Fathers: the ultimate play value: Joshua Cohen had it right!!

Classic Toy Trains Forum
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I was reading about the “play value” thread recently here, and also thinking about a bunch of other things like Thanksgiving, the recent passing of my own dad and my own experiences with promoting this hobby. I was reading Don Baker’s last comment on that thread: I think the most important thing is a simple track, functioning (moving) train, and a KID. Won’t take much more than that!!

And while I understood where Don was coming from, that simple thought also opened up a whole floodgate of thinking and personal memories. I realized many suggestions on that thread were valid but yet lacking one thing…

The most important thing to add play value to a train layout for a child is US! Be it a dad, grandfather, uncle or just a guy taking interest in a kid who might not have a dad around. Joshua Lionel Cohen knew this too, which is why the bulk of Lionel advertising of years past was aimed at fathers AND their sons. I think that marketing ploy of Cohen’s was one of the major contributing factors to Lionel being so successful in years past. It’s US first and the trains second and not the other way around.

Now many say today that video games have taken the place of trains. To some degree, there’s truth to that. But there’s also some truth that I believe a good many fathers are NOT involved that heavily in their son’s lives. In our selfish “me, me, me” and “I gotta have it my way, right now” culture we tend to want to throw things at kids to keep them occupied to themselves… electronic babysitters.

The boy I mentioned in the other thread wasn’t really my nephew, though I call him that. He was a kid with no dad and in a single mother household that I took under my wing. I always wanted to be a dad, but never got the chance, so this was the next best thing. And besides, there are already so many kids who need to have a guy like me around.</

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Very nice Brian, Well done! Thats what its all about. Happy Thanksgiving!

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Every kid should have a train, a layout, and a dad that lets him build it (with a little help of course)!

Actually I had some friends who purchased their kids a train and it never got running. The dad would not have anything to do with it. I finally go over and in about 20 minutes we get it running, build tunnels out of shoe boxes and had the time of our lives.

My boy has aged out of trains, so when a family with a young child visits we pull out every one of my trains and run them. The kids just can’t believe it!

Jim H

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Great message Brian.

Back when I was a little younger, my daddy used to help me set up my HO scale train I would get every year at the train show in Savannah. I probably have 4 or 6 HO sets from there, but, I would play with it for a while then it would be something of the past.

But, I would always get one set each year. Then, one year, oh, I think about when I was 6 or 7, I got a K-Line “True Value” hardware set with a switcher and couple of flat cars. And, its the only survivng engine that I have that came from on of those train shows that still works. Though the hand rails are beat up, bent, and missing, and the gears full of carpet fibers, it still runs pretty strong.

I think pretty much after that, my daddy didnt really think he needed to help me anymore. And actually, I didnt really need the help. I was a 7 year old that could put together a HO scale train set without any help at all.

But what actually got me into O gauge was the recieveing of a pensy flyer back in 2005. It was eventually put away, but after seeing a few movies, reading a few books, and serfing the web, I got back into O gauge.

And, back to the main issue, YES, Lionel’s advertising really feautered the “dad” part about it. Almost every poster, picture, and catalog picture there is, you will usually find a father and son.

Though, are you shure it was Cowin’s idea? Wouldnt it be his advertising departments job?

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Nicely put, Agent 027.

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Very good points. I believe the toy train future is in relative inexpensive durable toy trains. Sacrifice detail for value, and simplify the workings with emphasis on reliability. My grandkids love playing with our old American Flyer trains. I would put a AF set from the '50’s against anything out today for play value, reliability and ease of operation.

Jim

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Every young American family should have a Legacy Boy.

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My 2 year old Corey, my 4.5 year old Tyler, and I played with the trains three times today. Enough said!

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Brianel,

Many of the previous posts in that thread was discussing various methods of enhancing a youngsters involvement. Which were quite worthwhile. I WAS TRYING TO EMPHASIZE THAT THE PRIMARY FACTOR WAS THE INVOLVEMENT. However, anytime involved with a “father” figure is premium time! Does not have to be with trains!

As a child, I spent many hours playing with a 12’ section of straight 027 track, 1 truck (from a car) that I found, some boxes used as an incline, some string, and a thread spool pulley. These items kept me occupied for hours. Dad was usually working, nights.

All I need to say.

I have however learned that you MUST be extremely careful as to how you word stuff here. And, take into perspective all the various viewpoints that can be intrepreted that surely, somebody is going to find something offensive.

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Don, believe me I wasn’t finding any fault with you. The word “wrong” was too strong, (so I will remove that word from the first post) because what you said wasn’t wrong per-se. You really did inspire my thinking though, and actually I should thank you for doing that. Thank you! It was just a simple observation, hardly wrong, that really inspired my thinking… my apologies and accept my thanks.

I started reflecting on the recent death of my own dad, remembering the train items that my dad had gotten me, and then my grandfather too. And it’s funny, after all these years, I can still remember the very specific train gifts my grandfather got for me. My second step-up train set after the first Lionel Scout (which I got when I wasn’t even a week old), had a list price that equalled two-weeks solid pay for my dad at that time. Now, knowing my dad, I’m sure he got a deal or got it on sale. BUT years later when I found out that set’s list was two weeks pay for my dad, I was pretty blwon away.

As I was reading the other “play value” thread, and even thinking about the suggestions I had made, I realized that most of these elements of planning a layout for fun are going to be initiated by an adult or grown-up of some kind.

Whenever I have given trains away to a kid, I always ask the parent(s) if they are willing to have some involvement in the hobby and if they are willing to spend some money towards it. As I said above, there are lots of toys today that seem to be aimed at more solitary/isolated play than involved play. That’s not to say trains too, won’t be run and played with alone. But there’s also an open door with the train hobby for some family participation. Unlike a video game, there’s a different element of creativity here, and potenetial for participation.

LIke I said above, I know many of us can remember the first train set, or things our dad’s got for us and did with us fo

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Older video games (Nintendo, Atari) have a big nostalgia-fueled following, so I think the same will happen for current games. There may not be the memory of playing with Dad, but the nostalgia pull is still there.

I’m of the right age that I have childhood memories of both. I think of my Dad when I run his Lionels (he passed 13 years ago this month), just like we did in our basement when I was in grade school. When I see a vintage Atari or Nintendo game system in action, it reminds me of my friends, and especially of the marathon sessions my cousin and I used to have in his parents’ basement. My dad didn’t play video games, but a lot of men my age do (I’m 33), so today’s kids may very well have memories of playing games with Dad. Due to the family friendliness of the Nintendo Wii, I expect it will have a huge nostalgia following in about 10 years.

I also suspect part of the reason early Nintendo games are popular with teenagers right now is because they were introduced to them by an older relative who still had one in working order.

Just like music, I think every generation’s favored plaything is the best–to that particular generation.

I happen to like them both, and the parallels I see in them are very interesting.