I’m building a new HO layout and am going to use dcc. I want to have the ability to run more then 5 locomotives at a time. I am looking for input on what’s decent and somewhat easy to use? Thanks
Hello all,
This is a BIG can of worms!
Albert Einstein once said, “The only way to get all the worms back in the can is to use a bigger can.”
There have been many threads concerning DCC systems. I suggest you use the “Search The Community” function. Use the key words “DCC” and see what turns up, i.e. “The ‘bigger’ can!”
For my application; a 4’x8’ table top pike, I chose the now, or soon to be defunct Bachmann system.
It is an infrared wireless system that requires line of sight from the controller to the command station. I added a 5 amp booster.
It fits my needs very well.
I also have set up a standalone programming track using JMRI on my Mac through a Digitrax PR3.
If I had the chance to do it over again I would have chose the NEC system simply for the ergonomics of the throttle.
Many folks here in these forums, and else where, have had good luck with the Digitrax systems.
In the end the expenditure will be about the same for a starter set no matter the manufacturer.
Since the standardization of DCC systems; through the efforts of the National Model Railroad Association (NMRA), all DCC systems are compatible with what ever NMRA compliant decoders are installed in your locomotives. (There are some “packet” driven systems that have evolved outside of the NMRA standars that may or may not be compatible.)
One question/concern is, are you associated or will you be associated with a club or group that uses a particular manufacturers DCC system?
If you are/will then research what system they use and consider that particular one.
Hope this helps.
Hi,
This is an often discussed (and cussed) question… The end result of many of these threads is to go with Digitrax or NCE. You can’t go wrong with either.
Welcome to the forum. It’s such a frequently asked question that you might get a less than stellar response. 5 locos puts you beyond the starter sets.
We just had a fairly informative thread of the various permutations of the NCE line http://cs.trains.com/mrr/f/744/t/259997.aspx
There is a definite learning curve to DCC. Don’t be afraid to invest in a couple of books. Stay away from MTH DCS. Digitrax and NCE have most of the US market in serious DCC. If you also run at a club or with friends, like brands are more important than if you are a lone wolf.
I can run three sound locos with the NCE Power Cab. I have more locos but running three at one time is intensive. I have left the others on side tracks powered down. Locos just sitting even on a powered track draw little power.
Easy to use is a relative term. There is a learning curve for any system. Read the manual I see in many forums.
You can get an NCE booster for the Power cab.
You can buy the five amp Power Pro like my club has. We have run at least ten sound locos which required about three amps.
NCE and Digitrax show all the specs at their web sites with manuals that you can download.
Make sure you set up a program track.
I know the Power Pro has a setup to disconnect the main when using the program track. The club also uses a DPDT switch to disconnect the program track which is at the end of the yard ladder.
Some physically move the loco tor a program track. Your choice.
A few have re-programmed all their locos when not paying attention.
Rich
Hey Dmmr714:
Welcome to the forums!! [#welcome]
I’m an NCE fan. NCE has almost never received any negative comments in the numerous discussions that have been had on the subject in the past. Digitrax gets a few negative comments but most users are pleased with their systems.
The NCE Power Cab starter set is too small to run five locomotives, but you can pair it with an SB5 booster to get a 5 amp system on your layout. One advantage of doing it this way is that you can take the Power Cab itself to your workbench and it will operate as a fully featured stand alone system for working with individual locomotives. This option is also cheaper than the PH-Pro 5 amp system.
The PH-Pro 5 amp system is very popular but it doesn’t actually have a lot more features than the Power Cab/SB5 combo, and you lose the option of having a stand alone DCC system at your workbench.
Something very worth considering is wireless radio throttles. The price is higher but you won’t be getting tangled up in throttle cords.
Tony’s Train Exchange has much better prices than NCE itself:
Dave
I would check out RailPro. It’s easier to use, is radio control out of the box-no extra charge, can handle your 5 locomotives plus more, no programing CVs, Works on Digitrax and NCE systems.
It’s super easy to MU locomotives. It’s the only system I have used where you can run multiple lead engines and pushers that doesn’t derail the cars in between the two sets of locomotives. Even up hills and around corners.
I had a Digitrax system that I threw out, and now have NCE and RailPro together. I use the RailPro system for MU running. It’s great.
I went through this choice process in 2012. I was building a very modest 5 x 10 HO layoutand figured two trains at a time. Probably could have got by with a starter set depending on individual loco draws. I like consists so two trains means 4-6 locos running. I decided to go for 5 amps, conservative for my case.
I concluded back then that Digitrax or NCE were for me, and reading since then would still conclude the same. Most will advise that you should try out your finalists if you can…how the throttles operate, hpw to change the address and cvs, etc. I liked the fact that Digitrax offers various components like reversers but discovered that such downstream components can come from any vendor as NMRA specs / standardization provide compatibility. I chose NCE partly because I like the physical throttle buttons better, of all things. Pure preference.
How large is your layout? The question is not for the power you will need, rather whether you will want to go radio control.
I have an NCE Power Cab which is adaquate to about 3 sound locos running at one time. To run more than that it should have a 5 amp booster. Since I may run more than 3 locos at a time when I expand, I have looked into the booster. I don’t plan to go radio, as my plan is for a 7’x14’ around the room shelf, easily reached with the the thethered control. If you are not going radio control, it is cheaper to get the NCE starter set and SB5, than to buy the Power Pro. Not sure of the combined pricing for other brands.
One other feature with the NCE is that the Power Pro hand held can be used if you go to a layout with a Power Cab set up. Not sure if starter set control can be used on upgraded systems with the other brands.
Good luck,
Richard
Digitrax is and always has been fully upgradable - nothing they have ever made, witht he exception of one special throttle adapter plug, is unusable with the most recent products. I even picked up one of the first throttles for cheap on eBay, and while it IS capable of programming, you wouldn’t want to use it for that, but it does make a great train running throttle. I started with a Zephyr, added a throttle, then added a DB150 booster for extra power. None of the lower level parts is set aside when expanding, and even the lowest level system has all the features - dedicated program track with read and write, access to all 30 functions, all the accessories work with any of the systems, so if you only have a small layout easily handled by the Zephyr you can still add block detection and signals.
Non-user upgrades are all fairly priced - if you go plug-in throttle now but want to add radio later, the cost of upgrading the throttle to radio is exactly the same as the price difference between a new wired and radio throttle. IE the plug in throttle may be $100 and the radio one $150. If you buy a plug in one today, Digitrax will later convert it to radio for you for $50.
–Randy
I started with Lenz, went to NCE radio, then to Digitrax DCS100 with duplex radio throttles and am now back to Lenz with their 23151 Ethernet adapter using Tam Valley boosters and iphones with Touch Cab throttles.
I wasted a lot of money chasing the NCE and Digitrax truck. If I were to try something new, it would be the DR5000 http://www.digikeijs.com/dr5000-adj-dcc-multi-bus-central.html Perhaps the cheapest, most powerful DCC system out there.
This is why I am not a fan of dead-end systems like the simplistic EZ-Command (which they don;t make any more) or the old MRC systems, or the Dynamis. You have to buy a whole new system to upgrade.
But why in the name of the almighty dollar would you buy FOUR different complete DCC systems? There is NOTHING you can do with one you can’t with the other. Pick one and stick with it - at least startying with either the most basic NCE or Digitrax system there is nothing to throw away if later you want or need more, just buy more stuff and attach it to what you have, no need to scrap it all and buy a whole new system.
–Randy
joe-daddy:
I’m curious to know why you rejected the NCE and Digitrax systems.
Dave
Randy,
I know I’ve mentioned it before but I did get my “feet wet” with the E-Z Command to see if I’d like DCC or not. I only paid $53 for it (MSRP was $100) and it’s what I could afford at the time. I enjoyed it for the year I had it (my layout was simple) but knew full-well it’s limitations before purchasing it. The Power Cab was released the following year. I had more discretionary funds at that point and made the migration to a more powerful DCC starter system.
The E-Z Command - albeit limited - did deliver what it promised. I wouldn’t have paid $100 for it though. And I laugh when I see them priced at train shows nowadays (no locomotive) for $125. [:O]
I do, however, agree with you on the Dynamis. It was a stripped down version of the ESU ECos and upgrades were ridiculous. A 5A power booster had an MSRP of $300 and, IIRC, the Dynamis still couldn’t do some things the Power Cab & Zephyr did (and less expensely).
Tom
A few thoughts from someone who has used a lot of other peoples DCC systems, but does not use it on their own layout.
I considered DCC on three seperate occassions over the last 20 years. If my modeling goals were different, I would have bought this with radio throttles:
http://www.cvpusa.com/easydcc_system.php
My second choice would be NCE.
The ergonomics of the Digitrax throttle do not suit my chubby fingers - too many buttons, too close together…
I don’t care if it is only a 4x8, I don’t see the point in DCC without radio throttles.
Even in DC I use wireless radio throttles today.
The whole point of DCC is to be the “Engineer” - the Engineer should be with his train…
Sheldon
I use an NCE wireless system on my layout, and I agree with Sheldon that wireless is an invaluable addition to DCC. However, if you never plan to expand your layout beyond a 4 x 8 dimension, then I don’t think that wireless is all that beneficial.
As far as being the “engineer” is concerned, I take a different point of view, particularly because I usually operate several trains at the same time. I consider myself more in the nature of a control tower operator than the engineer.
Rich
You are a braver man than me Rich. I run mutliple trains as well. But when I do that with out a crew, each train is on a deticated display loop - that does not require DCC at all…
And yes, in that case it is the old fashioned “dispatcher” setup, who has a good view of a large portion of the layout…
Sheldon
Recall though that I have a double mainline, each with 185 feet of track, plus a large yard, so my layout can accommodate multiple trains.
Thanks everyone for the great info! I believe I’m going to go with the NCE system, it seems to be the most popular choice and easiest to work with!
On my last layout I could reach every point from one plug in with my throttle, so I never bothered to upgrade it to radio. One strategically placed plug panel and the cord reached all areas so I could follow my train. That was a 9x12 room or thereabouts. For a 4x8m any of the plug-in systems has a cord long enough to reach all areas without having to plug and unplug constantly. And you won;t be tripping over it, at least with Digitrax, they use coiled cords so there is no slack laying on the floor to trip over. NCE does too - for the ProCabs, the special cable needed for the PowerCab is not coiled.
The club uses wireless throttles - when the layout is over 140 feet long, and you have a dozen people running trains, cords don’t work as well. It is not really a hassle to use corded throttles on a large layout, provided enough plug panels are provided. We ran that way for years on the old club I belonged to, in the pre-DCC days. MRC Controlmaster 20 and a CMI Hogger, both with wired throttles, you can still walk around and follow your train and not be parked in some “elevated cab” perch like was common on old clubs. Same with wired DCC throttles, you can unplug and move to stay with your train and it won’t stop in between.
–Randy