trucks pick-up current from alternate sides - left rail on one truck and right rail on the other - this is not always a standard pattern, though, which is why some locos will sometimes not work with a tender from a similar Bachmann loco. Make sure, when re-tightening that screw/nut that the truck is properly oriented.
Wayne
If it is the frogs, you are out of luck because, as Randy says, you cannot power them since Peco Insulfrogs are plastic.
If it is the tender that is at fault, you are out of luck because Bachmann likely won’t repair it and the chances of replacing it with another Spectrum 4-6-0 are next to nill if that Bachmann loco is sold out.
You may wind up having to dump the Bachmann Spectrum 4-6-0.
Rich
I had a simialr problem with a Bachmann 4-6-0 on Peco Code 83 nsulfrog turnouts. I found that a short occurred at the frog. The wheels on the engine would bridge the the frog rails where they come to a point. I filed this gap wider. A simpler solution would be to paint with nail polish or other insulating material. I chose to file because I wanted a permanent fix.
One thing I was told but never tried. If you have another sound loco in the area and it looses sound momentarily when the engine crosses the turnout then its almost definitely a short across the turnout.
I have some HO Bachmann 4-6-0’s. There is a nut inside that holds a tab with a wire that goes to the decoder PC board.
The pickups can easily be adjusted.
I converted my tender trucks for all wheel pickup on both sides. The trucks only pick up on one side.
A picture is worth a thousand words. I found Harold’s link in the Bachmann forums.
If you have more Bachmann products, it would be worth it to join the forums. Different forums for different scales. All kinds of Bachmann documentation there and couple Bachmann reps.
http://www.55n3.org/cars/tender_wipers/
http://www.bachmanntrains.com/home-usa/board/index.php?PHPSESSID=14f37dtedd2f7d8tnn892rp586&
Rich
Its definitely the power pickup on the tender. If it where the frogs the Bachmann Spectrum 4-4-0 would have the same problem or worse. And since I have the Peco Insulfrog turnouts wired up so that Left rail/Right rail are soldered to their respective partner on the diverging route, and feeders on all 3 ends of each turnout, I seriously doubt that the 5/8" of dead track is causing a problem. As to the insulfrog shorting issue: the only problem I have are my LL Proto 2000 E7As and some passenger cars are momentarily sparking on the opposite route on a Peco small radius (24") Wye, Problem was corrected with application of some black, followed by nutmeg (rail brown) craft paint. <–Now that is a bandage on the problem! I will have to treat that one like an electrofrog.
I’ve tried making those wheel wiper pickups before, managed to destroy the spring.
I emailed both the parts and service department for information on disassembly. Parts department told me I would have to contact a service tech (expected). The service department manager sent me a link to the exploded parts diagram…[banghead], which I had stated in my initial email was not helpful. She also sent me info on how to send it in for waranty repairs.
I found the 2 clips on the back of the tender that are holding the shell on. Does anyone know what is holding front in place?
I also determined that not all of the feeders on the turnout ladder are currently connected, but power is being fed via soldered rail joiners and wires that short same side rails together, per the Peco recommendations. Addtionally the 4-4-0 Spectrum locomotive runs smoothly across the turnout ladder, convincing me that there is a problem with the locomotive or tender power pick up, not the track work.
Further news. I now have a problem with another Bachmann locomotive. This one is a 2-8-0 DCC/Sound model. It wont run 1 foot with out stalling on clean track. I cleaned the wheels and noticed the wipers for power pickup on the Locomotive have dust on them. I removed and cleaned them, but I am finding it difficult to re-assemble the wiper piece with out bending it. Anyone have any tips or tricks.
Edit: The 2-8-0 is working; however, I did end up breaking the tip of one of the wipers.
Is this the typical Spectrum power pick up arrangement which is a copper sheet with fingers extending down behind the driver wheels?
If so, that is the worst possible design. I ruined a 4-8-2 a few years back when the fingers got tangled up and the loco essentially lost power. I sent it in to Bachmann and they said that they no longer had replacement parts.
Rich
Rich,
Yes I think you have the idea. Its almost impossible to get them back behind (inside) the drivers and the quartering correct without getting one of the fingers jammed through the wheel spokes. I really like the power pick up and mechanisim on the Athearn Mikes. No issues there with little sprung brass parts.
Andrew
Just saw this post, did not read all the replies. But as the owner of about 35 Bachmann steamers, including two of the 4-6-0, here are a few thoughts.
Make sure there is plenty of tension on the tender wipers and that those surfaces are clean. Add weight to the tender - it improves tracking and electrical pickup - about two more ounces is good.
That loco can be tricky to disassemble/re-assemble, but your problems are likely intermittent tender pickup because of its light weight asnd floating truck wiper design - the weight should fix it.
I find that most all Bachmann tenders, and many other brands, benefit from extra weight, both in tracking and electrical pickup.
The driver wipers work fine until you screw them up - then call Bachmann and order a new wiper plate assembly for the engine. Personally, as mentioned, I have a bunch of them, and have only had problems with the wipers on one loco.
Sheldon
Low blow, Sheldon. I never laid my hands on those driver wheel pickups on my 4-8-2. They were constantly getting tangled inside the driver wheels, bending and breaking. You need to accept the fact that the design was very poor. Blame Bachmann, not your fellow modelers.
Rich