I wanted to go upscale a bit on my layout so I introduced 22" track to buy a BLI PRR T1 so it could run comfortably. After a few days it died - showing a short on the DCC system. I sent it in for warranty repairs but decided to get a replacement as the repairs were going to take about 10 weeks.
I bought a new BLI PRR T1 and right out of the box it jammed at speed step 1 or 2. Tried to “run it in” in case that was an issue but to no avail.
Now I have 2 BLI locos that won’t run or wont run properly. Do I just have bad luck or is this a problem with BLI products?
Don’t have any BLI steamers, but they sell a lot of them. I will say that 22" radius is the minimum, not really a “comfortable” radius. Models often run into issues at min R and you’re usually better off avoiding min R and operating on more generous curves if at all possible.
Which may or may not be related to your short in the first loco. Inadvertent contact due to too tight a radius can be one cause.
Not quite sure about jamming at speed step 1 or 2. Are you referring to the rods/valve gear hanging up? Does it run at step 3 or above? There are some adjustments of the CVs that could help with this, but the docs should indicate that, like setting Vmin to a different value, etc. If it’s a mechanical hitch in the rods/valve gear and runs at step 3 and above, continue the running in to see if it goes away.
Also, have you tried the factory reset of the decoder?
I had one of the first Broadway NYC J1e Hudson 4-6-4. It ran fine for a few years and then deeloped driver/side rod problems. BLI took it back and replaced it with a newer version. I bought my J1e as I was interested in seeing what sound was like. However, it did not really fit my layout. When they sent me the replacement I had made up my mind I would not keep it, so I sold it on Ebay. If BLI came out with a loco I could use (I’m a Northern Pacific modeler) I might consider another purchase. I will say their guarentees are rock solid!
I can understand your impatience, waiting for repairs on the first loco.
But, here is my suggestion on the second loco. Since it didn’t run correctly right out of the box, return it to the store where you bought it and get a refund.
Between my grandson and I we have five BLI locomotives and one other with the QSI/BLI sound/decoder. All steam. We have never had a mechanical problem with them where operation is concerned.
My Mikado and Hudson have been flawless for years and continue to be. We have 3 of the Paragon2 locos also flawless in normal operation. The problems with the P2 locos has been the smoker which has failed in the T-1 and the J1.
The last two locos operate well on the BRVRR’s outer mainline which has a 22-1/2" radius but bind a bit on the inner mainline of 20" radius.
If locos in question do not move or react to commands I would reset the decoders and try again.
I dont have the t1 but I do have 13 other BLI engines that run fine,some are 6 years old or older. Through the years I have tried just about every brand of dcc sound equipped engine and most have had an occasional black sheep in the flock. Keep your receipt and test run engines when you get them. May God Bless.
I have 2 BLI steamers, a Mikado, and N&W 611. The only issue I’ve ever had is with my Mike, the chuff sensor in it is a reed switch, and kept blowing out/breaking internally. (No fault of mine, poor choice for chuff sensor.) Both run very smoothly and very well otherwise.
Im thinking the newest one that is “jerky” might just be a bad apple. Sounds like maybe a bent rod/valve gear issue. (Being brand new, sounds like a trip back to place of purchase is in order…)
The electrical issue, BLI can fix. (Possibly even the “jerky” unit is fixable, or at least replaceable, but they do know electrical repair well.)
Now, I do not own any other steamers, as they really do not fit my era, but just had to have a couple for excursions…
At my club, we have 78 BLI steam engines on the roster. The vast majority run flawlessly. There have been occasional lemons from time to time. The owners send them back to BLI for repair, and they’ve never had to send the same one back again that I know of. I have some BLI steamers, and mine run great & pull well.
Bending a PRR T-1 around 22" curves does give one pause. Sort of like seeing a Boeing 707 do a barrel roll or having a C-130 land on a aircraft carrier. Oh, it can do it, but it’s not exactly a stress-free idea. [swg]
I would be very hesitant to run that loooooooong loco on 22" curves. Even though its centre two axles are blind (no flanges…unless they have changed the design, and I doubt it), those outer two sets of flanges, fore and aft, are set well enough apart that there must be some considerable flange friction on such tight curves. I could be wrong about this, but I have never exposed my T1, the first issue of them from 8 years ago or more, to curves less than 28".
Invert the locomotive, and with good lighting and some sort of magnifier, take a close look at the clearances between the rods, their pivots/axles, and the nuts securing the rods to their cranks. Ideally, power the tender trucks with wires and clips and turn the drivers slowly with your throttle. There may be an obvious bind. More than one BLI or expensive brass steamer has had to have nuts tightened or rods bent to clear others.
If it balks at speed step one or two, crank it up to 30 and nudge the loco along, if it speeds up and smooths out, it just needs a break-in.
My T1 is a fine loco, one of my top four. It’s a beast hauling heavyweights around my hilly layout.
The loco apprears to run fine on the 22" - in fact the first one died sitting (stopped) on the straight track in front of my control panel. The other one runs fine on higher speed steps - so I am doing what you suggest and let it run around the layout for a while and see if that loosens thing up a little.
Rich,
This was bought from a hobby shop but online. Most hobby stores that sell online ask you to return it for warranty service. However, I did ask BLI if they will give me a straight replacement and not waste 10 weeks on a repair.
I’m gong to see how it runs at lower speeds after the “break-in test run”. If it still acts jerky then I will open up the tender and do a manual reset to factory settings and try again.
Selector,
If the “break-in” run does not work I will certainly do as you suggest and take a look underneath. I have a lighted magnavisor so I can take a good close look.
Paul,
I just watched Tex Johnson do a barrel roll in a 707 - he said it was a safe 1G roll
P.S. I have to live with 22" curves - unless I convert the entire 2 car garage to a layout - and the missus is never going to allow that unless I sell all my power tools
OK, sounds good on 22" then. But it is somthing to keep in mind that you are about as tight as yoiu can get it to work per the factory. Even then, if something is a little out of place from where it was designed due to an assembley issue, it could be the source of a problem.
Yes, if it does run like that, you’re probably still needing more time for it to go around in circles. Keep in mind, for best overall results, run in one direction then in reverse, then turn and run in the other direction, then reverse and run it again. That helps deal with all such hitches, no matter which direction it’s going.
I ran it around the layout back and forth - forward and reverse and had high hopes it would run better. No luck.
So I too a long look at those rod/valve things and they look at lot like my errector set from long ago. So I decided to undo them one pair at a time to see if it was just one pair binding. After doing the whole set it ran just a little bit better - but still jams on speed step one. It may be something with the gears inside - except I really don’t want to open this up.
So my options are to run it speed step 3 or above until the original gets back to me and then send this one in for repair. Hopefully BLI will offer me a replacement before then - but I am not holding my breath. Didin’t even get a reply to my email telling them it was brand new and not working properly.
It’s a darn shame as I love the loco and it’s looks / the detail / sounds / pulling power / weight / CV config - it’s all great stuff - actually to my mind (and limited experience) it’s pretty exceptional. But all those fancy features don’t make up for it not runnning properly.
Chris,
I have a BLI T-1 from the original run.
While it runs well, it is starting to wear out despite relatively infrequent use.
The plating is worn off the drivers, and it makes gear noises that indicate premature wear.
Frankly, I have been disappointed with every non-brass steam engine I have ever purchased, with the notable exception of the Blackstone hon3 offerings.
They just don’t seem to have the durability or reliability of the old Japanese made brass.
To that end, I purchased an old Alco T-1 in brass, like this one: http://brasstrains.com/classic/Product/Detail/054861/HO-Brass-Model-Train-ALCO-Models-S-118-PRR-Pennsylvania-4-4-4-4-T-1-Duplex-5503-Custom
Brass steam engines have very simple mechanisms that are easy to work on.
North West Short Line makes replacement gearboxes and has can motors to upgrade the drives.
Some of my brass steamers are over 50 years old, and run as well as anything on the market today.
Get one of these, add some weight, change the motor, and you will have an engine that will last the rest of your life.
I’m curious. What’s the minimum radius for that Alco brass T1? I suspect it’s more than the OP’s mandated minimum of 22".
I agree that the better brass steam locomotives are extremely durable, and possibly a better value, especially if upgraded with improved motors and, possibly, new gearing. DCC and sound would be optional improvements. For that matter, the old Bowser/Penn Line T1 was an excellent performer, and would probably handle 22" curves, although the model’s details reflected the 60+ year old design.
Tom,
I am not sure about the minimum radius for the Alco T-1 as mine has never been on anything less than 36 inches.
The model does have a rather clever articulation scheme that is not noticeable until the engine is closely inspected.
This allows it to take much sharper curves than the Key engine, which is rigid (like the prototype) and has flanges on all drivers.
The Bowser presents several problems, as the stampings used to make the valve gear are quite rough by today’s standards, and the engine is powered by dual open frame motors.
This produces excessive current draw; converting the engine to can motors is very difficult, and installing a decoder is very challenging.
Just because the OP has 22 inch radius curves now does not mean he always will; he expressed dissatisfaction with the BLI offering, so I am simply pointing out an alternative.
With what he spent on the two BLI engines, he could have easily gotten an Alco.
As you know I am not as experienced as some perople here - or maybe most people here
Buying a brass loco and doing conversions of anything will be a big project. I am getting old and my eyesight is not what it used to be and my hands aint exactly steady. Most of the time I have to hope I can get those tiny screws back into whatever I have taken apart.
I bought the BLI PRR T1(s) to hopefully get a nice pulling loco in the PRR livery. However, its just become a nightmare and I know now its probably bad luck on my part - getting 2 lousy engines. But I cannot afford to spend anymore cash right now. Maybe I’ll use the old English method of repair and get a large hammer and “fix it”
The Engish method paid off - sort of. I got the top off the loco and found that one of the drive shafts was broken at the end. So only one set of wheels was being driven - the other set was being pulled along.
At least I can order a replacement part now and not have to wait for repairs.
Well the hammer and the graphite WORKED!!! - Symbolically of course.
I took some SLO-ZAP and fixed the drive shaft - took a lot of time and 3X maginfication on the magnavisor - but I fixed it. Took off the covers for the worm drive and put the drive shaft back in place. Reassembled the loco and it worked fine.
Funny thing is that this was so frustrating that I decided to strip the loco down myself - glad I did - now I know whats going on under the hood.
It looks like a computer inside - what happened to the live and negative wire and a motor??? Anyhoo, I am happy now - as long as the fix lasts.
Thanks for all the support everyone. One happy MR here.
I got 5 BLI steamers including the j1a with qsi sound never have a problem with it. The only ones that I had to sent back was the blue line 4-8-4 NYC Niagara which didn’t run from broken gear. The only other one which I had bli sent me the part was the PRR M1B which I repress the gear myself. I do like how bli customer support is quick to respond and they say it takes usually 4 to 6 weeks for shipping but I notice it usually quicker even when it international shipping. The most I waited for a replacement was 2 1/2 weeks
