as a child my fauther in so cal rode the pacific electric up one side of so cal to the other. at one time p.e dominated los angeles. but buses took over and now all that remains is a runing museum in paris california. do u remember the big red cars?
I don’t remember the red cars, but I do thank you for changing your sig.
I managed to catch a ride during the last gasp of the Long Beach line, just before all passenger service ceased.
The thing that got my attention was the sight of diesel switchers with trolley poles working freight along the way. Seems the signals used the overhead for detection, so the freight hogs had otherwise-useless poles to activate them.
Chuck
thats funny my dad has told me that as well. at least the long beach line is somewhat the same it runs down the same stretch it used to. it makes u wounder why they took it out in the first place?
At the time they were perceived as old being fashioned and uneconomical.
I remember the Red Cars in Long Beach as my grand parents lived there.Often when my brother and I visited them we would drive along Long Beach Blvd. to see the Red Cars.Once they took us on the PE to LA,where we had lunch then back.Once I saw what at the time I thoight was a wood baggage car.This was most likely a line car.When I was told that they were going to tear out the Red Cars I remember saying,“WhenI grow up I’m going to put them back in”.Fortunately,the folly of tearing out the system was realized,and the line was rebuilt.
have u ever gone to orange empire railway museum. in parris california they have a running museum full of all trolleys an steam locomotives and diesels. the kids have a blast riding the rails and those like my father remember the good old days. they have 7 redcars of all sorts.
I remember the red cars (also wide gauge yellow cars). I rode the “Hollywood” cars from the Valley into LA many times over Chuenga Pass in the fway median. I took my 2 sons for a ride on the Long Beach line just before abandonment. What the nostalga/conspiracy folks tend to forget is that most of those lines that look so efficient on a map involved street running which seriously impacted (negatively) their efficiency. The current “replacments” all involve dedicated rights of way separated from automobile traffic.
excactly right about sharing the streets, however the p.e made californias light rail the best in the nation at the time. and if not for the politics of bringing buses into the picture. atleast some of there lines would have survived. the big push for buses burries trollys. when they realized buses poluted more than trollys it was to late. thus the reconstruction continues today.with 4 lines that existed before being rebuilt and 2 more on the way it just seems they wasted alot of money rebuilding old lines had they not tookin them out in the first place.
You can still ride the Red Cars in San Pedro…
http://www.heritagetrolley.org/planSanPedroRTOL4.htm
as well as at the Perris museum…
http://www.oerm.org/
…and theres been very serious talk about town to bring back the Red Cars to downtown Los Angeles as both tourist draw and active part of the transit system.
The Los Angeles Railway (yellow cars) were narrow gauge. I believe 3-ft gauge.
Good to see someone that appreciates the Big Reds.
When I was in high school I read a really neat hard cover book about Trolleys in the school’s library. It was hard to put that book down. Had a nicely detailed history of the Pacific Electrics system and the famouts “Big Red” cars. Clean, cheap and convenient to use system that rivaled some of today’s Europeon and Japanese interurban railways.
Truly a trajedy that corporate greed ruled the roost and led to the system’s scrapping.Today’s clogged freeways are the price that Californians, and we in general as a nation, are still paying.
mkt_fan; You need to check out the public library there in Memphis; They used to have quite a collection of photos referencing the Memphis Street Railway there. At one time there was quite a net of trolley lines and even interurbans ( that why Jackson Ave has a median in some locations). The East End Steam Dummy line out Madison Ave to an old amusemant park in the area just north of the Dairy west of Overton Square.
Just as we have some last vestages of the “KATY” here in SE Kansas. The Pacific Electric was quite an operation, you can still get your “trolley fix” close to home.
Good Hunting!
The conversion of rail to buses started even before the rail system reached its maximum extent. Many lines did not have the ridership to justify trains and the infrastructure required for them. Most lines with adequate ridership for rail were still money loosers. Rail passenger systems were then and are today money pits. Corporations are set up to make money for their stockholders. They must eventually shed unprofitable operations or go out of business. That is not greed. Even in pre auto days rail transit was at best marginally profitable. Many systems failed long before the public turned to autos.
The last rail operations on the PE (and many other systems) were shut down under public (not private) ownership. At the time public sentiment and the politicians (in many regions) favored conversion to buses. The trains on the streets got in the way of the autos. Separate R/W and grade separations were and are very expensive.
I tried to research the costs of the automobile vs rail transit. My conclusion (using data from pro mass transit sites) is that the per passenger mile cost to society (including direct costs paid by car owners, police, fire & rescue, pollution of all types, roads no
has anyone gotten a chance to go to parris california?
I’ve been to Perris, California at least a dozen times. Great museum.
LAs yellow cars were 3’6" guage.Both guages are used at Perris.
Thankyou for the correction.
I was genralizing my comments. No one is de**nizing the automobile.
When I was attending community college years back, I read some very interesting sections of : Derailing America: General Motors mark of excellence.
Very good reading that covers some of what you’ve stated above as well as GM’s and several other corporations contributions to the rapid replacement of many rail transit operations with buses, which indeed were cheaper.
However, the author listed factual accounts of shady and illegal manipulating business practices to assure that the automobile, petroleum, and rubber industries would have less competition from electric railway systems. The fact that street and interurban railways were rarely profitable made it so much the easier, much to the regret of many communities today.