In gp69 an EMD engineer said that they were EMD concept locomotives that were designed.What were some of these concepts. Gary
We have a big thread around here about unbuilt locomotives that you may find of interest.
http://cs.trains.com/trn/f/741/t/220181.aspx?page=1
It includes “concept” locomotives that were proposed. But it also includes locomotives that went much further than the proposal stage before disappearing, including at least one EMD prototype that externally was nearing completion when the program was scuttled.
And it also covers other models that went so far that they were actively marketed to railroads (And presumably had been fully designed internally by EMD’s engineering department), but attracted no takers in the end so were never built.
How about the SD89MAC? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EMD_SD89MAC
Perhaps the BL1 #499 with pneumatic throttle? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/EMD_BL2
EMD always had one or two designers doing locomotive layout drawings in response to customer inquiries, mostly for export, and new model development initiated by sales or started internally within Engineering. When I returned to EMD in 1992 after a year with American Steel Foundries doing freight car truck development, I was first tasked with designing the SD80MAC, a year later I was working on the Amtrak inquiry that became the Acela (We were partnered with Siemens and AEG, our proposal was both electric and gas turbine power cars based on the German ICE) and the Long Island RR inquiry that became the DE30AC and DM30AC (which we regretted soon after the contract award). After that, I did some dual engine layouts for NS, several different 8-axle layouts for South Africa, some fuel cell locomotives, and a bunch of loco mods, like the SD70MAC’s for CSX that had provision for HotStart generators, which was carried over to the Alaska units with HEP. I’ve got a binder with 21 sheets of layout, work sketch, and production part numbers for just the 70’s and early 80’s with about 40 entries per page that are about 1/3 locomotive arrangements and the rest modification proposals. Most are for export, for example a JTS22LC for Thailand and there’s an domestic SD49. A bunch are electric locos when were working with ASEA on the GM6C and GM10B, such as the GM-D42B, no idea what that was. There’s the AMT125, several versions with different trucks, and F39P and F40P with steam generators. And the SD50T and GP50T, the GP50T was nearly sold I recall to Rio Grande.
Dave
Some EMD concept that i have heard of GP9 on A-1-A trucks and SW1500 on C-C trucks and SDP40A which was an SDP40 on a SDP45 frame with double steam boiler and GP39 and SD39 with SW1500 engine. Gary
Instead of A1A trucks, CN addressed the light rail issue by putting some of its GP9’s on Flexicoil trucks.
The GP39, SD39 and SW1500 all had V-12 engines, although the GP/SD39 engines were turbocharged.
This predates EMD a little bit. But from the EMC era, how about the Santa Fe 1?
Those ATSF trucks aren’t A-1-A and weren’t for spreading load on light rail. Think of them as B trucks with a pony axle for perceived better guiding at very high speed.
Dave Goding may have a more detailed analysis.
C
Can’t say that I am familiar with those trucks. The EMD A-1-A passenger truck can’t accept a middle motor due to the configuration of the bolster, which also ducts the cooling air to the traction motors so those 1-B trucks must have been totally unique. I found some pictures of a brass model that show the leading axle of each truck has no brakes and appears to have smaller diameter wheels. All wheels are on a rigid wheelbase but I agree the guiding effect is probably the reason.
Dave
GP39 and the SD39 with 1500hp engines were there to show what could be built. An SD40-2 was designed to pickup current from third rail when going up hill so the traction motors were running at full current. EMD showed by studies that this would speed up freights and save fuel. Gary
Was the 1500hp produced by an 8 cyl turbo 645 or a 12 cyl Roots 645? Model number bieng GP37 or SD37???
The Milwaukee bought a few SDL39’s where the “L” meant lightweight for some of their branch lines with 60# rail. Suspect the 8 cyl SD would have been even lighter.
The GP15T and MP15T used a turbocharged 645 V8 to attain 1500 HP. They were not exactly big sellers.
I would guess that the customers for a 1500HP unit would rather make do with a roots blown V12. A short SD15T might have made a dandy locomotive for light rail branch lines, but most of those lines weren’t making money.
Ironic that the SD89, mechanically speaking, is what lead to today’s Tier 4 SD70.
CN went to the extreme in getting lightweight diesels.
The GMD1 was basically a SW1200 on a GP9 frame with A1A trucks and a smaller fuel tank. Only built for CN and Northern Alberta.
CN had a number of ALCO/MLW and even some FM/CLC diesels with A1A trucks, including some homebuilt ones.
I think the FM lightweights deserve some detail discussion here, because their detail design could have been applied to GMD locomotives without any particular difficulty.
And what about the ‘lightweight’ engines adapted to slip less on regular track via the simple although somewhat jaw-dropping expedient of removing the center axle and substituting veeeeery long drop equalizers? That was Canada at its kooky-Canuck very best…
Red Green could have done the job with duct tape.
Did EMD’s London operation ever propose any six axle SD style locomotives tailored for the Canadian marketplace before the SD40? I only know of A1A offerings, including the successful GMD1 branch line locomotive.
I’ve tried to find out in the past if EMD demonstrators during the 567 era ever had a Canadian visit at a time when the SD7 and SD9 were showing that there was at least a significant niche for such power here in the US, but never found any evidence.
I Can’t find any reference that any SD7/9/18 demonstrated in Canada. Six motor power was considered heavy switching, hump,transfer and drag service units at that time. Canada dieselized slower and later than the US and most likely saw no need or market for that type of power.The 2 SD7 Demos were each built for a specific geographical region #990 at 314,900 lbs for western road demonstrations and #991at 372,000 lbs,one source also says equipped with hump control and may have had 60-17 gearing or lower for demonstration on roads primairly in the east midwest and south. Both wore the red and maroon of EMDs Switcher demonstrators which may have shown EMD did not forsee general road service for SDs at that time.990 was sold as SP 5308 and now preserved by UP. 991 had its steam generator removed when it was sold as B&O 760 (First six axle unit on B&O and only B&O SD7 with Dynamic brake and winterization hatchs)r/n 7400 in 1957,1826 in 1961, ret 1988. SD9 Demonstrator#5591 became DM&I 110 for heavy ore drags.110 transfered in 1967 to B&LE r/n 831, ret 1997.There were no specific SD18 (or GP18) Demos but the upgraded 1800hp units were sold before the introduction of,alongside and to roads not needing or wanting the extra HP or the maintance expence of the turbocharged GP20/SD24 and foreshadowing EMDs later 60s-70s marketing practice of offering Turboed High and normally asperated Medium HP road units