Please, guys… the Daylights are trains. What pulled them were GS (Golden State) class locomotives, most famously GS-4s.
Robert J. Church always referred to Espee’s GS class locomotives as Daylight 4-8-4’s. In 1966 Kratville Publications released the book he authored on them titled Those Daylight 4-8-4’s. In 1976 it returned as a Second Expanded Edition which included renowned 4449 and it’s part in America’s Bi-Centennial celebration. In 2004 Signature Press published Church’s huge monumental 424 page book Southern Pacific Daylight Locomotives.
As a result, the GS class are commonly referred to as Daylight locomotives. During WWII the Golden State class were reclassed General Service to satisfy the War Deparment Board so SP could justify ordering additional 4-8-4’s if memory serves me well. I stand corrected, however, Daylight remains the popular name for these beautiful machines just the same!
If we are prohibiting nicknames does that mean I can’t call a RSD-15 an Alligator, or a 4-axle EMD a Geep? [*-)]
I saw my first picture of 4449 as a small child, but did not learn that she and her sisters were classed “GS-4” or named Golden State until a bit more research in my late teens. “Daylight” was the only name I new them by before then, and I suspect many people are in the same boat today.
SD70-2Dude, I just looked at the photo of 1392. My complements sir, that machine looks so clean you could eat off it! I’ll bet she’s a fun one to run too!
Thanks Firelock, she is indeed one beautiful machine. When that photo was taken in 2013 she was in fresh paint after a 5-year inspection and rebuild, but several years later looks just as sharp. While I am not yet qualified to run or fire (kinda sorta unofficially know how to fire but need more practice) and am far to young to pose as a Conductor I regularly serve as Trainman or crossing Watchman when we operate, and she is indeed a delight to ride on or behind, or simply just watch. She has lots of pep being a high-drivered (by CNoR standards) ex-passenger engine, and plenty of power at speed. I’m told she settles right into a groove at about 30 MPH, and has hauled a 30 car freight with ease while deadheading home from a filming gig (Monte Walsh starring Tom Selleck) some years ago; apparently the freight crew idled the diesels for a while to see what she could do. Unfortunately we only have 0.5 miles of 10 MPH track to run back and forth on so her existence today is somewhat akin to a caged lion, but a real-live lion nonetheless.
Here’s a link to the results of a night photo shoot we hosted in September, 1392 was the star attraction having been kept hot for an extra week after Labour Day:
http://www.meetup.com/The-Edmonton-Shutter-Bugs/photos/all_photos/?photoAlbumId=27256033
Great shots from your “Night At The Museum,” and who’s the “Flapper” getting ready for her train ride? She’s cute!
Hey Dude, when I make it to Alberta and visit you at the museum I’ll volunteer to be the crossing watchman. Regretfully, I am not mechanically inclined but De-clined. I still have my well worn hickory striped railroader cap to protect my old old head when I’m on duty.
The pix are really cool. The young lady is quite a cutie for sure! Lest we forget, the green and gold CNR color scheme was one of the most beautiful creations that ever graced a covered wagon! When you consider that Alaska Railroad has returned to their classic blue and yellow scheme, KCS to the Southern Belle image, it’s high time for CN and CP to re-introduce the classics to their diesel fleets too!
My choices:
For passenger, hands down the Niagara or the T1 Duplex. J Class very close, stepping on their toes. I’m also fond of the ATSF 4-8-4. But tell me either of the S1b or the T1 is my choice and I’ll be happy.
Freight, I’d have to say the UP 9000 4-12-2 class with flying pumps and that big Delta trailing truck. Next, a toss-up between any of the J1 2-10-4, the A Class, or the Y6b. The Penny’s J generated almost the same tractive effort with two cylinders that UP’s Challengers did with four, and many more drivers.
Here’s a shot of the UP 9035:
Sounds to me that your actual favorite is the NYC C1a.
http://www.railarchive.net/nyccollection/nyc_6053.htm
Actually, in all seriousness there was a fairly detailed proposal for the C1a. One of the ‘regulars’ on the YouTube NYC Group (Hugh T. Guillaume) has a twenty-odd page document describing it (unstreamlined, with what looks like a long Niagara boiler and a properly large firebox and chamber), and Al Staufer did an ink drawing of a side view at speed in NYC Later Power.
Aside from West Albany Hill, the Water Level Route was better suited to duplexes than was much of the PRR. As I recall the C1a was to have Baker gear to piston valves, so plenty of room for a conjugating shaft, and divided drive would have solved any major issue with main pins or buckling rods…
Of course, Arnold Haas to the contrary NYC had no particular need of 120mph power; even the successful passenger diesels were geared low, and the ICC order on train control that went into effect by 1951 put a damper on any speed increase that might have become more feasible as the Great Steel Fleet began to thin out in that decade. By the time PRR had worked the conceptual bugs out of the duplex, the entire market for new passenger steam had collapsed completely (1948).
Mmm…funny, but that doesn’t work for me. While I appreciate the duplex-type drive of a Super Niagara, I really like the articulated rods of the various Northern types, and the roller bearing look of the J and S1b. Their visual appeal, I mean. I guess if the various Duplexes the Pennsy trialed and ultimately produced were good investments, it stands to reason that eventually other roads would have to sit up and take notice. It coulda happened…for sure.
I appreciate your having taken the time to consider what I posted and offering your input, RME. I hadn’t known about the C1a. I’m truly bummed that no Niagaras survived the cutter.
Fantasy steam indeed RME, love the look of that Dreyfuss-ized C1a. I haven’t seen anything that cool since Juniatha’s postings of her Germanized Pennsy T-1, you know, the one that looked like Darth Vader might have been at the throttle?
Some folks don’t care for the Dreyfuss stylings on the Hudsons and that’s OK. I think it’s one of the best looking streamline jobs, along with the N&W’s J’s.
My favorite would be CNJ’s > 4-6-4T ; a real workhorse that was used between stations where the locos could not be turned. Engine would head train from station 1 to the last station On the line. It would then run to the end of the train and couple up And then run backwards to station #1. There was a big headlight and pilot on the tender.
Nice choice Goodtiming! You know, Steamtown’s got a Canadian 4-6-4T that’s almost a dead-ringer for the one’s the CNJ ran. I wish they’d get that one running, put some CNJ markings on it and use it for local runs in the area.
They’ve even got CNJ passenger cars to hook up to it.
They can’t do any more than a cosmetic restoration on #47 as far as I’ve heard. It was bought and operated by F. Nelson Blount around 1959 and became the first steam operation at Steamtown in Bellows Falls VT. However, the 47’s maintenance records had been lost in a fire and the ICC determined that the locomotive cannot operate without paperwork. So unless that changes, she’ll remain cold as she’s been since 1961. But I agree, she’s a great loco! Great pics here: http://www.rgusrail.com/pascollection.html#cnx10a47.
Hi Becky! There was a discussion of Steamtown 47 a few months back on the “Trains” Forum and what it amounted to was this.
Steamtown COULD have gotten 47 certified after a complete tear-down and inspection, however in 1961 the then Steamtown organization had plenty of other “papered” locomotives to choose from, so it just wasn’t worth the effort.
NOW, however, after a complete restoration getting 47 OK’d to run again wouldn’t be an issue, it’d have new papers certifying it.
It’d be interesting to see just how much work would have to be done. Granted 50 years is a long time, but aside from corrosion mechanically there should be very little wear on the machinery. What shape the boiler’s in is another story.
Still, others a lot worse off have been brought back to life.
Favorite steam locomotive ?
Asking this question is like asking a rainbow which color to drop from its display! [(-D]
However, if ONE type has to be named, then…
I second this post.
The ‘AMC’ Berkshires had the best lines, the best looks, the best dress lets say. Sleek, clean, no fuss no muss, git-her-done locos. Efficient, fast, powerful, and luckily as fate would have it… well preserved. Woodwards pencil was very sharp the day he scaled down the T-1.
Drop the light low (C&O) she looks heavy, like a brute! Add a Mars light and flying #boards (NKP) and she looks extremely fast sitting still. Or just plain Jane (PM) right off the factory floor. No matter how ya rivet her together, they are just #1 in my book.
PM Railfan
I have a video of her running in Bellows Falls, it would be awesome for future generations to see and hear that deep whistle she has!
Methinks it’s time to bump this thread again; 47 was not the only CN 4-6-4T to escape the torch, the Canadian Railway Museum has 49 on display indoors (cosmetically restored by the looks of her). I wonder what condition she’s in compared to 49, but would probably suffer from the same paperwork issues.
And since I am thinking of CN 4-6-4’s, anyone travelling through Southern Ontario needs to stop by St. Thomas and have a look at 5700, that thing is absolutely immaculate inside the Elgin County Railway Museum’s ex-CASO/MC/NYC shop building. They have the lights working, keep everything oiled and greased and even move her around occasionally with a diesel. I know that picture was taken 25 years ago, but she looks just as good today!
I think I’ve got that same video you do Becky, came in a “steam freak” package for lack of a better term, and you’re right, that little locomotive had one BIG voice! I’d love to see it running again. Hey, if I hit one of those big lotteries I’d underwrite it myself. But then, wouldn’t we all?
Old Madacy tape “Twilight of Steam”. Recently found it and several others on a dvd set at Target. One half of the dvd’s has Madacy films, the other half is made up of Tracks Ahead segments.