Hello everyone. I have a lot old equipment with the old hook-horn couplers and I want to “upgrade” to the new, more prototypical knuckle couplers. Are there any gotcha’s I need to be aware of while converting? There seems to be a lot of choices in couplers. Seems like most people use Kadee 5 or 58?
I’ll keep a couple of cars with one of each coupler so I can “connect” cars of each type.
Suggestions, advices, web sites, whatever. I’m looking for any information.
Thanks.
-Tom
Just a warning, ALL the replies you will get will be about kaydee.
I second your statement tatans.
I have nothing against Kadees but I use Bachman EZ Mate. They have worked just fine and dandy for me. No complaints against them.
http://www.nmra.org/beginner/couplers.html
http://kadee.com/conv/list.htm
http://www.kadee.com/htmbord/page120.htm
http://www.kadee.com/htmbord/page160.htm
I won’t jump on the Kadee bandwagon, but I will suggest to use the couplers with a true coil spring rather than a plastic little tab. The tab gets sprung very easily and will not keep the knuckle closed. I will not even waste my time installing these if supplied in a kit.
My ancient fleet is from the 60’s, and many of them are cheapo brands. While I was able to upgrade my Athearn rolling stock very easily, replacing the couplers on Tyco and Crown cars hasn’t gone well at all. Some of my Athearn engines have been difficult, too. Still, I’m very happy with the cars and engines I have converted, and with the few new ones I’ve bought.
Get a magnifying glass. Work in a well-lit area. Have tweezers and small needle-nose pliers and screwdrivers handy. I’m even going for an eye exam tomorrow to get better glasses. I’m even older than those 60’s cars, and it’s starting (just starting) to show.
That’s my experience as well.
I am so glad i converted vary nice looking and they work better too.
Count me in, too. If I get a set of cars with the horn and hook, and because I’m on a fixed income, I do convert to a proper knuckle, but only on a couple of the cars. I leave the h&h between themselves on the middle cars of the set, but for coupling the ends to other cars or to the loco, it just HAS TO BE a knuckle. In my case, it is Kay-dee. My trains are not yet so long that I have bent any of the fixed plastic hooks.
I started converting to Kadee’s MANY years ago and have never regretted it. The operation is much better than the horn-hook type and more reliable.
#1 Get the Kadee coupler height gauge and learn how to use it. Even if you don’t use the Kadee brand couplers, mounting them at the correct height with the trip pin adjusted properly is essential to reliable operation.
#2 Take the time to mount the couplers properly, ie. firm mounting on the car body or the truck (for talgo), adjusted to correct height, check for proper centering action, etc.
#3 I have found one problem with the plastic couplers, even the Kadee brand ones. If you’re planning on running long and/or heavy trains, these can actually twist or the shank can bend and the cars will uncouple. The 40 series are the all metal ones, and I don’t think any other manufacturer makes a metal one. These are more rigid, and are available with the offset shank and the long and short shank, so they should be correct for just about any application. The 5 is the one with the centered, medium length shank and is a good reference. If you use the Kadee pockets, they will work best with a simple modification that will prevent vertical movement in the pocket, which can happen with an unmodified pocket.
Very simply, what I do to the Kadee standard pocket is to file a small
amount off the center post of the cover (the part where the coupler swivels)
and also a small amount from the box section where the side screw holes are
to allow a bit less of a height inside the coupler box. I’ve never measured
how much I removed, so I can’t give anything more specific, I’ve done it
this way for so long, I just hit it with a few passes on the file at each
place I mentioned. I usually trim it enough that if you overtighten the
screws, the coupler won’t move.
Then when you’re ready to assemble the coupler and box, check the centering
spring. At the edge toward the opening, t
Has anyone out there tried the new “Sergent Engineering” coupler. They are metal working models of a EC87. They look really good.
I have used McHenry with the metal spring and Kadee with metal spings and have been happy with both. McHenry have some that are drop in replacements for some of the older cheapo rolling stock, so they are in many cases a simpler installation. Make sure you avoid the ones with the plastic filament return spring like the plague. These fail very quickly as the plastic quickly loses its ability to close the coupler.
Thanks for all the information. I’ll give the links a read.
Most of my rolling stock is from the late 70’s and 80’s; primarily AHM and some Tyco. (No comments please, I know the history.) Nevertheless, I’d like to make the stock as good as possible. Other suggestions (other than starting over) are welcome.
Thanks again.
The Tyco were good before Consolidated Foods bought them out. If you have the Tyco cars with the plastic frame trucks, Kadee makes a snap in adaptor that comes, I believe, with the 20 series, making them easy to convert. The older metal frame trucks, I just pop off the old coupler and pocket, redrill the hole to #50, and tap it as a 2-56. Then I just mount the coupler in the Kadee box with a screw.
I just got some of the new Walther’s HO Superliner cars, that come equipped with Bachman Easy Mate couplers, compatable with the Kadee’s. I decided after one test run that these are being converted to Kadee’s because the material they’re made from will bend and uncouple the train with just 7 cars on a 2% grade. There are other brands out there, but I can’t say any of them have impressed me as being as good as the Kadee. When I’m running, I need “reliable” more than “perfect scale.”
Each time I pick up another package of knuckle couplers I check the price of Kadee vs Bachmann and McHenry. So far, Kadee’s prices are as good the competition, so why not buy the best? The #5 fits most freight cars. For locomotives and other stuff I check here:
http://www.kadee.com/conv/ho.htm
for the best fitting coupler. Although it is possible to fit the #5 coupler to anything, it will be less work to use the recommended coupler.
Coupler height must be uniform from car to car to prevent unwanted uncoupling. The NMRA gage has a coupler height feature. I put a wood block of just the right height on the end of my test track and screwed a coupler to it, making a poor man’s Kadee coupler gage. Or you can buy the Kadee gage. I will eyeball the couplers as the train goes by. If all is well, the two mated couplers are even with each other. If not, one car or both cars has the coupler at the wrong height. As a rule the Athearn blue box cars need a #6 flat washer under each truck to bring a #5 Kadee up to the right height.
Also check the height of the magnetic gladhand. It has to be above the rail head lest it snag on turnouts. If the glad hand is low, it is a good bet the coupler is low too, so I always check coupler height before bending gladhands.
The Athearn snap on coupler lid is prone to pop off and drop the coupler somewhere on the layout. This can be improved by filing off any mold parting marks on the Athearn coupler box during assembly of the car. Long nose pliers will bend the “ears” of the coupler box lid to a good right angle so they grip the box firmly.
Locomotives usually (nearly always) need electrically insulated couplers.
Body mounted couplers offer superior backing operation over truck mount couplers.
Truck mount offers more side to side swing which avoids derailment on sharp curves. I use body mount on anything under 60 foot of length as a general rule. I have had good luck with body mount couplers on
With my old fleet of Tyco and AHM cars, I’ve found the McHenry couplers work well. Especially on my heavyweight pass cars. The Mchenry is the only coupler that would snap right in and is long enough. The Kadee’s work alot of the time, with the right adapter box. I think its the Talgo type usually.
Sometimes nothing worked right. Usually because of coupler heigth. As an example, I have two AHM clam shell covered gondolas that wound up being way to low in coupler heigth after replacing the couplers into the truck pockets. In the end, I replaced the trucks with Proto 200 trucks, and body mounted the couplers with Kadee couplers.
I just can’t give up on some of my cars that I have had since childhood.
Texas Z, See, I told you kaydee eh! There is this huge wave of kaydee or nothing, I have heard nothing but praise for Sergent couplers, at last , some one has designed a coupler that actually looks like a coupler, I hate to admit it but Lionel had it figured out a hundred years ago, it’s the first innovation in an HO coupler in 40 years, and notice the resistance to it, can’t figure it out.
I’ve used several different brands of knuckle couplers with each offering some advantage over the others in one way or another. McHenry’s have been appreciated for ease of installation, at least on my IHC passenger cars. They are very easy to remove and replace. Accumate couplers seem pretty sturdy and were included in some of the kits I’ve built. They are plastic, but use a split coupler design that eliminates the need for a “plastic finger” or a “metal coil spring” and for that reason have a slightly more realistic appearance. The Kadee’s I’ve used have been very dependable and have never caused me any grief. I have a set of Bachmann Spectrum heavyweight passenger cars with the EZ Mate couplers, and these were already installed for me. They are, however, the ones that have caused me the most grief, because one of these cars is the one that has uncoupled most frequently for me. Just my .02!
tsasala
heres an easy way to convert to good trucks and body mounted couplers like the prototype.
pop the trucks out, get a 3/16 drill bit and carefully drill out the monting holesyou can go all the way through or stop at the weight. get some 3/16 plastic tube SUPER glue this into the holes and let cure fully, cut off at bolster level. then get some 1/8 palstic tube and insert into the 3/16 tube, if the 1/8 doesnt fit take a 1/8 drill bit and carefull open till the 1/8 does fit. SUPER glue this into the 3/16 and cut off about 1/4in from the top of the 3/16 tube. get kadee draft gear boxes and drill all the way through the car floor add your favorite brand of knuckle coupler to the box add better trucks with 2-56 screws or even self tapping screws will work.
there is an article in model railroader by stephen priest where he did a tyco flat car but used modeling putty instead of the way i just described. had a friend show me that trick
hope this helps
tom
Thanks Tom. I’ll give that a try when the time comes. Gotta lay the track first!