Following Chip’s post where he proposed a design contest for a H0 scale 2x8 LDE (Layout Design Element - part of a larger layout, based on a real life prototype) based on a small midwestern agricultural town in the 1950s, two of the forum regulars (ICRR1964 and steinjr) hereby present one such design: Thawville, IL.
The main givens Chip defined was (as we understood them):
Layout will be 8 feet wide by 2 feet deep
Must be able to be connected to rest of layout on both ends
All desired operations must be possible without using rest of layout
Grade and curve radius must be appropriate for equipment used
LDE should represent an small(ish) agricultural town.
Here is the layout plan we have come up with thus far (click on image to see max size):
Layout plan
Prototype information
Here is a link to a web page describing the prototype location (right click on link and select “open in new window” to see this forum page and the presentation in two separate web browser windows on your screen):
Discussion of design decisions:
The main feature of Thawville, from a railroading modelling perspective, is that we have just one double ended siding, and not a very long siding at that (about 400 yards long in the prototype), shared between several businesses, with quite a few different types of RR cars being unloaded (or loaded) on that one siding.
The double ended siding could be used for runaround moves (if there is no cars being loaded or unloaded at the time). But we envision that it is more l
Stein and myself have been spending allot of time emailing and talking, trying to get this out. Most of the information I have is based on documents, photo’s, and what I was told by some of the oldtimers, family, and memory. If anyone has any information on this small town in Central Illinois please contact me, would like to here what you know and compare notes, I could have missed something or added something that was not there. As far as RR goes, the siding is gone and almost all the buildings, two of the small buildings are still standing at the present by where the siding use to be.
It makes a lot of difference what era you are modeling. I also wouldn’t mind knowing what road name you are modeling.
Either way, I’m concerned about the freight platform/team area. Assuming we are talking about an era where trucks are used. The freight platform does not seen to allow access by trucks. Likewise, the “team area” does not have a loading dock. It’s a riddle, no doubt, but I think you need to provide a way for trucks to load and off-load freight for transfer to and from the freight cars.
May not need it. In many cases the freight platform next to the main was for unloading LCL from a train on the main into the freight portion of the depot. A team could pull up along side the dock to unload. Remember it was built before automobiles.
It is very common NOT to have a dock at a team track.
You just back the wagon/truck up to the door of the rail car. If you look at old pictures of team tracks you will see that is very very common.
My concern is the location of the south elevator and stock yards. Are they far enough away from the siding and main track switches to allow a car to be spotted at the industry and not foul the main track or siding? I would be concerned that it looks too congested trying to fit so much in such a small space. I would be tempted to lose the feed storage and move the south elevator 3" to the right and every thing else 3" to the left and try to open it up a little. An alternative is to lose the feed storage and make the north elevator about half the size you’ve drawn to open things up. I would probably make the buildings along the rear only an inch or two thick at the most to open up the street and make sure I had depth to the foreground buildings. You want the downtown buildings fairly narrow and compressed, but away from that 1 block “downtown” things should open back up and have space between the buildings for that small town look.
Platform was used for LCL (Less than carload) freight - packages, essensially. Which were stored at the depot until picked up.
Back the truck up to the side door of the freight car, lift stuff across. Pretty common procedure in the olden days. They used manpower, rather than forklifts to transfer loads.
Let me ask the question this way. I ordered a piano. It came into the freight station and is waiting to be picked up. How do I get that piano into my flatbed truck?
Stock pen loading chute (is that the right word ?) is far enough away from the turnout to allow unloading from a center side door w/o fouling the main. South elevator isn’t, though. Thanks for pointing that one out!
I see your point. Maybe something like this (dumping the lumber shed, moving the south elevator and feed storage right, downsizing the north elevator to open up a bit):
I have them at 1.5" (behind north elevator) and 3" depth (downtown) now. Could obviously shave off a little more if I get too pressed for depth.
How about if I open it up a little between the Clayton warehouse and the downtow
I thought about that but I was trying to keep the lumber shed to vary the cars and commodities inbound. Maybe keep the lumber shed, turn it 90 degr, but they use the team track to recieve cars. You could also move the shed to another location and park a flatbed with the lumber company name on it at the team track, or maybe a truck with an A frame winch to unload bundles of lumber.
I like your LDE plan. The simple track plan leaves lots of room for scenery yet offers a good amount of operation. It replicates the “small town feel” where the typical track arrangement is a double-ended spur to serve the local industries and which most modelers incorrectly identify as a passing siding.
To me, the quintessential small-town track arrangement was like that at Danville, California, on Southern Pacific’s San Ramon Branch (milepost 54.6). There were two double-ended sidings: one on each side of the branch’s “mainline.” One was the house track 1807 feet long serving the combination depot and the corral (stock pen and chute). The other was 1567 feet long and served two warehouses and an unidentified industry. North of these tracks was a single-ended spur 811 feet long serving more warehouses. As of the track plan’s 1912 date, Danville was a small agricultural village. Now the community is suburban yuppyville, and the railroad is long gone.
Are you kidding? In case you’re not… You and several friends would slide it from the platorm to the flatbed. The closer those are in height, the easier the task. The hard part will be getting the piano from the truck to the inside of your house. Using a dolly would make this whole process easier. Easier yet would be to hire a professional to do the job while you sip lemonade.
Maybe you should add a retail outlet for coal…Most folks here in Illinois at that time used coal for heating and cooking…The coal yard was pretty important and busy…would do a lot of switching…Cox 47
Maybe I’m just being stupid, but it doesn’t look like there’s enough room to get truck in there, with the passenger station the way it is, etc. At any rate, the road is not shown.
I had assumed that the ground level was at the height of the rails for the siding (a common practice) and that one would cross from the team track area to the freight platform. There is plenty of room on the west (left) side to park the flatbed truck there if anyone objected to your blocking the siding track.
That was a really good question you had about the piano. Most of the farmers in the local area had grain trucks with wood sides, these were used to haul grain in the fall and the sides were taken off in the summer for straw and hay hauling. We did not hire for a professional delivery in this small town years ago so to speak. The word professional does not come into play as to speak. You went to the local cafe, or tavern and asked some good strong men for help. Remember this was a town of 200 to 250, that included children. So that ment everyone new everyone. In 1969 there was a local farmer who took ill, 7 other farmers took his crop out using there own machines, and charged nothing. I heard stories of the only doctor in town that got paid so to speak in ahhh chickens and repairs done on his home. LOL!
Mark, the issue isn’t mission critical but if it were,
I’d say that you were a “seeing the track empty” kind of guy and I’m a “seeing the track full” kind of guy. Just kidding of course, but if there were a couple empty hoppers at the South Tower and a boxcar for either the feed mill or the lumber shed, then a delivery to the team track would block access to the freight dock until the next day’s train.
But as they used to say in construction…“can’t see it from my house.”
Moving the tracks an inch or so closer to the bottom (front) edge would provide more separation between the railroad/industries and the business district.
A railroad wouldn’t leave cars blocking access to the station platform for long. It would put the extra cars elsewhere for later delivery when there would be more room. In the “real world,” these small-town sidings were a lot more empty than full. The exception was when there were extra cars that had to be parked somewhere until needed or disposed of (such as when cars were gathered in preparation for harvest). Even then, space would be left for needed access.
Lets think about this. The freight dock is along a main line. NOT a siding. You aren’t going to be unloading a piano out of a baggage/express car in a train that has a schedule on an busy mainline onto an OPEN loading dock where it may have to sit for hours or until the next day to be picked up anyway. If its coming in a boxcar they will spot it AT the team track and unload it there. The freight dock is for loading/unloading LCL parcels that they can handle with a dolly in 10-15 minutes and move into the freight house portion of the station for cover/security.
Guys, The only concern I see has to do with the turnout at the start of the passing siding. Perhaps a different frog angle branching to the right to avoid the bit of “S” curve. Me, personally, I’d keep the lumber yard and lose one of the elevators – but hey, it’s your town and if they had 2 elevators, so be it.
Having unloaded a few box cars on team tracks, never had a loading dock. Strong back, weak mind. Used pickups, trailers, flatbeds, 18 wheelers. [:D]
By the way, the ground between the tracks is usually level with the top of the rail and each time a car is spotted it cuts new flangeways in the dirt.
