Here’s some thoughts on sacle. When I first got into model railroading I started out in HO standard gauge, modeling steam in the first half of the 20th Century. Like many who first start out in the hobby, I decided to model a freelanced railroad, complete with "tongue ‘n cheek’ name. I also bought just about anything that struck my fancy, as long as was from the proper era. I loved NG, but was scared off by the fact that just about everything had to be craftsman kits, or scratchbuilt, so I soldiered on in HO standard. After about a year, it dawned on me that everything I was building looked alot like Colorado NG, so I decided to quit kidding myself and make the plunge. Choosing a prototype also made it easier to decide waht to buy, and appealed to my history major background.
When it came to to selecting a prototype, I just fell in love with the Ridgeway “beartrap” stacks sported by C&S locomotives, and the the boiler mounted, external airtanks that are so common to this prototype. Choosing HO scale was the easy part, as Nn3 was unheard of in those days (too small for my liking anyway), and the cost of modeling the C&S in Sn3 or On3 was just too high for my meager Navy pay.
The problem with HOn3, IMHO, has always been the poor running characteristics of brass locomotives in that scale. C&S prototype equipment is very small, even by NG standards, so finding a good running locomotive, with so
Very interesting discussion. If I may stick my nose in here in the interest of history;
C&S_ng_Fan said
“Because of the steep grades and the lower tractive effort, typical of NG locomotives, train lengths of 5-6 cars were the norm.”
I may have a little info of interest. Around the turn of the century the C&S appears to have generally run 14 - 16 car trains with as many as 4 locomotives and sometimes more for power. In 1903 the rules changed to forbid more than 4 locomotives because of complaints by train crews that engine crews benefitted finacially over them (I don’t recall their exact reasoning - but that’s why the rules changed). I’ve also read accounts of trains as long as 40 cars in the '30s particularly connected with the ice traffic for Maddox.
The length of train was limited by the engine’s ability to move the tonnage over the ruling grade - typically 4% sometimes a little more. For instance a D class locomotive (from a 1902 timetable - in 1906 these became B-4-D and B-4-E classes) was limited to just 120 tons between Mt. Princeton and the Alpine Tunnel. Presumably if you had 4 locomotives for the engine you could move 480 tons up grade. There was quite an influx of new equipment at the time so many cars could load out to 25tons but there were still a lot of 20ton cars. As you can see this is almost 20 cars if they were all fully loaded 30’ modern cars. Of course you probably didn’t have 4, D class engines in your train but even if there were one or two Cs (B-3-C and B-4-C) you still had well over 450tons capacity.
What really limited the length of train was the freight that was available. But the railroad wasn’t built with the anticipation of low traffic. Its sidings were designed around the anticipated length of trains of high traffic.
The siding at Jefferson was listed as over 3000 feet. This probably incl
Late to the party, just saw Charlie Allen’s layout in the HOn3 Annual. When I did a Google search I found this thread and forum. Liked all the comments and the other photos Margaritaman posted of Charlie’s Colorado 1937 layout. Liked the near vertical rock faces and how he used them to frame areas of interest in the Colorado 1937 layout. I’m doing a HOn3 D&RGW layout in a 6X16 room in my basement. This has caused me to do 2 foot wide modules. I also am doing Bragdon foam castings over blue foam. Charlie or anyone who has seen his layout under construction, I was wondering if any one had pictures showing how the foam was layed, glued together and then the Bragdon foam rock casts applyed. It seems that the large rock scenery blocks are very tall but not very deep. It gives the illusion that the scene is much deeper that it really is. I would be interested in seeing how Charlie or someone else did this because I also like rock work but it can’t be very deep on 2 foot modules. Pictures would be appreciated. Thanks in advance.
You have combined aspects of my two favorite narrow gauge model railroaders… Malcolm Furlow’s articles got me into narrow gauge and Harry Brunk’s articles got me into modeling the C&S Clear Creek Line. I like your model of Argo. I’m working on the same structure and know how difficult putting together all that timber is.
You succeeded in improving on the original SJC. Yours makes more sense. I am interested in the actual track plan you followed, especially how you accomplished the mine run on the backside of the yard. I would like to try and duplicate your endeavors. Thank you for any help your are willing to offer. Fantastic job and thank you for sharing.
Just beautiful man a work of art. Ive been starting to get more and more interested in HO narrow. The only thing i worry about is getting bored with the LOCOs cuz there arent a whole wide range of dif kinds. They seem similar
A lot of folks come to the narrow gauge because of the locomotives! They are often cute and querky. The C&S signature locos had the odd, boiler top, sideways mounted air tanks that created a real character to them. I love the narrow gauge as it transitioned to the tall shotgun or straight stack with the “bear trap” cinder catchers and the transition of the giant lantern headlights to the early large electrical headlights.
The great thing about narrow gauge is you do not have to feel obligated to follow any sort of reality. If you just stay in character to the region, you can do anything that would be reasonable, given the time and geography. You can modify your engines to bizarre and interesting new specimens with a cover story of…" yeah the D&RGW sent that C-21 to scrappers, but my road bought it from the scrapper’s track and saved it".
With old brass now often being found cheaper than modern NG locos, the Blackstone C-19s and K-27 mudhens and Tsunami sounds for the narrow gauge, nothing is there to stop the basher from doing amazing work on an old or new NG locos to make it their roads own unique specimen.
It is an age for the narrow gauge and it is expanding quickly. When NG sectional HOn3 track appeared, last year, you just had to know the gauge had arrived and new adherents would be coming.
Nice old original post recovery. Way back in 2009 narrow gauge was was just starting to crawl out of the specialist, scratch builder only zone of model railroading thanks to Blackstone in HOn3 and Bachmann’s On3 efforts. Narrow gauge has had its own premier magazine since 1975, but it took manufacturers and MR’s to build and enlarge the community.
I would posit that there were always N.G. people out there in their hearts, but it took a few bold manufacturers to bring them out of standard gauge by making reasonably priced, R-T-R locos
Jimmy, I know what you mean and where you are coming from…I abandoned 30 years of heavy standard gauge HO collected brass and other locos along with many pieces of rolling stock. The NG bug just bit too hard. I’m having a blast in this new world of NG, but did save most of my HO scale scenics that were “period correct”.
If you like big roads, giant yards, huge engine houses, long trains and big operation, stay out of narrow gauge.
Narrow gauge is a kind of cute and cozy, tumbledown structure world that the 20th century never seemed to touch in most of its less than stellar trackage.
A former C&S engineer who visited our club said the crew members referred to it in its latter days as the “Creaky and Shaky.”
Malcolm Furlow appeared in several episodes of “Tracks Ahead” on PBS, and I especially enjoyed seeing his efforts. Some of his layouts even used G-scale trains!
Congratulations on capturing that Malcolm Furlow look in your narrow gauge layout. Truly outstanding work!
Very nice layout photos and plan. There is a C&S 2-8-0 in Idaho Springs,CO and a depot, unless it has been torn down by now. There’s also the remains of a mine just on the East side of town. The C&S ha s always been my favorite NG road. All the best on your new layout!