iam modeling railroad in the 1800s. and i was wondering how many cows could fit in a cattle car. and how fast a tipacule steam engine in that era could run. also how offten did tyey stop for water. yhank you and sorry for the spelling.
I assume you are talking 1880s and 1890s, and not earlier. Earlier than 1880 would see much more variety in car design.
Car capacities were generally limited to 20-25 tons in that era, which includes the car weight. Net load would be half that figure because of the weight of the bare car. I don’t know what cattle weigh, but the load gives you a starting point.
From a space perspective, the longest stock cars of the day would be 36ft. More typical would be 28ft or 32ft, although size grew as time went on. The art of car design would be to arrive at size and weight limitations at the same time. Of course, the size vs weight carried would vary with the animal.
Watering, feeding, and resting of livestock was not regulated until after 1900, IIRC. The initial regs were set at 28 hours between stops, so this was probably an outside guideline maximum with some railroads before regulation was imposed. Shippers were required to provide “drovers” to handle the livestock at the stops and load/unload points. These men could be carried in a passenger car or in the caboose, depending on numbers.
A great place to begin learning about 19th Century railroading are the Yahoo Early Rail and Civil War RRs Groups (http://groups.yahoo.com/group/EarlyRail/ and http://groups.yahoo.com/group/Civil_War_RRs/). Both are highly worth joining. White’s book on freight cars is another outstanding resource.
my thoughts, your choices
Fred W
Take a 36 foot cattle car. Figure a cow is at LEAST 6 feet long. That allows 6 cows head to tail down the length of the car. Pack 'em in tight, double up the cows, so you have two lines of cows side by side. That gets 12 cows into a 36 foot car. Actually I hink you need more than 6 foot per cow. So probably something less than a round dozen cows.
Typical speed of steam trains in the 19th century was maybe 30 mph. Passenger trains might go faster. But on good track, a new steam engine could do 100 mph by say 1900. And the occasional hogger would check this out, the urge to see how fast she would go must have been just as strong in the 19th century as it is today. But freights usually did 25-30, and only the best express trains got up to 45 or 50.
Who many animals will fit in a stock car? Depends on the size of the animals. Calves and yearlings mean a lot more animals in the car before it’s full. And full is how they want stock cars loaded. When the cattle are packed in, they are less likely to fall. Can’t overdo it either, but make sure they’re cozy.
Welcome to the forums.
Cattle weren’t as large then as they are now, genetics have improved over the years. Many of the photos I recall, looked like the cattle were mostly standing across the car. Giving 2-3 feet per cow, you could get 12-15 in quite easily. They packed them in more before the regulators came along. As mentioned, they are now required to stop for feed and watering every so many hours. Have no idea if they had the courtesy then.
Good luck,
Richard
The only car I have specific information on is a French stock car or boxcar dating from the 1870s. They were used at horse and troop transports in World War I; and were referred to as 40 and 8 cars - meaning 40 soldiers or 8 horses. These cars were 20.5 feet long and 8.5 feet wide. This may give you a basis for comparison.
After World War II, France donated 50 of these cars to the USA filled with gifts like objects of art. They were called Merci Cars, and one was donated to each of the 48 states, one to Alaska Territory and one shared between District of Columba and Hawaii Territory. About half to 2/3 of these cars remain in existance. The Maine car was restored last year and is on display at the Boothay Railway Village, the gift items are on display at the Maine State Museum in Augusta. For more information on the Maine car see:
http://www.railwayvillage.org/mercicar-boothba.html
For information on all the cars see:
http://www.mercitrain.org/
Note that this site says 49 cars, and has a list of the status of all the cars
G,
Keep in mind the horses they’re talking about would have been large draft horses, as that was what powered the armies of WWI on the road.
Another thing on the US-French interchange of cars. IIRC, the French gift followed a campaign of filling boxcars here in the US with donations to help the French eat, clothe, and rebuild right after WWII. The US boxcars stayed here when unloaded at port. But the French were so grateful they wanted to send the cars, too, on the “return route.” These cars were a familiar part of French culture for US WWI vets, just as many of the contents were to various other Americans. They appreciated the help.[Y]
A book I have called “Workin’ on the Railroad, reminiscences from the age of steam” has stories taken from other older works, some fiction some actual reminiscences, from the late 19th and early 20th century. (This book shouldn’t be confused with a similar named book “Working on the Railroad.”) It gives a really good glimpse into railroading in the link and pin/no air brakes/no hours of service era.
In a chapter on brakemen there is a story from one of the actual reminiscences. The person (Harry French) hired out on the Santa Fe in Kansas in 1876. His story includes a reference to Long-horned Texas cattle being carried 18 to a car.
He also talks about a “Dutch Clock,” an early speed recording device that was actually on the caboose, not the engine used by the ATSF. They had set the maximum speed for freight trains at 18 mph, although the trains could go faster. It was found the way to get around the device was to slam the engine into the caboose at 18 mph. After that the thing would record the speed as 18 mph no matter what the actual speed was.
Jeff
Speaking of cows, we just sent our calves to market, they went by truck, I do not know how many trips it takes to move 100 of those things. It will be our last batch of calves, we are getting out of the ranch business. We still have the cows, but they will go to a dispersion sale once the feed runs out.
roar
Update on our calves. We took 150 to market (they are to be sold today). We used two vehicles to transport them, a neighbors semi-trailer and our own stock trailer. Each vehicle made two round trips, ergo 75 critters per trip between two vehicles. I would assume 50 in one and 25 in the other.
Yeah, these are calves, not full sized critters, and they only had to go 22 miles so interstate and railroad loading regulations do not apply.
The cows are bellowing with separation anxiety, but their trauma is still to come although they do not know it yet. We did not put up any hay this year, and when the feed runs out they too will go to market and we will be out of the cow business.