Patent 153470, July 28 1874, if you want the details. Improved Feb 24, 1875 (173251) and Sept 20 1881 (247459).
Do you really think Sim Webb would admit that Jones was going too fast to stop on a flagman’s signal? If he did attest to the aforementioned scenario who would believe a black man in the late 19th century?
You’re almost there.
As a Black man in the Deep South in 1900 Sim was probably told to keep his mouth shut “Or else, boy!”
And they probably didn’t need to tell him anything else.
Not being without sin I don’t like casting any “First Stones,” but given the choice of losing their jobs or using the old “Blame it on the dead guy” fallback what do you think those freight crews were going to do?
-
What was the wording of the relevant ‘catchall’ safety rule in force on that line at the time? (Some variant on ‘the safe course must always be followed’…)
-
Exactly how do we know Jones said “the old girl’s really got her high-heeled slippers on tonight!”?
-
Do you think Sim responded with (1) when he heard (2)?
OK, I want to clear up some confusion going on here I think. The testimony in the video was not testimony at the accident investigation, it was testimony long after Mr Webb was on a pension and retired from the IC RR. The original IC RR investigation blamed Casey Jones entirely for the crash and paid no damages to his family his insurance policy with the union paid out $3000 to his family at the time but the RR paid nothing after blaming him for the crash. Mr. Webb came out years and years later and made the statements above.
Do you know how many years after the accident that interview occurred? Memories from far back in time may seem accurate, even vivid to the subject, but often are not.
The bulk of my information comes from two stories contained in, “A Treasurey of Railroad Folklore.” The more detailed accounts appeared, I believe, in the book written for the IC’s 100th anniversary. The other story was an interview of Simm Webb that appeared in “Railroad Stories magazine” in 1936. I think the audio interview would date to about that time. There are many similarities between the story in the book about Simm and the audio interview. Enough to the point that the audio interview may have been used in writing the story.
In the story about Simm Webb, he was 61 at the time of the interview. He took a leave of absence from the IC in 1919 and never went back. Something he said in retrospect was a mistake.
There are discrepencies between the detailed article and the article about Simm Webb. Th
No clue, all I know was it …was after he retired from IC RR before he spoke out. Source I read said retired but leave of absence is technically the same, if you never return, the HR of the company marks it as a termination, resignation, or retirement depending on final disposition.
Not to dump on IC too much but I used to have a Brother in Law that worked for Osmose (Trestle and Tie wood preservation) and he always used to say IC was the worst of the railroads as far as track maintence in the deep South.
He stated they were a heavy Osmose contractor and he would be pumping preservative into wood that was highly deteriorated from rot or would see gaps in the rail which he would wonder how the train didn’t go off the tracks. Even had stories of several unsafe incidents where trains were not properly flagged to slow down around them when they were working. He limited it to the deep South and said in the Midwest he never had those experiences. Attributed it to the railroad but to me sounded like a local management issue in the South. He worked at Osmose in the mid 1970’s approx.
Osmose would use a perservative that injected into wood would both fill gaps and then harden into a resin like state he said. He said it would burn if it came in contact with exposed skin while in it’s fluid state. We got on the discussion topic after I showed him the series of articles on MidSouth railroad Company in TRAINS Magazine right after they were published and as soon as he saw them he said “Oh Geez, I worked on some of those trestles there” and then went on to elaborate.
Really??? After jumping at 50mph the only injury was being knocked out?
On one of the two video clips Mr. Webb says Jones brought the train speed down from 75mph to 35mph…when he was told, “Jump, Sim!”
Casey Jones’ peers comment on him: from Erie Railroad Magazine April 1932
A. J. (“Fatty”) Thomas, who often ran as a conductor on trains pulled by Casey and the 638, writes: “…for he (Jones) was not a rounder but a car roller, and in my estimation the prince of them all. We had a number of fast men, and since then I have had hundreds of good engineers pull me on different western roads. But I never met the equal of Casey Jones in rustling to get over the road.”
“The ‘whistle’s moan’ in the song is right. Casey could just about play a tune on the whistle. He could make the cold chills run up your back with it, and grin all the time. Everybody along the line knew Casey Jones’ whistle.”
“I never saw him with his mouth closed – he always had a smile or a broad grin. The faster he could get an engine to roll, the happier he was. He would lean out of the cab window to watch his drivers, and when he got he going so fast that the side rods looked solid, he would look at you and grin all over, happy as a boy with his first pair of red boots. Yet he had a reputation as a safe engineer. With all his fast running I never knew of him piling them up, of any but a few derailments and never a rear-ender. He was either lucky, or else his judgment was as nearly perfect as human judgment can be.”
Ed Pacey, another conductor who knew Casey Jones, writes: “Jones was famous for two things: he was a teetotaler in days when abstinence was rare, and he was the most daring of all engineers in the days when schedules were simply ‘get her there and make the time, or come to the office and get your time.’”
It seems to me we really don’t have sufficient primary source and investigation info to make a valid judgement. But it sure sounds like Casey liked to run fast.
According to the subscript below the Passenger Forum, this historic thread belongs in Classic Trains. This forum is supposed to be about Amtrak, past and present and future for Amtrak and other modern passenger services, including abroad.
“The place to discuss Amtrak, the future of passenger rail, and high speed proposals.”
Even jumping at 35mph I should think you would suffer more injury other than being knocked unconscious.