Mike,
Great point on naming the sidings, etc… I never new that. Something fun I can let my kids help me with someday too!
Brian
Brian
TOPIC THIS POST: Figuring out what trains to run
Read this forum clinic post by clicking here.
Joe, I really like this clinic. I have the book Track Planning for Realistic Operation but it’s so much in there so it’s sometimes hard to read and understand. You are explaining this in a way that is very easy to understand. I’m looking forward to the rest of this clinic. BTW: Is this the same content that you will show us on the Prototype operation secrets DVD? Thanks Joe
I’m always willing to learn something. I’m in.
Regards,
Very good… but that yardmaster is way out of scale [:o)]
Electro:
Yes, this is essentially what will be in video volume 5 on DVD. The video, of course, will have video illustrations of all the points, and the video will include footage from an actual op session on my Siskiyou Line, and will include a bonus chapter that’s an excursion of SP4449 down the model Siskiyou Line, using a nicely detailed brass SP4449 with a Tsunami decoder.
Glad you are liking the info. I’m trying to take it slow so we don’t bury people in too much info too soon. [swg]
Joe,
Thanks for starting this new clinic. You and I have written many times here, on your forum, and via email concerning operations and operating rules. It is a somewhat new area of interest to me. I have learned much from your insights in the past and I look forward to finding some new nuggets in this clinic. Each of your clinics here have been greatly valuable and this one is beginning with signs of the same. I look forward to following it closely.
Thanks for the insight on the railfan/engineer debate. I don’t know why these two points of view always have to be at odds. Being newer to the hobby I have begun to make the real transformation from the pure railfan that I was when I started 10 years ago to a more deeply interested engineer. I still, however, enjoy just watching the trains run sometimes. These are two sides of the same coin and should be able to peacefully coexist.
Thanks again,
Ron
Joe,Can current or past railroaders join in on the discussion?
Absolutely. Have any insights you could share?
Ron:
You have nailed my sentiments exactly on the whole railfan/engineer debate.
That’s why my preferred operating scheme incorporates railfanning as a part – and that’s my preference for two-person crew operations. One person is the engineer, and he focuses on running the train the right speed, and keeps his eye on the locomotive. The other person, the conductor, converses with the dispatcher, and must watch the train as it runs.
So the conductor has to railfan the train! I know, it’s a tough job, but somebody has to do it! [swg] Anytime I’m gettting a railfan urge, I like to volunteer to be the conductor … and then I thoroughly enjoy railfanning the train!
You could say I’m firmly in the engineer camp, but with some definite railfan moments or leanings. Unlike the hard-case engineer, I also love to just watch trains run through really nice looking scenery – which is more railfan than engineer. So I am fastidious about nice looking scenery. And my two person crews lets me run trains prototypically and railfan the train at the same time!
TOPIC THIS POST: Getting started operating
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Curse you, Joe Fugate!!
I’ve been building my layout with the ultimate goal of realistic operations for some time now. Construction is slow because of other demands on my time. But I have been making progress.
If I slow down even more to try my hand at piece-parts operating (the only kind I can do right now), I’ll never get done.
I’ve managed to avoid that temptation until now, but your accursed Operations thread is making it just that much harder. Now I’m thinking I’ll just HAVE to try a few lone-wolf sessions in the very near future (say next week).
I’m going to have to stop construction and have some fun operating my trains, AND IT’S ALL YOUR FAULT!! AARGH!!
[:D]
Brunton, Funny you, hehe. It’s a wonderful clinic. Joe, Are you going to cover how to get the prototype information in this clinic? I mean, if we want to operate as the prototype we must know how the prototype worked. What’s the best way to get this information for a given prototype? Let’s say D&RGW or any other company? You must have read somewhere about the water cars over Rice Hill and so on…
Electro:
Being you are over across the pond, you may not like my answer … [swg]
Here’s how I learned about my prototype.
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I grew up next to my prototype. I was aware that the SP ran a few very long trains of mostly lumber products because of personal observation.
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Several good books on the SP in Oregon came out in the late 1980s and early 1990s. I actually got to know the authors (Tom Dill and Ed Austin) and have been able to “pick their brains” even beyond what they have written.
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More railfanning in person lead me to the discovery of the Forest Service requirement of the “water cars over the hill” on the Siskiyou Line. I also spoke with the Roseburg Yardmaster some about the water cars. The water cars are also shown and discussed a bit in a Charles Smiley video on the SP – so the info is there if you are paying attention.
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Railfanning the Siskiyou Line leads quickly to the discovery of the massive Roseburg Forest Products facility in Dillard, Oregon. You are driving along and suddenly you round the corner to be staring at this industry that has railcars everywhere and it seems to go forever. Driving along the facility and watching the odometer on my car I have marked this one industry to run along the railroad for 1.1 miles.
So unlike many modelers and their prototype, I actually have a lot of personal experience with mine. However, all the trains that are run, and the train names I picked up mostly from reading published works about the Siskiyou Line – and paying special attention to any mention of a train names … like the Seagull and the “Fruit Loop.”
If you can speak with people who grew up or worked for your prototype, you will learn lots of little details you’ll never get from books. You need to just take your best shot at some research and then run trains. As a result you’ll get into a mindset that “sensitizes” you to the operating issues your prototype likely faced and things will jump out to you in books and videos that you never paid
Mark:
Don’t worry, my shoulders are broad … I can handle it. Hmmm, say, that would make a good slogan for a railroad … [swg]
Actually, running trains while building the layout is one of the great secrets to keeping enthusiasm in the hobby high, which translates into more progress on the layout.
I started op sessions just after my golden spike on my mainline in 1998. With regular monthly operating sessions, I was highly motivated to have something new to show the guys, which means I had to work on the layout. So I’m convinced you need to start holding regular operating sessions as soon as you can after you get some track laid. That’s your guarantee that you’ll keep plugging away at the layout because you will want to have more to do when you operate!
In fact, one of the things the LDSIG recommends is people with a larger home layout under construction build a “flatop” staging yard that moves with the mainline as it grows. You basically get yourself a nice long 1x12 or something similar, and lay a small staging yard on it with a few tracks, and then put it at the “end of the line” where your main runs. Now you have a staging yard you can use to feed trains to the main, or as an ending place for trains running over your layout. As you expand your layout with construction, you move the “flatop” to keep moving out with your ever-expanding layout.
Using the flatop staging yard, as soon as you have a couple train-lengths of mainline down, you can start holding op sessions! [swg]
Great idea for a clinic, Joe… “count me in…”
Bob
Joe, You are so good. I’m sure you have heard that before, a couple of times… Yes I live on the other side of the pond so I can’t see these trains in person and that’s bad. And the Rio Grande is just a memory now so… But I have learned a lot from all the mailing lists I’m a member of. For example the DRGW list at yahoo. So that is a very good source. Another source I have is my growing collection of DRGW DVD’s. I have learned a lot by looking at them. So for all model railroaders that lives on my side of the pond. Register yourself at some yahoo lists and buy some DVD’s of your prototype. I will tell you all a fantastic thing. On the Rio Grande there are some curves that is called ‘Big ten curves’. I know that the wind is blowing VERY hard in that area. So much that a loco blowed off the track many years ago. There was a post at the DRGW list about this. And someone asked exactly when it happened. And the guy that answered the question was the same guy that run the train the day it happened. You can’t beat that, amazing. Now they have freight cars (fastened to the rail) filled with stone in a siding (turnouts where removed) in that area acting as a windshield. A nice prototypical detail for the model railroad. Another question for you Joe, I have some problem’s when trying to collect all the information about my prototype. I need a way to store it so it’s all in one place, photos, text and so on. Do you have any suggestions how to do that? I would be very satisfied if I could do a quick search on my Mac and there I have it, quick and easy. So I think the thing I need is a good way to store information. When I need some info I often do a search on the net or ask some mailing lists just to realize that I have asked the same question before, but I can’t find the question, or the answer. Maybe I’m getting old 
TOPIC THIS POST: The importance of running trains at a scale speed
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Joe. From what i’ve seen of your work, I for one would love to see you post this clinic. You have elevated this hobby to a new level. I especially like your technical and writting skills. I often refer to your web site for inspiration and ideas. Keep up the great work.
Bob:
I appreciate the vote of confidence coming from someone like you who does fantastic modeling.
I’m hosting the clinic posts themselves over on my own web site so I can easily control the formatting and content, and make sure the URL doesn’t change around.
The TOPIC THIS POST posts have a click here link that you can click on to view the specific post – so each clinic post is only one click away. Plus it’s nice to keep the clinic itself relatively free of repeated “bump” posts and to keep most of the discussion on here in this thread. I think it’s working pretty well so far. [swg]