DCC choices - Digitrax or NCE???

Model Railroader General Discussion (Model Railroader)
21

DecoderPro is free open-source software that lets you program decoders using a PC. The great thing is you can use your mouse to just point and click options and you don’t have to remember what CV does what, which value does what, and so on.

Besides this, you can open multiple windows at once, so you can have the panels for two locos up at the same time, which makes speed matching two locos (via programming on the main) about as simple as it gets.

You can save off your loco settings to disk, which gives you a backup of all your loco decoder settings.

Since the loco settings are on disk, if you get a new loco with the same decoder in it, you can just copy all the settings from another loco in a few seconds and shazzam! The new loco now has all the same decoder settings you like from the other loco.

Decoder programming doesn’t get any easier. Once you’ve used DecoderPro, you won’t ever want to go back programming the old way, one CV or binary bit setting at a time, while reading and rereading the decoder manual. And did I say DecoderPro is free?

You do need a computer interface on your DCC system. The NCE full ProCab system comes with the computer interface built in, as does EasyDCC (EasyDCC requires you build a special cable, however). All other DCC systems require you purchase the computer interface separately, at a cost of about $100.

You will also need a PC with a serial interface. A laptop will be the most convenient unless you have a PC already that’s in the layout room. Most computers these days DONT have a serial interface, just USB. So you may need to purchase a serial to USB convertor for another $50.

You can get a USB computer interface for Digitrax, and word is NCE will soon release a USB computer interface for their PowerCab starter system. No convertor is needed for these to use a USB port as is found on most modern PCs.

As far as I’m concerned, a DCC system with a computer interface is the only way to go and is worth eve

22

Joe Fugate has said it all.

I had previously used another computer interface software with my Digitrax System, but Joe Fugate pointed me to DecoderPro. Volume #3 of his video series has extensive information about using decoder pro. You’ll find the rest of his video series a great resource too!

JIM

23

[#ditto] In my opinion this is a major philosophy difference between the units. The Zephyr is on sit on table base unit, while NCE has the hammerhead hand held throttle as the main controller. If you really like or really hate one or the other of these, all the other features will be irrelevant.

They both have add-on throttles that have a different in-hand feeling which migh make a long term difference to you as well.

The Zephyr has its unique “jumper” ports that allow any normal DC controller to be hooked in and used as a DCC throttle.

24

As to the Zephyr versus an NCE PowerCab, the most immediately obvious difference is the stationary power-pack form factor of the Zephyr versus the mobile handheld form factor of the PowerCab.

With mobile programming on the main (POM) becoming popular, a stationary power-pack form factor is not very easy to use except for the tiniest of layouts (4x8). A mobile handheld form factor works much better for POM.

If you have a need to do much engine hostling during an op session, then POM to do consisting is very handy. Or if you want to simulate the momentum effects of longer trains on-the-fly while operating, then POM again accommodates that. NCE even has thought ahead here, giving you a momentum button that you can configure so one button press automatically adds momentum to the selected loco lashup using POM.

The other notable difference between the two systems is the Zephyr allows you to run a straight DC loco lashup using special address 00, while the PowerCab does not.

Running a DC loco lashup on DCC is more of a stunt than anything useful, IMO. The DC loco lashup will run poorly, speed control is not very good, and the locos will emit various harmonic frequencies as you change loco speeds. With very nice fleet decoders now selling for under $12 in quantity, and given the poor performance of a straight DC loco lashup on DCC, I don’t blame NCE for not including the feature. It’s more hype than anything truly useful.

25

I don’t know that the mobility of the PoweCab controller is a huge deal, since you can’t unplug it. Now, if you go to a Smart Booster, or a ProCab, the advantage is quite clear. In a lot of respects the PowerCab design strikes me as inside out, I would not put the power into the handset/throttle, and then run it through the little wires (I know they say they are a special cable, and the outer wires are bigger, but even if bigger I don’t think they are what they should be). Now, the ProCab answers all of those problems, and gets rid of the four throttle limit. So, if you expect to want more than four throttles I don’t think it even makes sense to go PowerCab, I’d go straight to ProCab.

I’ve been thinking about this for a while, I used to think I preferred the Zephyr to the PowerCab, as I really didn’t think much of NCE’s manuals. But either they improved them, or they’ve grown on me.

So, if it was me, and it was between the PowerCab and the Zephyr, I’d go Zephyr, because I think the limitations on the PowerCab would bother me. On the other hand, if I know I am going to expand, I’d go straight to the ProCab, which seems to me to be done right. IT costs a bit more, but if you need more powe than the PowerCab can provide, and want more than four throttles, it ends up being more efficient.

26

Most People buying a DCC system for the first time are purchasing it for their home layouts that are most likely not much larger than a 4X8 or small bedroom layout. If your layout is much larger than that, then obviously you would be buying a full blown DCC system, So it only makes sense that you could get away with running no more than say 2 loco’s or need more than 2 throttles.

27

Thanks for the explanation.

28

Assuming you’ve got the people to run them it doesn’t take much space to be able to run four or more trains (thinking N scale here). A switcher in the yard, a local peddler, a through freight, a passenger train, and maybe a hostler, and you’re at five. I’ve got four kids, and I am modelling in N scale, so I think that way! I’m in 12x14 (actually more like 14x16, since I’m maintaining access in some ‘shared’ areas), and can easily see five or six running without too much interference, if I ever get the thing finished, and have anything left over for rolling stock!

29

Bzzzt! Wrong answer. The two most obvious differences are initial abilities and expandability. As noted elsewhere in this thread, the Zephyr out of the box, besides having more amperage, is capable of 10 additional throttles vs. 2 out of the box for the PowerCab.

And if you add the SB3 to (actually in place of) your Powercab, you lose the PowerCab’s original 1.7 amps and the programming track. No such tradeoffs when you add throttles or a booster to the Zephyr. And if the Zephyr’s 10 (actually 12 if you count the jump throttles) slots aren’t enough, and you do add a DCS* or DB*, you still can use the Zephyr as a 2.5 amp booster and throttle. Many folks have started their layout with a Zephyr and continue to use it in this manner for a yard or industrial switching district as the layout grows.

Umm, we are talking about that 4x8, or at least we should be. Thinking that either the Zephyr or the PowerCab, by themselves, are suitable for a basement-sized layout is a sure way to get oneself in trouble.

[quote user=“jfugate”]

If you have a need to do much engine hostling during an op session, then POM to do consisting is very handy. Or if you want to simulate the momentum effects of longer trains on-the-fly while operating, then POM again accommodates that. NCE even has thought ahead here, giving you a momentum button that you can configure so one button press

30

[quote user=“Stevert”]

Bzzzt! Wrong answer. The two most obvious differences are initial abilities and expandability. As noted elsewhere in this thread, the Zephyr out of the box, besides having more amperage, is capable of 10 additional throttles vs. 2 out of the box for the PowerCab.

And if you add the SB3 to (actually in place of) your Powercab, you lose the PowerCab’s original 1.7 amps and the programming track. No such tradeoffs when you add throttles or a booster to the Zephyr. And if the Zephyr’s 10 (actually 12 if you count the jump throttles) slots aren’t enough, and you do add a DCS* or DB*, you still can use the Zephyr as a 2.5 amp booster and throttle. Many folks have started their layout with a Zephyr and continue to use it in this manner for a yard or industrial switching district as the layout grows.

Umm, we are talking about that 4x8, or at least we should be. Thinking that either the Zephyr or the PowerCab, by themselves, are suitable for a basement-sized layout is a sure way to get oneself in trouble.

[quote user=“jfugate”]

If you have a need to do much engine hostling during an op session, then POM to do consisting is very handy. Or if you want to simulate the momentum effects of longer trains on-the-fly while operating, then POM again accommodates that. NCE even has thought ahead here, giving you a momentum button that you can configu

31

Hey if you can see yourself running 5 trains at once on a 12X14 layout, then more power to ya.

I have a tough enough time just keeping track of one engine making sure the turnouts are thrown correctly on a 7X11 layout [:)]

32

Not by myself! I thought I was clear about that part. I’ve got four sons. And they have friends. Still probably crash now and then…

33

Definitely Digitrax[tup][tup]

34

Sorry, Ted. Gotta disagree with you. Although Digitrax does make a great system and components, no one DCC system is right for everyone.

Tom

35

Never mind the **** 5 trains on a layout stand back and let the ABBA F7 Consist through with it’s Helpers too.

I chose Digitrax because it is easy to understand and if something didnt work, I am the one who generated the error, not the system.

36

That’s funny, I chose NCE back in 1999 because I thought it was the easiest to understand. I still do, and I still run NCE.

Bob

37

There are so many questions we all could be here all night debating this as usual.

Myself, I picked the Powercab because I feel like I would have to walk with the manual in hand on some other systems. Will I remember all the functions next time I operate, or is it just plain simple to use?

I like the mobillity( if you want to call it that) of the Powercab, even if its limmited. I simply purchased a long(10’) enough 6 wire coil cord to cover the entire layout. I would consider the stationary throttle, but only for a yard throttle.Even then my yard and its industries are about 13 feet long requiring the Yard master to move to where he must couple, uncouple, and verify cars.

I am with some of the guys here on the need for my DCC system to be able to run a DC loco. Why? How long do you think it would take for you to try this and never use the feature again?

With the jump ports on the Digitrax I suppose you could mount the old powerpacks anywhere on the layout so this could be a benefit.

By the way the POwercab can utilize only one(1) additional throttle, not 2 as noted earlier.

My best test to date for my Powercab + 1 throttle (N-scale) was 2 double headed trains + 2 other mainline trains + a yard switcher. Remember, even though the recall stack is only 2 on the Powercab you can still dial up a new loco while the others continue to run.

You see, we can go rounds on this stuff all night. Therefor I highly recomend that you get some experience with the throttle at least. Read the online manuals over and over. Then come back and ask some more dirrect questions. We all love to debate this.( if you didn’t notice already).

Shoot the original poster may never come back to this.

38

I prefer Digitrax for two three reasons: 2 or 4 digit addressing, up to 14 functions and the DT400R Super Throttle.

NCE is straight 4 digit. This may or may not matter to you.

NCE allow up 12 functions.

I think that once you get a DT400R in your hand, you’ll never want to let go of it, it’s that much fun to use. It may not be as comfortable in your hand (I wouldn’t be suprised if they redesign the ergonomics soon) as NCE Pro Cab but it has two throttle knobs vs. one wheel. And it doesn’t matter which Digitrax system you use, LocoNet is standard on all three.

Now OTOH, if you plan on running 60+ trains using 60+ decoders (mobile or stationary) a single NCE Powerhouse Pro might be for you. I didn’t think so…[;)] If you’ve done your homework you know that the Digitrax Zephyr (DCS50) accomodates 10 addresses and the Empire builder (DB150) and Super Chief (DCS100) can accomodate up to 22. The NCE Powerhouse Pro accomodates up to 63.

Now, if your layout is that big, and I’m guessing that it’s not, you’ll be dividing it in districts anyway. This is where Digitrax is so cool, you can add additional DB150s or DCS100s as boosters, assuming that your within the 5.0 amp limit per district. If by the remote chance that 5.0 amps is not enough, DCS200s will give you 8.0 amps of power. Overkill, right?

I am, however, impressed with Lenz’ s warrantee policy, 10 years compared to Digitrax’s and NCE’s 1 year.

39

I may have said four, I was considering the Smart Booster. My problem is if you go over four you start to have stuff you didn’t really need to buy. Actually, that’s een true when you add the Smart Booster, since now the power and layout control functions that you pay for in the PowerCab are redundant. On the other hand, the ProCab system makes a lot of sense to me, if you need more than the PowerCab alone can provide.

40

Ted,

Just a couple of corrections. The NCE Power Cab and Powerhouse Pro has:

  • 2 and 4 digit addressing
  • 28 functions (F0-F28) - This is a recent development and somewhat an arbitrary and debatable topic as far as whether or not it’s really beneficial upgrade or just gimicky. Most times, F0-F8 or F9 will be the functions that you’ll use the most.

Also, when you say that the “Digitrax Zephyr (DCS50) accomodates 10 addresses and the Empire builder (DB150) and Super Chief (DCS100) can accomodate up to 22. The NCE Powerhouse Pro accomodates up to 63”, are you talking about the maximum number of locomotives each system can run at one time? If you are only referring to the storage ability of each system, I believe any of the Digitrax and NCE systems will store up to 9,999 locomotives addresses.

Tom