Building my first HO DCC layout. Track laying 90% completed. Turnouts are Peco and Walthers electrofrogs. Testing engines now.
I have a 4-axel switcher that seems to stop running, when it goes over the electrofrog section of many of my turnouts. It just stops. Lights go off, sounds go off. If I press down sligtly on the engine it get power back. when I release this slight pressure, it loses power again. If I slide the engine forward or back to clear the frog, I get power back. It’s a new engine running on new track.
What could be causing this engine to lose power in the turnouts?
I have some other issues with some of my 6-axel engines derailing when they go through these frogs. ???
Same symptom with either brand of turnout? In both main and divergent routes? Regardless of which direction the loco goes through the turnout? What number of turnout? 5, 6 or 8?
Do you have access to a multimeter? Easy to check for continuity if you have a 20 v dc setting on s multimeter.
Peco are power routing if insulfrog but not if electro-frog.
Peco shows you need to isolate the “inside” rails (connecting the point of the frog) of both the main and divergent routes as well as provide for polarity reversal of the frog itself or the frog can short against the “wrong” rail.
Our four axle switchers can’t make it across the Peco crossing which is insulfrog unless running with a bit of speed. This is the main advantage of electro-frog.
Derailing is usually a physical track problem. Turnout not completely flat, the entry or exit tracks not accurately aligned with the turnout and so on. If only one turnout is affected then likely a physical fault like that.
What track code? Ballasted or not? Insulated joiners at the frog end? Points making good contact with the stock rail? Wheels in gauge? The derailing locomotives picking the frog point or climbing out of the gaurd rail or the switch point? Possible reverse curve at the turnout?
Many things can be a contributing factor. Some sluething is needed.
I bet the wheels are getting lifted up off the rail because the plastic between the rails is too high. Take a file or emery board and grind the plastic between the rails down a bit (a little bit at a time). I have had to do this to a few of my Walthers turnouts.
It is common for RTR turnouts to have a bit of a hump in them from the assembly process. Set one down on a flat surface and take a look. Have the frogs been spiked down? That works for me with ME and Shinohara turnoiuts. Can you run a straightedge across the top of the rail from end to end without there being a hump in the middle?
I’ve not seen a Peco turnout with this type of defect. They are pricy but very well made. Atlas are shoddy by comparison, but 2/3 the price so a little work on them may be worth it to get the savings.
Atlas double curved turnouts are very poor quality. I’ve also seen Atlas Wye turnouts equipped with ordinary length throw bars so their handy surface mount switch motors don’t fit or work correctly.
Clean the contact point where the switch points touch the stock rails. Clean both the points and the outside rail where they touch when the turnout is thrown.
On my 4-axel switcher it happens on some of the Peco electrofrog (#5 & #6) and Walthers curved #7 turnouts. I do have a multimeter to check continuity and have done so with every wiring and electrofrog testing. My F7 A/B engine will jurk when going though the end of one of the Walthers curved turnouts where the engine lights will go off.
I will check out the link you sent.
I will recheck for flatness in the derailing areas. Most seem to happen then the wheels go over the plastic areas in the electrofrogs. It’s like it raised the wheels up and cause them to derail.
If it is the one four-axle switcher more than any other locomotive, I would be looking hard at the electrical pick-up system of that locomotive, especially if pushing down on it “fixes” the problem.
As far as the six axle locmotives derailing… I have more trouble with six axle locomotives in turnouts than four axle models. These are much more sensitive to vertical curves in the turnout.
You might have two unrelated problems.
I have reduced my six-axle locomotive fleet to four. One Trainmaster, an SD-7, and a pair of Alco PA-1s.
That was my thought. This engine acts like it’s not getting a good power connection. I will look into this. Though I haven’t opened up any of my engines. They are also all brand new.
I use a bunch of 12 volt bulbs with 6" leads that all have alligator clips on them. I attach these all over the place, turn on power, and test everything out. I purchased these at Sky Craft Parts in Orlando, but normal automotive bulbs will work, but draw more current.
I use power-routing through the turnouts, so having a couple dozen inexpensive test lights really speeds everything up for me.
You can use a voltmeter. Harbor Freight sells dirt-cheap models. I use high-end Fluke meters becuase I used them at work, so I have them on hand.
I prefer test lights, you get an instant result that cannot be misinterpretted.
I wouldn’t call if a defect, it more a feature than a bug. People often spike a RTR turnout just at the ends, thinking this will avoid creating any issues with the points dragging (or something like that.) In fact, what this opportunity presents is to allow the user to adjust things by spiking things to level, since roadbed often isn’t.
kenben,
You can use a regular multimeter to check for the presence of DCC. Turn the meter to measure AC. DCC isn’t AC, but the AC setting will pick up various parts of the square waveform. You’ll see readings both above and below whatever voltage your command station is set to and these will be changing as you measure. However, this tells you what you usually need to know, Is DCC present?
I solved the same problem by filing down the top of the plastic frogs.
Very careful watching showed the locomotive slightly lifting going over the turnouts. Filing down the plastic allowed the wheels to remain in contact with the track.