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Death toll rises in Lac-Mégantic, first accident victim identified
Ok, so now we need reporters & researchers about the Transportation Safety Board of Canada to stop, look, listen, dig, report.
There are various conflicting understandings of train brake system operation outlined in the comments on the articles here since July 9th. If this railroading community can’t get straight on how they operate, can we expect some reporter from the Guardian or newspaper “XYZ” to get it right? Do we once again have to rely on “The NYT” to shed some light?
Patience is always in short supply after a tragic event such as this. Let a complete investigation be done-the Canadians are well capable of doing this-so that factual true answers emerge. Too many unqualified sources are expressing opinions. Time will provide the facts.
We should pray for the victims and their families
Something doesn’t seem right. The engineer & fire department were thrown under the bus way too early. I would love to see more photos of the locomotives. There’s a siding nearby where the locomotive fire occured. I wonder if the train was in the siding or on the mainline? The cause of the derailment & ethanol fire last year here in Columbus is still undetermined. We will be waiting a long time for answers.
I hope you realize, Mr. Norton, that 1-man crews are also used here in America, though as in Canada, are very rare. The MM&A also runs through Maine and uses 1-man crews in the state of Maine as well. Additionally, there are other American railroads, such as the Indiana Rail Road, which occasionally use 1-man crews.
The Canadian government should have never allowed the use of 1 man crews. There is much blame to be had by this decision alone.
One man crew!! With two people, you have two sets of eyes, two sets of ears and two people checking on each other. Sure, there will always be mistakes made, but less often when there ate two experienced people involved. The salaries are miniscule when compared to what the railroad is going to have to pay for this accident.
@JARRETT GERBER - The train was on the mainline.
Note the following:
- The engineer/conductor/coffeemaker/cleaner/safety guru (it’s the same person, it’s a one man crew) finished his shift, and, rightly, left the train to go to bed for the night (do you really want someone without sleep driving a train? Thought not.) He may or may not have engaged the handbrakes.
- Nobody relieved him at that point, he was just expected to leave the train unattended.
- The train was on the main line, not a siding, something that was presumably known to the dispatchers.
- Oh, did I mention that the engine was apparently in a state of poor disrepair, to the point that the engineer/coffeemaker/window cleaner/flight attendant/gardener/safety wizard actually complained about it to the taxi driver on the way to his hotel?
Every single one of these four issues is the result of policy issues by the railroad. And any one of those issues, had it not happened, would have meant no runaway train.
- Had he been part of a proper crew, there’d have been no reason to leave the train completely unattended.
- Had the engineer been relieved, there’d have been qualified staff maintaining the train, handling the initial engine fire, and ensuring the train was safe.
- Had the train been on a (properly set up) siding, it would have derailed and stopped where it was if it had moved without authorization.
- Had the engine been properly checked, or assuming the problems only came to light once the journey started, relief staff had been sent to replace the engine, there’d have been no engine fire in the first place.
So… what does it tell us? Well, this is Canada, so I don’t know who’s investigating it, but I can tell you two things:
- The railroad’s pointing fingers in the hope that nobody realizes this was very obviously its fault.
- If this were investigated by the NTSB, with the FRA issuing rules on the basis of the report, a
One person crew,how much money can this railroad be making for this guy???But,not enough to keep up with the Walton family…
This is what happens when businesses hire workers at less pay. They are only going to get inferior workers; also by cutting the crew down to ONE man there’s no one to remind him to go the safe course and do the safe thing. In this case, This engineer did not tie down a SUFFICIENT number of hand brakes as per GCOR rule 7.6
There must be a forensic investigation before the wreckage is cleared away. Even with the car pile-up and fire, it seems likely that the hand brake assemblies could be examined, to see how much chain was taken up in them, even if the rest of the rigging is destroyed.
It’s negligent to allow such a potential disaster without serious precautions as others noted, to make it impossible for the train to get away, even with brake failure.
It seems the issue of the engine running after the fire is irrelevant. With air brakes applied, what use would pumping up the air line do?
Perhaps the locomotive fire was set as a distraction so an operator or two could stealthily release hand brakes during the event. Later the train would roll, after the reservoirs bleeded off, or were deliberately bleeded to speed up the process.
Who would do this? I doubt “environmental extremists” unless they were complete dupes (patsies).
An event like this causes public attitudes to change, and the Keystone pipeline up to now has been unpopular. Railroad competition was something they didn’t expect, and don’t want. Yes I think they are that evil. After all we see endless wars for oil, this is a small skirmish.
I know it sounds extreme, but look what has happened since this “new American century” has begun.
The victims in Quebec are just “collateral damage”.
Or it could have been a tragic accident, but it was still a catastrophe waiting to happen, and the railroad’s cheapness is to blame anyway. If it was made to happen on purpose, they sure made it easy.
I will point out that many commuter operations use 1 person crews in the head end. If you want a clear explanation of how a railroad trains brakes work see Ed Blysard’s comments in the Trains forum thread on the accident. My sympathies to the town of Lac-Megantic, Quebec.
I will point out that many commuter operations use 1 person crews in the head end. If you want a clear explanation of how a railroad trains brakes work see Ed Blysard’s comments in the Trains forum thread on the accident. My sympathies to the town of Lac-Megantic, Quebec.
I think it’s too soon to blame the engineer for this accident. Most rule books tell you to set “sufficient” hand brakes to secure the train. Mr. Burkhardt said 11 wasn’t enough. So Mr. Burkhardt,
how many would be enough? The engineer left there with 5 locomotives that had their engine brakes applied and 11 cars with their hand brakes applied. The engineer was not aware the locomotives had been shut down. The engineer should have known the tons in his train but probably didn’t know the percentage of the grade he was on.
Victims:
Charity Search Engine - isearchigive.com - Canadians can use
Victims:
Charity Search Engine - isearchigive.com - Canadians can use
Studying a map, one can see that this road is full of twists and turns, especially from Sherbrooke into Maine. This type of road may have been safe when trains had less than 40 -50 cars or so,but nowadays with 75 or more ?? What is the speed at which they operate ? Also, antiquated infrastructure is found along ,for example, the old,dangerous bridge in Cowansville. No wonder , the mayors of several towns along the railroad are meeting next week to assess this worrysome situation.
Studying a map, one can see that this road is full of twists and turns, especially from Sherbrooke into Maine. This type of road may have been safe when trains had less than 40 -50 cars or so,but nowadays with 75 or more ?? What is the speed at which they operate ? Also, antiquated infrastructure is found along ,for example, the old,dangerous bridge in Cowansville. No wonder , the mayors of several towns along the railroad are meeting next week to assess this worrysome situation.
Studying a map, one can see that this road is full of twists and turns, especially from Sherbrooke into Maine. This type of road may have been safe when trains had less than 40 -50 cars or so,but nowadays with 75 or more ?? What is the speed at which they operate ? Also, antiquated infrastructure is found along ,for example, the old,dangerous bridge in Cowansville. No wonder , the mayors of several towns along the railroad are meeting next week to assess this worrysome situation.