This is how I see it. If I had that kind of money. And my job was building my MRR and making FSM kits I can assure you that with time you could build a MRR like that one or better. He has a lot of other people behind the scenes. He has someone build his engines, install sound systems and also install his DCC. But if that was my 8-5 job I would have a killer MRR for sure.
Assuming you have anywhere the talent that George Sellios does. Time and money do not necessarily lead to great work.
Bob Boudreau
Would anyone like some fresh popcorn? [8D]
Bob,
Do you thing George just work up one day and built the diorama’s like he does? I know if that was all that I did all day long I would be just as good as him. Practice and more practice made him what he is today. And with the income from his RR and mostly from his FSM kits he doesn’t have to work the same kind of jobs that we have to
Just like anyone with a set of paintbrushes and paint can make a masterpiece? Just like anyone with any camera can take great photos?
Some people could work all of their lives and not come anywhere close to what George Sellios can do. George started making his kits using his natural talents, and carried them to his railroad.
Some people are born with artistic talent, some can learn, but not just anyone can create what George has done, no matter how much time they have.
I doubt if George makes any income from his railroad. He works six or more months producing a kit each year, then works on his layout the rest of the time.
BTW, I don’t have a job anymore, I’ve been retired for five years now!
Bob Boudreau
Bob good point, but George get big bucks for his RR, just like golfers do with endorsements. I have seen his layout 4 times. And by talking with him you don’t even have a clue. I have seen a few of his early diorama’s. And can tell you that he wasn’t tapped on the head by the diorama fairy. He got that way from teaching himself.
BTW: Why do you think I care if you work?? Trust me I couldn’t care less.
Perhaps you could explain how George gets big bucks for his layout? Endorsements? What/ where? I’m pretty sure there is very little if anything paid for the video layout tours done of the FSM. Magazine articles have been mostly done by others who would get paid for them. Ones he’s done himself certainly don’t pay enough to make much of a difference. I’ve had over 800 of my personal model photos published so I do have an insight and experience on this matter.
I’ve seen his layout twice myself, not that it is relevant in this discussion.
Don’t have a clue about what?
“Why do you think I care if you work?? Trust me I couldn’t care less.”
I may have wrongly assumed the “WE” in that sentence meant all of US(?).
So he didn’t know anything, but taught himself, something anyone can do? If you had the time, you could teach yourself to be equally creative? How about teaching yourself brain surgery? Can’t be all that hard either!
Bob Boudreau
Once again, subjective opinion is presented as unassailable fact. What George does is not necessarily “great work”.
Cheers,
Mark.
[#ditto]
I agree that Model Railroading is an art, but I think anyone can learn to be a competent practitioner. Greatness is in the eye of the beholder.
Enjoy
Paul
Thanks Paul.
(Prepare to be vilified for your opinion! [;)] )
From what I’ve seen, not everyone can learn to be a “comeptent practitioner”. Either some people have the artistic talent or they don’t. Period.
I’m sure you’ve all seen layouts where everything is overly neat and ordered, the grass is all a uniform green, the structures are all shiney plastic as they came out of the box, rolling stock is the same - all shiney and toy like. Some people with such layouts have reached their level of competancy, they’re quite happy with what they’ve done and don’t think anything more is needed or possible. They are happy with what they have created, and there is nothing wrong with their modeiling as long as they enjoy it.
Show them a well detailed and weathered layout and it will be beyond their limited imagination how it could be made.
I personally was a teenager model railroader with very limited funds, I scrounged much of my stuff and made my own structures out of cardboard and balsa wood, because that was all I could afford. My work surpassed that of the adult members of the club I belonged to - they told me so. They had many years on me and a lot more money to buy stuff, but most didn’t have the natural born artistic abilities to do much better.
Many years later as an adult I got back into the hobby, and became the Chairman of the Achievement Program for the NMRA’s Northeastern Region. I had to personally assess models for competancey in the AP program to process applications for Merit Awards and AP Awards - Master Builder of Structures, Scenery, Cars, Engines, etc. So I saw a lot of what people can and cannot do. I personally hold certificates for Cars, Structures, Scenery, Author, and Volunteer.
One local gentleman who was probably 40 years older than I am had been model railroading most of his life.
Not everyone takes the time and makes the effort to become proficient. It doesn’t mean that they can’t, just that they haven’t. I have never seen any evidence that artistic talent is genetic.
If there is nothing wrong with that why do you denigrate it so?
It’s nice that you have defined the only “artistic” result for the rest of us. Some of us though find weathered models to be merely dirty not artistic.
[quote]
QUOTE: Originally posted by FundyNorthern
… He asked me to judge some of his models for possible Merit Awards. They require at least 87.5 points out of 125 available to qualiify. He dropped a bunch of assorted models off with me and I assessed them. There was no way that I could award any of his models the
I would have thought it self-evident that to submit a model for NMRA Merit Award judging is to consider it one’s best work. That’s the point. In Bob’s example, the individual had put in the time and effort - for six decades - and hadn’t reached the level required for a Merit Award. Does this make him inferior? No, but it does indicate that there’s more to reaching the upper levels of any art than time and effort. Talent is a factor, and there’s no shame in having less of it than others have.
If I thought that there were shame in having less artistic talent than another, I’d have given up on competing with Bob in photo contests several 3rd-prizes ago. [:o)]
It’s not time and effort to build or how long you have been building; but time and effort to learn how to do it well, to improve and do better. Your best work may not be up to snuff, but you can improve it - if you want to and are willing to learn. Anyone can learn to build a model so that:
- the glue doesn’t show
- the structure is square
- the paint isn’t shiny where it’s supposed to be flat.
I am willing to accept that some (many?) people don’t take the time or effort to learn how to build better, but I won’t accept that they can’t learn to.
Saying some people are talented and others aren’t is elitist by the “talented” and defeatist by the “untalented”. Whether or not the result is great art is in the eye of the beholder. There are very few artists (if any) who are universally acknowledged to to be great. But we can all create art.
Enjoy
Paul
Back to the subject of FSM kits. I was at a local train swap meet a couple months ago and managed to pick up a complete FSM 2 stall engine house for $35. I personally buy kits I plan to build. I have already found where this kit is going to be on my layout.
I believe that everyone has different talents in the hobby of Model Railroading. For example,
I believe that I am pretty good at wood kits yet I can’t build a plastic brick building for the life of me.
Also at the club I belong to, there are members that excellent at scenery while other are really good at electronics.
The whole hobby is a learning experience.
I personally have avoided submitting models into contests as I do not feel that I need the opinion of others to enjoy the models I have built. I enjoy the hobby because it lets me put my imagination to work.
This hobby is my release from school and work. I do it because I enjoy.
[quote]
QUOTE: Originally posted by BentnoseWillie
I reckon that’s another can of worms entirely. I’ve seen models that did get a merit award that I would’ve consigned to the bin had they been mine. I don’t think the Merit Awards are worth achieving, the bar is set too low.
All the best,
Mark.