The U.S. ought to rank 197th. In other words, it shouldn’t be imposing tariffs at all.
I have found the following article to be a highly informative, unbiased discussion of tariffs.
The Economic Policy Institute is a non-profit, nonpartisan think tank that conducts economic research and analyzes the economic impact of policies, with a focus on the interests of low- and middle-income workers.
I was going to post about some of the stuff in this thread, but you know what? I agree the thread should just be deleted.
I agree. That’s one of the points of these latest tariffs – to force the others to drop theirs.
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Great point! 
what are foreign nations buying or want to buy from US that is tariffed by foreign nations? in other words, what does the US make or manufacture that foreign natons want?
looks like the avg tariff imposed on the US is 2.59%. The highest is 23.84% by Bermuda. See List of countries by tariff rate
i’m just trying to put some numbers on these things. Hard to argue with qualitative statements
Glad to see you’re finally stating some #s.
using your numbers (5:1 selling price to cost) it still appears that a 25% tariff results in a lower selling price than if manufactured in the US where wages ~290% higher than in China assuming wages are 25% of the cost. That final priceUS assumes the same ratio between selling price and cost if made in China.
Value price --- tariff -- +tar wageFr wageUS cost priceUs
$ 40 $200 25 % $ 10 $210 $ 10 $ 29 $ 59 $295
i assume the tariffs will have a bigger effect on automobiles parts made in Canada where wages are probably closer to US wages.
The Tariffs aren’t about “punishing” other countries (at least for the most part - some are, for example, tariffs on countries that import Venezuelan oil). Tariffs are actually a lot more complex topic than many people realize, certainly a lot more complex than “trying to punish other countries.” They can be used to help balance a trade deficit (do we want to continue to send billions to China each year), they can protect domestic production, they can bring back domestic production, and they can help with national security (the main reason for the steel and aluminum tariffs is to increase domestic production so our military doesn’t have to rely on foreign sources).
While a lot of production has obviously moved overseas, it’s a common misconception that the U.S. doesn’t produce “anything” anymore (figuratively speaking). The fact is we are still the #2 manufacturer in the world, and still far ahead of #3 (Japan).
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Hmmm, I believe you missed my sarcasm. Oh well.
Rich
A quick direct answer: I ordered and received a 10 pack of decoders that I would have bought anyway before too much longer. Saved $45 if the 25% tarriff should affect these at some point. Dan
When they placed a large tariff on washing machines back in 2017 the price of a machine from South Korea or China became much higher than the equivalent US made machine, funny thing US machines suddenly went up in price to just below the foreign made machines.
So don’t think the USA importers/manufactures care about you it is about their bottom line.
Rick Jesionowski
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Since tariffs are based on landed value and not marked up retail value, I can’t see where tariffs will have much impact. If someone is going to pay $275 for an over-detailed item and over-gizmoed locomotive that they “have” to have, they will pay $300. JMO.
Ignoring the American worker to favor slave labor elsewhere allowed Americans to enjoy a more posh lifestyle with upscale features and options over the more basic items previous generations had. We all now have access to highly detailed and near-custom made products instead of only the generic cookie cutter products modeled after a single roadname that past modelers had. Locos have specific details and sophisticated lighting and control features whereas Athearn BB locos didn’t even have molded on grab irons, directional lighting, or even a single wire inside the loco.
I can’t see complaining about prices when the policy of moving labor off to other countries has allowed me and others to buy near-custom products that only very rich people could typically afford? Maybe the sophistication of the product I can afford needs to be brought back to Earth a bit?
If Athearn is finding loco prices too high, maybe delete the ground lights and separately lit number boards and limit decoders to about 12 commands? Most of the evolution to the posh, sophisticated, and near-custom products wasn’t really needed for us to enjoy the hobby anyway. JMO.
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Long before tariffs, this has already been happening.
Athearn retooled the “basic” F7 to make it nicer without it being "GENESIS " level. And they offer locos and rolling stock at different detail and price levels.
For a decade now Bachmann has been shifting steam locomotive production away from the highest “Spectrum” level to a more affordable balance. Still with basic prototype features but at more reasonable prices. The Berkshire, USRA 2-8-2 and 4-6-2, the new 2-6-0 are all examples of this. And all their rolling stock is now “mid grade detail”.
Walthers has introduced more price/detail levels with “Trainline”, “Mainline” and “Proto”.
Even Scale Trains has their various price/detail levels.
Some modelers want and are willing to pay for the highest level of detail, good for them. I do on occasion.
Some modelers use the word “quality” to describe these “most detailed” models.
In my view, that is a poor choice of words.
Quality is how well does it run, how well do the parts fit together, how well do the couplers work, how neatly is it painted and lettered. Even a lesser detailed model can be of “high quality”.
Yes, in times past manufacturers made more generic models to keep costs at a “marketable” level.
But even back then, once you get past a couple of 4x8 platforms, this has always been a moderately expensive hobby for those with both time and extra resources.
That will never change.
The true effect of the tariff remains to be seen, and the secondary market is awash in products not subject to any tariffs.
Sheldon
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Yes, products evolve over time regardless of how labor markets change. Autos evolved from the Model T over decades despite cars and parts being produced exclusively in the USA during that time.
It’s hard to account exactly for how labor market changes impact the prices of trains when the Athearn Roundhouse line of locomotive is far better than the old Athearn BB line was. Can’t adjust the BB for inflation because the current product is not the same as the 1980s BB. Maybe we can adjust a piece of Atlas code 100 track since nothing has really changed about it, and then it would be easier to see the impact cheap labor costs had on the product. We could then say what that piece of track would cost if USA labor replaced foreign labor, and compare that to inflation.
As far as tariffs, I can’t see where a person is now going to not buy an item because it now costs $250 when it cost $220 before the tariff. But they will complain about it as they buy it. LOL.
Remember - Before Staggers and contract rates between carriers and customers.
The rates carriers charged their customers came from Tariffs that applied to commodities and origins and destinations.
ironically, the Staggers Act eliminated the price limits, what you seem be calling “Tariffs”, RRs charged, allowing them to increase rates to abandon customers they were losing money on. (Similar to allowing RRs to abandon passenger train services they were losing money on)
I think it’s two different words, with different meanings, that look and sound the same.
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It also did the same for the trucking industry, it eliminated protected territories and required service in the trucking industry, opening up real competition. And eliminated regulatory barriers to multi mode freight transport like Piggyback. Which allowed railroads to be in the trucking business, and allowed open competition for freight business - by rail or truck.
Sheldon
The verb definition of tariff is to “fix a price” - which is what was done with freight rates. The rates were “Tariffed”, or fixed, by regulation. I remember this well, my father was a terminal manager for CAROLINA freight for a good portion of my childhood/teenage years. They called the freight rates “tariffs” because they were fixed by government regulation.
Trucking companies, like the railroads could only really compete based on quality of service, not price.
The “tariff” was not a max price, or minimum price, it was THE price they had to charge.
Sheldon
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If you wanna roll with the ballers you gotta put down big chips.