So in November I bought a walthers proto FM h10-44 in beautiful milwaukee road paint scheme. I’ve wanted it since it was in advance registration status at walthers and decided to finally take the plunge whilst at Trainfest in Milwaukee. There was a vendor there that had a “steal of a deal” so i bought it. I was very excited to get it home and fire it up.
When i got home I read the directions and saw it needed a break-in period of back and forth start and stop, yada yada yada to get the brushes to “seat”. It was herky jerky. I read here on the forum that “no, a break-in period is not a real thing, they work right out of the box” and “yes they do need break in for an hour or two”. I decided mine fell into the category of needing break in. So being optimistic i kept using it and fought through the herky jerky. Well months later it’s still herky jerky. I thought maybe my track laying skills are really that bad but that wouldn’t explain why my other 2 locomotives run great- slow speed, fast, stop and go, back and forth. The FM keeps stalling and starting back up on the same parts of the layout. I cleaned the areas like I’ve never cleaned track in my life. Still herky jerky. This is so disappointing. I’ve used such restraint not to make this thing go skipping down my street. I really want it to work- I really like the way it looks and sounds.
I’m not sure where to go from here. I want to rip the thing apart but i don’t know how to get to the insides. I think the warranty is still valid (unless it’s void if i bought it from a trainshow) as it’s still within a year since i bought it. I will be contacting walthers and (hopefully they don’t read this) even if I don’t get a replacement I REALLY want to know what’s wrong with it. This experience has put a bad taste in my mouth about buying from a
If this model has the newer Proto mechanism with the helical cut gears, the power pickup is dependent on flimsy contact strips inside the truck, where they are subject to getting fouled by lubrication. You may need to disassemble the trucks and clean goop from the gears and contacts. Be careful with reassembly and new lubrication as the contacts are easily damaged, and if you get too much oil/grease back into the gears you’ll just have more trouble later. If enough lubrication gets into the contacts the loco will become jerky and may stall at random locations that won’t affect your other locos. A keep-alive capacitor add-on like those available from TCS or Sountraxx may help overcome intermittent loss of pickup from the rails.
I have a total of one loco with the current Proto trucks and it’s given me trouble due to the above. I finally got it to keep moving reliably by adding a Soundtraxx “Current Keeper” keep-alive, but now the shell won’t fit on until I get some help machining the frame to clear the capacitors.
Sounds like an electrical contact problem. I don’t have one to examine, but if there’s some way to put Tomar shoes on the engine, try that.
I’m appalled at how tenuous some of the electrical pickup systems are on even very good engines. Fortunately, I have flex wire and a soldering iron and I’m not afraid to use them.
The comments about the contacts are worth checking out. Generally, if you use due care, opening up a loco won’t void a warranty as there are plenty of legit reasons to do so.
As for the jerkiness, etc…When this happens, does the sound continue? Or do you lose contact and it shuts down? If the sound continues, then it may not be the contacts.
I’ll point you towards the Hyperdrive section of your Tsunami manual. I’ve only got steam Tsunamis, so not sure there’s a 1:1 correlation but I suspect these also apply to a diesel Tsunami. Check out CVs 10, 209, 210, and 212 though, particualrly 209 and 210. These can help smooth low speed performance and may solve the jerky issue.’
I’ve got one of the original run copies of these. It’s always run very well, even after dropping a NCE decoder in, so if you can figure out the issue you’ll have a fine loco. Probably worth doing a little more checking, but a call to Walthers customer service will probably help resolve some of the potential issues and narrow things down that still need checking.
Easy enough to test the pickup - it should still run with either truck isolated from the rails, so slip a piece of paper onder one truck and then the other. If it dies one way or the other - there is a pickup problem in the truck that is still on the rails. You cna also tip the loco or slightly lift a truck . Or put it upside down in a cradle and use clip leads and test individuakl wheelsets - but upside down can allow gravity to help the contacts and might not be an accurate represntation of how it runs on the rails.
I have lifted each truck off the track and she continues to run while only 1 truck is on the track. However I have not tested this in the problem areas as this would probably not tell much since it doesn’t have a problem every time it goes over said problem areas.
Mike- when it stalls the sound does indeed cut out then come back on and the engine sounds usually pick up at the same rpm as before the herky jerky.
You guys have certainly provided me a lot of ammo to attack this problem. Unfortunately I have to put in my 8 hours of “real life” today but I’ll be working on this over the weekend. I’m going to try to find info on getting this loco open. I’ll keep you guys posted and take pictures if I do open it up. After calling walthers of course.
It’s nice to know there is still hope and there’s a chance my loco isn’t destined for the junk heap.
May seem like a foolish question to ask, I see you have “gone nuts” cleaning track like never before, but did you CLEAN the wheels? That would be the very first thing to check. For some reason (machining, milling, blackening and possibly protection coating/oil) almost all my Atlas locos out of the box, need the wheels cleaned to remove some film or I will have the same issues you describe.
Ok so I’m going to risk showing how much of a newbie I am.
I used a paper towel to wipe the part of wheels that were exposed, then put it back on the track and ran it just a tad to expose different parts of the wheels and wiped again. I haven’t introduced any kind of cleaner. I’m sure it would be easier if I could figure out how to get the sides of the trucks off. I’m reluctant to force anything before I know how it’s built.
Most of us use a system of putting some type of liquid cleaner, such as rubbing alcohol, onto a piece of cloth, stretchng it across the track, and letting the wheels run onto it and spin by holding the train back.
Turn the locomotive around, change the power pack’s direction setting, and repeat.
There’s no need to remove anything from the trucks in order to clean the wheels.
Handi-Wipe brand or similar disposable towels work well for this. Paper towels tend to get torn up, even the “extra strong” one, saturated with alcohol and with loco wheels spinning on top of them.
If the loco runs well with just one truck contacting the rails, there’s probably not much of a pickup problem.
Then it does sound like a contact problem. This could be an issue with the contacts on the trucks.
I would not rule out track if the problems occur in the same areas. Some locos handle rough/uneven track just fine. Others tend to stall if not quite as flexible. A straightedge can help you find dips and bumps in the track that may not be readily apparent.
Doesn’t take that much cleaner (isopropyl alcohol) to do the job. A splash on the shop paper towel laid on the rail and follow as described above. Always a pain, that the trip pin of the coupler will try to “snag” the towel. That’s why it’s recommended to use one that is a bit more robust. Those ultra soft/ absorbant types will tear apart. I like to turn the towel as the wheels are spinning, allowing the truck to run back and forth. This allows you to see how the crud is coming off. I hold the loco by the sideframe which allows me to “wiggle” side to side and clean the flanges as well.
Done properly you will see the black crud track, and as you continue until completely clean, no more evidence of oxidation will show on the towel.
The decoder is dual-mode … have you tried running it on DC ? If you still have the herky jerkies, it’s a contact problem. If it runs smooth, it’s a decoder problem.
Also look for excess lubrication that may have leached out onto the axle ends. I have had many Atlas engines exhibit this behaviour due to lubrication (which acts as an insulator) on the axle ends / bronze journals.
Something else that could very easily be the problem is those plastic clips that all the manufacturers are using to hold the wires to the decoder and trucks.
Sometimes those clips work loose in shipment and the wiring doesn’t make good contact.
The first thing I do is remove those clips and solder all the connections.