Because block control required a central control panel limiting access to the layout, remotely controlled turnouts and decoupling were necessary. With DCC reducing the need for a control panel, and walk-around control putting more of the layout within reach, it seems that manually controlled turnouts and on the spot decoupling using skewer sticks is a more economical and operational alternative. Is this a desirable trend?
Your observation fits in with what many folks have migrated to once they converted to DCC and others have designed their layouts with this in mind. The ability to walk along with your train, throw switches by hand and uncouple where needed adds a lot of fun to operating. On the other hand, others still prefer remote control of switches and uncoupling. Which is desirable? It depends on what you want to get out of your personal model railroading experience.
Joe
Greg, That is why I have went with my tether less radio Digitrax system. Since my N scale layout is mostly industrial it is really fun to walk with the train. Stopping to hand throw switches as the crew would do and uncouple cars by hand as a crew person would do.
I’m sure you have looked at many layouts in magazines and online that are being built or have been recently constructed that use ground throws. I see it on many large ones being built not just small or medium layouts ones like mine.
Either way have fun!
Perhaps. I’m not a big fan of fixed magnets for uncoupelrs no matter what, especially not on the main. I did power all my turnouts, but the controls are on the fascia right in front of the turnout, not at a central control panel. I still have an idea that at some point I will have a dispatcher controlling the main line turnouts with select ones having the option for the DS to grant local control over. So I keep using powered switch machines instead of hand throws.
–Randy
Walk around throttles, manual thrown switches and manual uncoupling are what I want and use on my layout.
I’ve never liked block control, huge control panels, switches, buttons, lights, miles and miles of wire, automatic decouplers, etc. add too much complication. I adhere to the KISS method. All those other things just add more possibilities for something to go wrong (which will…guaranteed)
Besides, I model Colorado narrow gauge. You don’t find a whole lot of CTC type operations there.
Block control does not have to be done from a central control panel. It’s a common false assumption that block control requires a central panel full of block controls. Perhaps the false assumption persists because Atlas layouts and most beginner project layouts did feature a central panel.
Walk around control (wireless or tethered) is quite feasible in DC, with a very few local block toggles required for multi-train operation. By taking maximum advantage of schemes such as power routing and X-blocks, the number of blocks requiring toggle control can often be cut in half from the traditional scheme, while still retaining the desired operational flexibility.
Other block schemes such as route cab control and progressive cab control reduce or eliminate the “toggle flipping” associated with block control. Fully automated block control is also possible. MZL is a layered block control scheme that allows block control from multiple locations, depending on the operating scenario.
But that’s not your question. DCC has definitely accelerated the trend towards walk-around control, and the associated manual uncoupling and turnout throwing. That’s because all but a few DCC systems feature hand-held throttles either as standard or as add-ons. In DC, there are plenty of ways to implement walk-around control. But they are not prominently featured at the LHS. As to whether the trends away from remote uncou
I think it adds a new option. You can use it or not as you desire. And it doesn’t have to be all one or the other, you can mix the two. I like it myself. But that’s what makes this the best time to be in model railroading - so many different options.
Enjoy
Paul
Nope. Sheldon has demonstrated that you can do block control along the railroad, and that you can do walk-along with wireless throttles in DC too. It takes a pile of wiring, but is doable, if you enjoy that aspect of the hobby.
Up to you. I’d say it really depends on what you want to model - the crew on a local switching industries, throwing switches as they go, or dispatching a busy stretch of railroad from a central location.
Me - I have little room and are modeling the slowest possible kind of railroading (i.e local switching), which functionally stretches out whatever space I have. Stopping the train to throw switches by hand makes sense in that context.
If I had been modeling a busy station scene on the NE corridor with trains constantly arriving or departing, stopping to throw turnouts one by one by hand would make no sense whatsoever.
Smile,
Stein
Both Fred and Stein are correct: block control is quite compatible with walk-around throttles. While my layout is DC, I operate alone, so the entire layout is a single block, but I use walk-around throttles (tethered), manually-operated turnouts and manual uncoupling in most areas.
Wayne
Here I go being contrary again. I have all remote-control turnouts, which are wired to 4 separate panels around the fascia. I have permanent magnets as uncouplers for sidings, and a few electromagnets strategically placed on the mains so trains can be uncoupled when I want, not when I happen to stop over a magnet. But, that’s just my personal preference. Somehow, the “hand of God” reaching down from the sky doesn’t fit me.
Parts of my layout are as much as 3 feet from the edge, so it’s difficult to reach, and it may become impossible once scenery is in the way. That can be a problem for all-manual operation, so even if you do go with ground throws and skewers, consider using “power assisted” options where reach may be a problem. There’s no reason you can’t mix-and-match depending on the convenience of getting to a spot on the layout.
I wouldn’t worry that the use of DCC . Actually it’s use adds much more realism to the hobby than block control. I remember the days of spending more time worrying about the blocks and still trying to enjoy the running of the layout from sitting at a cab. The use of multiple units MUed or running separately within the power districts far outweigh the “old” DC block control. Speed matching , sound and other special effects are also a huge plus. On larger layouts radio controlled walk around is as close as you can get as if you’re actually running the train.
Turnout control can still be done by dispace or tower just as always. Turnout control can be ground throw, radio controlled and/ or still have facia control over the sw motor. If running singulary you can controll turnouts by radio throttle, facia control or ground throw. During ops, the dispatcher or tower can control all turnouts whether DC or Dcc.
Whether remote control is more or less important is much more a function of how the railroad is staffed than it is a matter of fancy electronics versus brute force and ignorance.
My layout, in its final form, will be set up to have a CTC board, local panels operated by the local station agents and some turnouts (to isolated spurs) which will have locally controlled manual actuators only. Those turnouts which have to be controlled from two or more locations will have electric actuators.
I prefer remote uncoupling, since the great hand of Bog is arthritic and somewhat unreliable when using a skewer as an uncoupling tool. There are also places in the Netherworld where uncoupling will occur where reaching in will be physically impossible.
I can easily see where, DCC notwithstanding, it would be very convenient to be able to throw the switch at the far end of a siding remotely. Suppose that’s the ONLY thing at the yonder end of a cul-de-sac aisle, with all the action designed to take place at the near end of that cul-de-sac. Walking 15 feet in and 15 feet back just to use one lousy ground throw would get old in a hurry, and detract from the pleasure of watching the train, since it’s rather more important to watch the interaction between body and surroundings when the body is in motion.
So, the need for remote control is pretty much layout, and operating style, specific. The only difference between DCC and a user-friendly analog DC system with almost the same characteristics is the complexity of the wiring behind the fascia.
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - analog DC, MZL system)
Well, as an “old timer” I started using block control with DC in the late 1950’s and used it until the early 80’s when Dynatrol came out with their system. I had panel boards all along the layout before Dynatrol using I think MRC handhelds that I could plug in, but still, I never was happy with DC because I spent more time moving from board to board and watching my train that I never was able to really enjoy it.
And operating sessions were more difficult, as visitors would have to “break in” using my operating system, collisions happened, switches weren’t thrown, toggles weren’t set, etc. So Dynatrol opened a new era, with a limited number of channels available on the “decoders” so that I had to keep track of the trains running and their channels to avoid you know what. When Dynatrol’s owner started phasing back and DCC was appearing, I even bought “dual operation decoders” that were made by NCE as I recall for the Dynatrol bunch. I decided to switch to DCC as DCC was starting to drop backwards, and chose NCE so my dual decoders would work. Those decoders are long gone, but I still use NCE and would NEVER NEVER NEVER go back to block control and DC. I am 74 and still operating with NCE on my three deck Santa Fe and enjoying operations even more.
As for uncoupling, I have skewers also, but still use some of the Kadee magnets on industrial tracks that would be hard to reach, and even on some yard switches so that I don’t have “beer bellies” dragging across the scenery or track in the foreground.
In short, I think we each adapt the technology to what we each can afford, understand, and so on. Oh, and I still walk down to a certain area of the layout and start a train and run it around without moving from where I am at times, especially when I am on tour or I just want to watch it run.
Bob