Well the long wait for my dream is coming to an end and the benchwork is going to start next week. Cleaning my area in my space this weekend and cant wait to start building.
I am planning on building my benchwork out of 2x4’s and plywood. I plan on having 16" centers for support to have more to screw down the plywood to it. My questions are: would regular straight construction 2x4s work? Also what type of plywood do I need to use? I know OSB is out but not for sure what to use. I was planning on using 1/2" since my area is in a controlled environment. I will be using regular wood screws.
On my wiring I have a Prodigy Advanced 2 Squared with 3 amp of power. My run would be less than 60 ft with feeders off of that. I was looking at either 12 or 14 gauge for the main bus. My question should I use solid or braided for my main bus wiring and then 16 gauge speaker wire for my feeders? Also what would be a good way to connect the feeders to the main bus with? If it were braided then I was thinking of using the suitcase connectors but if it is solid then I am not sure what to use. Also for the time being I will only be running maybe 4 loco’s at 1 time but mostly 2 at a time. So I think that should be plenty of power to operate my layout for now. I do not have any reversing loops on my layout so I dont need a reverser, but would I need some sort of circuit breaker or will the one in the controller be good enough? I also just plan on powering this as 1 district for now. Is that a good idea?
Also what is a good solder to use when soldering feeders to the track. I would rather use something that has the flux in the solder so I am not making messes with the flux. Also where would be a good place to get solder. I stopped at Menards for a short period of time but didnt see any next to the soldering Irons.
Thanks and if anyone has any other advice other than what I am asking please feel free to post it. I am soaking up as much as I can.
For 60 foot distances (120 feet of wire) use #12 wire. If you can, locate the base unit more to the middle to keep those runs short. I prefer standed wire for the heavy bus as it is easier to work with, solid wire that heavy isn’t the least bit flexible.
#16 is too heavy for the feedrs. #20 is good for HO. You cna get spools of red and white #20 at Home Depot, ist’s sold as alarm wire. And you can get spools of #12 in matching red and white, so there is no issue which feeder goes to which bus wire.
Get a good stripper like the Ideal Stripmaster and just solder the feeder to bus joints with a soldering gun - get a 100-200 watt gun for this sort of thing. It’s not hard and since htey don;t make suitcase conenctors for attaching #20 to #12, it ends up being easier. I saw the MR article with the silly use of double suitcase connectors for every feeder - what a waste. One drop from #12 to an intermediate size, then the next size suitecase to connect the medium size wire to the feeder. By the time you make the short pieces of intermediate wire and properly crimp on 4 suitcase connectors everywhere there is a feeder pair, I can solder them. And soldering is cheaper.
For solderign feeders, a 40-45 watt iron is good - ir better a soldering station rated at about 45 watts - plain soldering irons just keep heating as long as they are plugged in and that leads to shorter tip life. A clean shiny tip is the key. Here’s where I’ll get a lot of naysayers - I don;t sodler ANY feeders to the track, instead I make EVERY rail joiner a feeder - do NOT buy the Atlas ones, just solder feeder wires to joiners and keep a supply on ahand as you lay track. The naysayers will tell you joiners loose contact after a while. I’ve PAINTED my track and NOT skipped the joiners and have had NO problems. The paint definitely wicks in, but it does not interrupt a solid mechanical joint, not enough to matter.
Solder you can get at Radio Shack. Get the biggest spool of .032 diameter - the
2x4’s will work, you just have to use longer screws. Personally, I use 1x4’s except where 2 pieces of plywood meet, then I use 2x4’s. Make sure the 2x4’s are straight and be prepared for some to warp.
I use 1/2" BC plywood (pine, birch would work but it usually costs more). I would prefer AB or even BB, but my local store doesn’t carry it. Do not use CDX or any D grade. Do not use sheathing. I would also not use CC, but that’s not usually a choice.
I last used 12 gauge solid bus wires with 18 gauge solid wire feeders with 3M suitcase connectors. This might be overkill, but I had it on hand.
I get my rosin core solder at Radio Shack, the smallest diameter they sell.
I thought about using 1x’s but the more I thought about it, the 1x’s may split when I screwed the plywood on top even if I pre-drilled the holes. Did you use 1x4’s on your legs also? If you have some pics could you post them so I could get a look at what you did?
The last thing I want is to have my layout start warping. It will be in a basement with heat in the winter and de-humidifiers in the summer. Humidity will only get to about 50% in the summer since we have 2 de-humidifiers running. As far as temp it pretty much stays the same.
Just not for sure what direction to go with my bench work.
Thanks for the reply. I plan on putting my controller in the middle of the layout that way I have only 30’ runs going both ways. Thanks for the tips on what kind of wire to use and what type of solder to use.
Now if I could make a decision on how to build my bench work for the layout.
I was hesitant on using the 1 x 4’s on my layout, being addicted to 2 x 4’s for almost everything I build. You should see my workbench - it would hold an elephant. But I went with the 1 x 4’s on the layout construction and three years later everything is great. Just be sure to properly pre-drill for your screws or you will increase the risk of splitting.
Sometimes things still split, but since all permanent joints on my layout are glued and screwed, it hasn’t been problem. Deck screws are probably a tad too big, even with predrilled holes, for 1x lumber, but the alternative would be to use much more expensive wood screws. I can live with some splitting here and there, it hasn’t seemed to have the slighest effect on the rigidity of my benchwork.
Do you have any pics of your bench work so I could look at them to see how you did it. Some people have told me that the 1x’s would warp more and quicker than the 2x4’s. Also had people tell me to rip 3/4" plywood into 3 1/2" strips and do it that way. This layout is going into my basement and I live in IL so during the summer humidity is high but I run a dehumidifier during the summer set at 50% or less and it feels dry then.
A 1" thick board will warp if you place is with the broad side up, so it is only 1" deep. If you place it the other way, it will not bend across the 4" direction.
Another simple way of making sturdy benchwork that also is easy to fasten to various things is ye olde L-girder technique:
Or you make a “ladder” of crossmembers between the 1x3" or 1x4"s - that will also prevent warping:
Or you can make a lattice of thinner and more lightweight wood, engineered to be stronger by the judicious use of L and T profiles:
Lots of ways doing things without building the layout to be used as deck for a grown man to walk on
I’m not up on how to post pictures here yet, but I’ll get there.
Mine looks much like the “ladder” picture that stein posted. 1 x 4’s around the perimeter of the boards (1/2" ply), and cross members of 1 x 4’s spaced every 2 feet. Everything is glued and screwed, using #10 x 1 3/4 galvanized flat head screws.
I wouldn’t be too concerned about the warping. Start out with a good flat sheet, and use the straightest 1x’s you can find ( I’ll go through the whole stack if I have to, just to find three or four straight ones). Everything will work together once it’s assembled to prevent warping.
I’m building our layout in 8ft modules, keeping in mind that at some point we’ll be moving from this house and I want to minimize the “destruction”. The initial 4 x 8 is kind of heavy, but still very portable. Our “expansion” modules are 30" wide at the most, and by comparison, came out very lightweight and portable. The legwork consists of 2 x 2’s in the corners, crossbraced with 1 x 3’s. These are attached with 1/4" carriage bolts so they can be removed for moving day. It’s alot of extra work right now, but it will payoff in the future.
I would vote for the 1x4 with 2x2 legs. Actually the 1x4 is glued to a 1x2 to form an L girder which is very strong and stable. I have attached a photo of part of my layout with construction features noted. I used open grid with double 1/2" plywood sub-roadbed. It was easier for me to cut the 1/2" ply on my bandsaw and make overlap joints with the two layers. Very solid and easy to build. There are some good books out on benchwork construction and layout wiring. Good luck on your layout. Post some progress pics when you can.
Wow thanks for all the reply’s, pics, and info. My head is spinning now on what to do.[:)] I think I am putting more thought in this than I need to.
Here is my situation, this is going to be in my basement that is unfinished and may have a temp swing of maybe 10* from winter to summer. The humidity is obviously higher in the summer than winter but we have our dehumidifier set to 50% to help control it. I am leery of using 1x’s because of possible of to much warping.
Here are some dimensions of my layout. It is going to be 18x10 with a finger going into the middle that is 2ft wide by 6ft long. I plan on building the sections no longer than 8ft, that way I can take it apart and then move it if necessary. The widest part of the layout will be 40" wide (accessible from both sides) and the other parts will be 30". This is being modeled in the midwest so the layout will be mostly flat.
What if I were to make my bench work out of 1x4’s and 2x3’s? I would use the 1x4’s for the box part of my layout on 16" or 20" centers for support and then use the 2x3’s for leg supports. Then I would screw my plywood on top of that. Would it be wise to screw the plywood into the 1x4’s that are on end? Everything would be glued and screwed, so would this possibly cut down in any warping? I know I will probably have some so just trying to keep it to a minimum.
There’s been quite a few recent threads on benchwork - you might want to look at some of the other threads and the books on model railroad benchwork for discussions of alternatives.
I guess since Linn Westcott brainwashed me back in the '60s, I’ve never understood the fascination with solid top layouts, and fastening from above. But that’s because I tend to let my choice of alternative methods be driven by the end goal. My goal is a layout with track at various elevations and rather hilly or mountainous scenery. A flat top is not the easiest way to the end goal.
Similarly, my layouts, although small, are constantly changing and evolving. The last thing I want to do is put screws where they will be hidden by scenery, or use nails and glue where not necessary. I want to be able to make my changes without destroying the existing layout, track, and scenery. So screws go up from below. L-girders (1x4 and 1x2), even on the joists (1x2 and 1x2), make screwing through the girder flanges a trivial task. And the gluing of the L-girder joint does a lot to prevent warping, especially in the thin, dry Colorado air, where wood can take amazing free-form shapes.
Others will choose different methods, either for good reasons or no reason.
Fred I can see where you are coming from as far as just a solid top layout. Here in Illinois where I live it is about as flat as land can be. It isnt uncommon to be able to have visibility at 15-20 miles or more, it is just flat. That is what I plan to model my layout after. I live in an agriculture area and that is what I plan to model also.
I am sure I will add some foam and stuff to make some of the terrain hilly, that is what we call it in IL [(-D], to give it some detail but I am also having a 5 and 4 year old helping me. So just trying to keep things simple for now for them and also for me being out of the hobby for more than 25 years.
I prefer to use 1/2" hardwood plywood for all of my framing construction. Yes, its more expensive than cheaper grades of plywood but has a much better finish on both sides and few, if any, voids between the plies. I rip the plywood into strips about 3 to 4 inches wide depending on the span length I’m planning. Then I assemble the strips into an open grid structure using glue and 18 gauge wire brads. If extra strength is needed at the glue joints, cut up a 2 by 2 into gluing blocks you can position inside each glue joint. My current layout benchwork is a combination of cantilevers off the walls and spans between the walls. One section of the layout spans 13 feet with no supports beyond the cantilevers off the walls at 16 inches on center (to match the wall studs) and the span strength of the front fascia made of two layers of 1/2" plywood four inches deep. The real secret to benchwork strength is in the glue, not the fasteners. A proper glue joint is always stronger than the wood itself. If the glue joint is properly clamped, screwed or pinned together while it cures, you will not be able to spearate the joint again without tearing apart the wood. This is true even if you use plain old Elmer’s white glue. Benchwork assembled with glue will be far stronger and far more rigid than any benchwork assembled with fasteners alone.
I use the older MRC Prodigy Advance DCC system on my layout. It seems to do everything I need it to do although I am looking to upgrade with the wireless conversion setup. I’m using 14 awg stranded wire for my bus since no run from the command unit is more than 25 feet long. I’m also using 24 awg solid telephone wire for the rail feeders. This is actually more than adequate when feeders are connected to every length of rail and kept to no more than a few inches in length. My layout is of a small short line that wouldn’t normally run loco consists so the electrica
