are these considered DCC friendly? I sure hope so I have 23 on them[?]
Short answer “LOOKS LIKE IT”
LONG answer get an VOM (volts/ohms meter and check for a connection from ANY RAIL at ANY LOCATION to the FROG. The frog should have croaked (DEAD) then it is DCC Friendly to a point.
Take Care
George P.
The real answer is all turnouts are (are not) DCC friendly. Hook them up and see. If the frog is not isolated you will have to gap the two frog rails. You may have to power the frog in either case depending on the engines used.
Thanks going to check now
To power the frog will it need an auto-reverser?
Not an auto-reverser, but some way to change which rail power reaches the frog. How one does this depends on how the turnout is controlled. With a manual turnout it is difficult to power the frog, but there are a few manual devices that have switching circuits in them. The circitron slow motion Tortoise drives have a set of contacts in them for powering the frog. Often people will just include a second set of contacts in the switch that changes the turnout to power it.
Yes, they are. The frog IS isolated, hence the eylets on the side to hook wires to power them. REALLY odl Atlas Custom-Line had all-rail frogs which needed gaps, and were power rotuing. But those are all live, with insulated frogs just like the newer ones with blackened frogs.
BTW DCC Friendly more refers to the point and stock rails than the frog. If the point and adjacent stock rail carry the same polarity, it’s DCC friendly. Lookd that the rivet where the points pivot. That metal section extends under the stock rail nearest it, tying it all together electrically. Plus the throwbar is plastic which insuates the two point rails from one another. Some turnouts have a non-insulated throwbar, and both point rails take the polarity of the stock rail they are pressing against. With less than ideal wheelsets, it is possible for a wheel to short between the stock raila nd the otherwise open point rail in this case. It’s not too likely if you have properly gauged RP25 wheels in all your rolling stock…
Bottom line though, those Atlas turnouts are DCC friendly.
-Randy
Thanks that makes me feel better
Any turnout can be DCC-friendly if the alternative is throwing them out…
Randy gives excellent advice.
You can check from each stock rail to the adjacent point rail (with point open - not touching) with an ohmmeter. A DCC friendly turnout will read zero ohms for each side and infinity side to side.
If you’re really paranoid, check the frog too and check rail to rail on either end of the frog for continuity. (The TO should have hidden jumpers). It’s easy to see what should and should not be connected by imagining the train’s path.
You may not need to power the frog at all unless you use engines with few pickups.
What am I missing here?
I wouldn’t think DCC issues would arise from the frog, but rather from the point rails. Shouldn’t the point rail on the “open” side be dead to avoid a possible short with only the “closed” point rail powered? Thus, I’d think the point rails would need to be separately powered (one powered and one dead, depending n how the turnout is thrown) and isolated from the frog.
As long as the polarity of each point rail matchs its neighboring stock rail, you can’t get a short. No need to power each point rail individually or otherwise go crazy. If you go to the trouble to insulate the point rails from each other (plastic throwbar, or a PC board tie with the cladding gapped in the middle), you might as well just tie each point rail to the nearest stock rail. This is the way Atlas and others do it.
For ultimate reliability, some flexible feeders jumpering the point rails to the stock rails (or sometimes the closure rails, since they often have a reliable track feed - ie in Atlas turnout the closure rails are actually continuous with the rails ont he exit side of the turnout) so the point rails don’t have to rely on a rivet or a small wiper that runs against the stock rail for power can help.
–Randy
I’m curious. I’ve read many times that Atlas turnouts are DCC friendly. But, I have several on my temporary layout and the almost always short out my Prodigy Express when my locos go over them. As near as I can tell, the “tire” on the wheels is wide enough to short across the diverging inside track and main outside track. My temporary solution to this was to put some liquid electrical tape on the diverging rail. My question is Has anybody else experienced this?
Sorry if this appears to be a hijack, but the topic fit and the pictures are of Atlas turnouts, so it is related.
Thanks,
Darrin
Which Atlas turnouts do you have? The only ones I know for sure were not DCC friendly were the ORIGINAL Custom-Line and thoses go WAY back. CL Mark II and newer would all be DCC friendly. The only way the wheels can touch where you mention is if they have way too wide a tread (non-RP25 profile) or are way out of gauge. Especially with a dead frog. You might want to take one of the offending trucks and slowly roll it through and see exactly where this short is happening. The gaps around the frog area are generally wider than NMRA spec on Atlas turnouts precisely to eliminate such trouble (however it can make for rough riding and bounces).
–Randy
126 Atlas Turnouts and 22 Walthers Code 83 Turnouts later I can give you this insight.
The ONLY way to short and Atlas turnout with the “FROG EARS” is to have a out of gauge Metal wheel set. I have shorted these with a BLI pilot truck, a Kadee Metal wheel set and a OLD AHM Y6b tender. ALL where because of out of gauge wheels.
Now the BAD PART 15% of the turnouts where OUT OF GAUGE at the points OR the frogs where to high. Some of the stock rails where bent also. Gauge all your turnouts and wheel sets. Install the turnouts and enjoy!!
Hope this helps a little
I’m pretty sure I’m switching to making my own with Fast Tracks for the rest of the layout, at least the common ones. The Fast Tracks tooling is too expensive to makes onesy-twosies. But for the common sizes it ends up being cheaper than Atlas while making a better quality turnout than Peco. I watched them in person at the National plus have watched the videos, and I am convinced I can do this.
–Randy
Check out www.wiringfordcc.com it is a fantastic site for all things track and turnouts.
Geoff Walker, Windsor, UK [:)]
Keep me up to date on that idea. Reason is that the next railroad we work on after mine has 2,300 ft of track and around 650 turnouts. The owner is using #6 or larger for all his. Wants to hand lay all turnouts and use Micro Scale flex track. Just wondering how big of a can of worms is he getting into?
He saw all the fun I had with teh forgs and points and some junk that was on the market.
Probably going to be a while before I do any more work. If you hit the Fastracks web site you can download all the videos - I think. The one is a bit over an hour long and shows the entire process from start to finish. They handed out CDs with the videos and instruction sheets (which are also downloadable) at the National Train Show - since it would be nearly impossible for me to download a 1 hour video on my internet connection.
–Randy
Frankly, that is going to be a ton of work, but if you want first class turnouts and have the determination and time to do it all, by all means do so. I have a total of 9 turnouts on my new layout, so I probably have not saved any money…haven’t figured it out…but the frogs, alone, are worth the effort and time. You will develop a serious grip from all that filing, too.
Remember, about one hour per turnout once you get familiar with what really counts and once your skills are up to speed. The frogs, though, are super slick, tolerances so good that you don’t need the commercial type fill in them, and a hand-pushed truck feels silky smooth rolling through the frog with one finger pressing down on the truck pivot to get a good sense of it. Mine are #8’s, and gosh are they purdy. I can slam a speeding Niagara towing heavyweights through them at scale limited speeds as if the turnouts arent’t even there!
Fannblade, there seems to be a lot of confusion here. I think the safe thing to do would be to just send all of your turnouts directly to me then go out and buy new ones…