Really? We get them out west all the time. The whispercab-equipped units are considered the best DC units we have by us crews, in part due to their reliability.
What is the reason for the cold-related problems?
If SD70Aces are disliked by crew members, what locomotives should the railroad use to pull freight? I know the first SD70ACE’s made around 2004-2008 are terrible, but the second batch from 2012 onwards were better.
NSrailfan8114
They Should buy EMDs
Other than for foamer variety, why? As Northwest pointed out the thundercabs are junk, and at only 19 units, a small subfleet. CSX seems to be OK with a majority GE fleet, so why are you so against it?
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EMD has produced many outstanding units, in years past. The SD70 and I believe the SD70Ace were developed by the Canadian owned EMD a few years back. With the relatively new Electromotive Diesel acquisition by Progress Rail, and backed by parent Caterpillar, the EMD marque will have solid guidance and the mechanical and electronics maladies will be corrected. The Railroad industry should do eve
Purchase statistics indicate that the EMD/Progress Rail/ Caterpillar products are not operationally stepping up to the plate. While the rail industry does need two or more manufacturers to keep price and performance under control - both need to have products that are near each other from a performance and reliability standpoint. We are in the era of PSR - PSR requires reliable, economical motivepower.
EMD of the past is not the EMD of today.
EMD was rarely the innovator and went more for dependability in its designs. Note that turbochargers weren’t a factory application on 567 engines until Union Pacific forced their hand. GE was first with a pressurized carbody, Alco had the first AC/DC drive (the C630), etc.
New locomotive sales are in the doldrums right now (rebuilds are bigger business) and it will be interesting to see what happens when sales of new motive power pick up.
It will be interesting to see how PSR plays out related to locomotives.
CN did not buy very many new for quite some time, and then when they first started buying additional units they went with used GE C40-8 units from various roads before buying new GEs in modest amounts.
CP has not bought any new units for quite some time other than the GP20C-ECO “rebuilds” to replace yard and local power. They have rebuilt numerous units such as SD60s and AC4400s. Now as traffic increases they are reactivating their long-stored SD9043MACs and rebuilding them to SD70ACUs to increase their active fleet size.
One would think that as CSX, NS and UP implement PSR, they will have a significant number of stored units and will be able to go to those first if they are successful at increasing traffic in the long run. As one potential example, UP on its own could go the SD70ACU route for their approximately 200 units of SD9043MACs if traffic bumps up, not to mention the legions of AC4400CWs and SD70S they also own that could get the AC4400CWM or SD70ACC treatment.
So one might expect that new Tier 4 unit sales in North America for both GE and Cat/Progress/EMD will be in the smaller range for a number of years as PSR roads increase capacity from stored units first.
Does UP own the locomotives or does it lease them?
How many SD70ACes would EMD have had to sell for them to have “operationally stepped up to the plate?” Their sales counts are dwarfed by GE, but they ar
Having the right product for the market when the market is looking for it is what business is all about. Snooze and you loose.
The railroads don’t want GE as the only manufacturer, EMD has to up the performance of their product line to take back market share. That is what competition is all about and the carriers do want competition among locomotive manufacturers.
But nobody is buying new locomotives now. Not in quantity.
When I went railfanning in Utica, NY, I only saw one EMD- and that was a GP38-2.
CN is in the middle of taking possession of a 260 unit order from GE. They hav ordered both T3 and T4 units. As of right now, CN is not rebuilding any of their fleet.
[quote user=“DOUG KNAPP”]
SD60 M & SD60I are wonderful locomotives and CSX still uses both. They are receiving PTC and have cab signal. The SD70MAC is not too bad in both generations but the SD70ACe is a bad experience to operate and maintain. They were designed by Rube Goldberg and slapped together by the Three Stooges. 20 units was 20 too many. I know CSX is testing Cat’s tier 4 ACe and I hope the results are better. EMD locos have always been more durable and longer lasting than GEs but the first ACe units were a far cry from the quality of the SD40-2 units of which there are still many on the CSX roster.
Now that you mention it, Doug, I cannot seem to remember ever hearing Conrail engine crews complaining at all about their SD60I’s and M’s.
Same here on the RF&P Subdivision of CSX’s Baltimore Divison. GE’s predominate on most of the road trains now, with an ocasional visit by an SD40-2/-3. Local power is still pretty much the very reliable GP38-2’s and GP40-2’s, though.
The M-2 units are just fine in the winter.
The SD70i and SD75i are trash in the winter. Their main reservoirs drop at the hint of cold temperatures. I don’t know why they’re the best liked. They’re great on dry rail in warm termperatures but add in winter temperatures and/or wet rail and they’re trash.
The C40-8 and SD60 units CN has are trash in the winter. The heat sucks and the cab is drafty. You’re always bundled up just as if you are outside when it’s cold.
I like them because they are really quiet (except in DB) and have good cab heaters. I’ve even seen a few that have had strip heaters and air conditioning added, along with the PTC equipment they all seem to be receiving.
The AC units and M-2’s have excellent wheelslip control, but I would prefer a SD75 over any of the DC GE units for a leader on grades. The Dash-8’s and 9’s are terrible for surging, slipping and dropping their load, and many of the ES44DC’s do that too. When at different times I worked on the Grande Cache Sub and Alberta Coal Branch I noticed that tonnage trains with EMD power would climb the ruling grades slightly faster than those with older GE’s, and stall less frequently.
The SD70I’s and SD75I’s were a pain when one found its way onto a mine run, as they do not work in pacesetter with any other units.
Is Symington still putting portable space heaters in those?
They likely are.
A train the other day left Fort Frances with two UP units on the head end and two UP on the tail end. Both head end units somehow lost heat. Their answer … portable heaters. But since UP has crap all in their cabs there were no outlets! Not sure how the rest of the day went on for the relief crew.
Whatever happened, I’m glad I wasn’t there to experience it. Those leased ex-UP and CSX units are absolute junk. I thought our 2100’s and 5400’s were bad, these leasers are worse!
The CREX units are awesome though. CN should just buy them on the spot.
Gennesse and Wyoming have several that were on the Utah Railroad as coal haulers, just like home for the type. For UR they generally ran well although the crews hated the low profile cabs. And since they were all being used in Utah they had to have heaters installed on all the parts that could cold soak. East Central Utah winters can get a might cold, especially in the coal country surrounding Price.
Here are the current loco order numbers per Sean Graham-White per his post on Loconotes You will note that CN took delivery of a sizable ET44AC/ES44AC-T4C order and UP a Sizable SD70ACe-T4 order…and everyone else was small orders or rebuilds.
- (30) CN ES44AC T4C 3806-3835
- (38) CN ET44AC 3133-3170* – the final road number for 2018 is not confirmed yet
- (5) CP AC4400CWM 8140-8144
- (65) CP AC4400CWM 8000-8064, 8200 (11) Metrolink F125 932-942* – awaiting confirmation that all 11 were built in 2018
- (15) NS SD70ACe T4C 1175-1189
- (2) NS SD70ACC 1800-1801* – build date shifted from 2017 to 2018
- (??) NS SD70ACC 1802-1826* – awaiting confirmation on the # completed
- (100) NS AC44C6M 4075-4174
- (2) NS SD33ECO 6219, 6220
- (??) NS SD70ACU Various #s, quantity not confirmed yet
- (37) UP SD70ACe-T4 3062-3099* – awaiting confirmation that all 37 were built in 2018
- (20) UP C44ACM – awaiting confirmation on the # completed
- (8) UP SD70ACe 9097-9104
- (4) UPY EMD24B 1000-1003