I’m impressed with my DSD equipped diesels, (and my Tsunami steam) and patiently awaiting Tsunami decoders for diesels. Since our club displays in large venues at times,sound equipped engines tend to get lost in the noise of the hall. That being said, I’ve had one really sick idea here. Could you replace all the fans on a GP-38 with etched brass, mount a baffle plate above the driveline,(to form an enclosure)and mount a speaker beneath the fan openings. Could the decoder (Tsunami) power 3 speakers and would it be much louder???
I was going to use a P2K 38, yeah, I know I’ll have to sacrefice some of the built in weight but thats ok, as we usually run multiple unit lash ups anyway. This one’s meant to be a show stopper, not neccessarily a puller.[;)]
karlb
do you have all the sounds turned up or can you do that with the sound decoder you have. My QSI equipted Atlas I can adjust the volume controls on each sound function seperately and the main volume to make it louder or quieter.
Ohhh, I’ve got all the volume CVs set to 255. In my basement, it’s plenty loud. When I’m at the Cow Palace, along with a few thousand people and 8-10 other layouts making noise, the HO engines get lost. [V]
I’ve heard a few of the larger scale guys from across the hall,[:(!]
The higher power output and speaker size in the larger scales is why you can hear them from across the hall. In HO scale you can’t get a powerful enough amplifier onto a sound decoder to compete with O or G scale sytems.
his brings up an interesting subject, one I have been playing with…scale sound. Of course we all want our locos to sound as big as the real thing, and its quite possible with an external speaker and such, but the moment you have 4 or 5 ‘rumblers’ going at once, you lose all sence of scale and usually become overwhelmed with the sounds. Anyone who has been to a train show with all the noise going on will know what I am talking about.
Now…the Idea of scale sound is to localize the sound to the area of the locomotive (Ie…the locomotive should dissapear WITH its sound as it enters a tunnel). This concept will also allow many mulitples of locos running on a layout not to overwhelm eachother with sound.
Just an Idea
David
The sounds systems seem strained, and the sound, which cannot be of high fidelity due to the constraints of size and shape of the enclosures, suffers as a result. At least, that is what my ear tells me when I first receive a QSI loco. So, I always tune my system on each loco and usually reduce the volume by near 30%. This has the effect of isolating each loco on the layout, since they now have much less energy input to the sound, and makes the individual sounds more pleasant. Why QSI sends out their systems at full volume I’ll never know.
selector.
On my QSI equipes atlas the speaker face each other. Can i turn them out or do they do this for a purpose.
Karl,
I really feel you need to re-think the ‘compete with the large scale sound’ folks at train shows. There is so much overall crowd noise at these events. The sound just is not real good in this enviroment. I am not sure, but if you can find speakers small enough to fit under each fan, you are really not going to improve the total sound. The size of the speaker/enclosure/amplifier all play a part in what output you get. At our club open house, we had a lot of sound engines running and even these get drowned out after 12-15 folks are talking in the room(27’ by 27’ layout). At home(20’ by 25’ layout space), I have reduced the volume on my QSI sound engines to about 50%. I find that having the sound just above background noise seems to work best; not hearing the train until it is close gives the illusion of distance travelled. On a lot of layouts, you can hear the train all over the room - just a lot of noise…
Jim
[#ditto] Having been in this situation and dealt with it for years, I can say you are fighting a loosing battle. Even if you get the locomotive louder it will just add to the noise and the big scale and “static” sound system people will just turn theirs up louder…
I would guess that the overall sound quality would go down (even when it is alone at home) when striving for the increase volume.
From the technical stand point 3 speakers are going to be hard to work with anyway. Putting all three in parallel would result in what 3 ohms and probably fry the amplifier. Putting three in series would be 32 ohms, and there goes your volume. To keep the ohms at 8 (At least I think Tsunami stuck with expecting 8 ohm speakers), three speakers would have to be arranged one in series with the other two in parallel. That means the one in series would need twice the wattage rating of the other two.
Even then one would have to calculate the speaker cone surface area of the three tiny upward firing speakers as opposed to the area of the current. Because “Pie are Square” [sic] circles don’t loose area linearly. A circle with 1/2 the diameter has less than 1/2 the area. So two 1/2" speakers is not equal to one 1" speaker, infact three 1/2" speakers does not equal a single 1" as below:
1" speaker cone area (ignoring the 3D slope of cone) = 0.79 square inches.
3/4" speaker cone area (ditto) = 0.44 square inches.
1/2" speaker cone area (ditto) = 0.196 square inches. X 3 = 0.59 square inches.
You mean there is a “Cow Palace” someplace other than Lamar Colorado?
The amount of air the speakers are moving would be the same, so no it wouldn’t make them louder ( I had the same thought on my BLI’s)
Ken.
Yeah, it’s on the Maryland State Fairgrounds, and come the last week of August, 1st week of September, It gets filled with all sorts of cows,and You can imagine, the smell is still there for the October train shows!
Smoke units are the least of your worries!!! LOL!
I have had some thoughts about the sound in my locos getting lost in the overall ‘kerfuffel’ at shows. I intend to fit a cloth ‘roof’ over the layout, forcing the sounds out of the front of the layout, towards the crowd, rather than up into the large hall.
I have a similar cloth top fitted to my English layout to keep out the light.
BTW, the sound-chipped locos I have done myself, also sound loud enough with a single speaker
http://www.railimages.com/gallery/album508/aag
Jon
I’ve thought about a second smaller speaker, some decoders are now comming with two. I too find turning the volume down on my sound units provides a clearer, less annoying sound. Of course, when you have half a dozen or so running or idling, you CAN"T escape!!!
Regrettably, I am not an acoustic engineer, so I cannot say for sure. If the speakers are in phase and phacing one another (okay, it’s a gag!) it would seem to me that they would tend to reinforce each other’s wavefronts, thus adding to their efficiency…not to mention sound. On the other hand, if they are not in phase, the opposite could be true. Perhaps someone more knowledgeable than I could pipe up.
It was more or less I curiosity thing than anything. thanks for the reply.