On my just-concluded round-trip on the Sunset Limited, I noted with interest two FRA cars at the tail end of the consist for the entire LA to NO run between Sunday, August 21st and Tuesday, August 24th. One had the car number DTOX 200 and was painted white with red and blue trim; the other was number DTOX 201 and was painted dark maroon with yellow lettering. Both had side lettering of USA Department of Transportation Federal Railroad Administration Office of Safety. 200 had a fine looking rear observation platform, and seemed to have technical appartus therein. 201 was probably just a straight coach car. I could detect no occupation in either.
A quick search of our community here revealed no immediate information, so thought that some of you might have some knowledge of them. Thanks in advance.
I humbly stand corrected. You are right, they were numbered 220 and 221. I just copied the numbers here incorrectly from my on-board notes. What are “geometry cars,” and why were they being repositioned to NO?
We just had a visit from another FRA TGC on our line this past week. Unfortunately, I missed seeing it, but it did find a couple of defects that saddled us with some slow orders almost immediately. Neither was enough to close the track, but things were far enough out of tolerance that they were flagged.
Thanks, “tree68,” for your valuable information (for me) regarding the TGCs. Perhaps they were actively working on the Sunset Limited route because of the current and on-going two-tracking activity, requiring new track checking. Or else, being repositioned for work in the South.
I am now recalling a recent Trains magazine article about these TGCs.
When testing the FRA geometry cars are operated as their own train. I suspect their trip on the Sunset was repositioning them the their next assigned area to test.
Since the cars operate as a separate train how will they operate on the new HSR lines?
There can be some trends taken from lower speeds but still there would be need to verify those figures by actual speed tests. And actual tests at speed should certainly be needed ? ?.
It may be that the FRA will have to order a couple additional cars tacked on the AMTRAK order for “Viewliner - 2s” to have a HSR capable car of the final design speed ? ?
Does the FRA also monitor the results from the ACELA test car when it operates over the NEC??
Next will the class 1s that get HSR need to upgrade their geometry cars? They certainly may want more often readings than an occasional FRA inspection ? May eventually want to order a new car per item #3 ?
Sine the class ones probably do not have any loco that is now capable of 110 MPH ( Have the heritage locos been regeared?) will they need a HSR loco or have to borrow an AMTRAK P-42 or P-40 (being upgraded to P-42 specs including 110 MPH) ? Same question for those routes electrified at 110+ MPH ?
Not sure about the most recent trip, but I know when they car came up last year we had to tow it back down the hill - it was only set up to run in one direction, although it can test both ways.
220 has to be towed by something, 217-219 (the old T-series, etc…) are self propelled…T-10 is the old Budd SPV-2000 and T-6 was also a converted heavyweight car…200 could well be repositioned elsewhere, but still be testing on the back of Amtrak at district speed…the limiting factor is the Ensco (over-rated, they still don’t get it) crew and the local FRA supervision’s availability.
Wasn’t 220 one of the last things out of Colorado Railcar before it folded?
As it stands now, UP, BNSF and NS equipment would most likely be considered superior to the FRA cars with dedicated people, better maintenance and research backing up the cars.
Tree: unusual that FRA was out on you in their car…did somebody request it? (I can think of a couple of shortlines out here that have yet to see one or haven’t seen one in quite a while) There is no way that the handfull of geometry cars that FRA has could test all the mainline railroad of all classes in the lower 48 and Alaska. If the FRA dinged you from the car, your people better be all over it and document in detail the short term and long term remediation. If AAR 110 gets out there (former eSPee SD45X modified beyond all recognition) the L/V test will eat you alive.
Anything above FRA Class 5 and HSR handling freight won’t have freight for long unless it’s very low in the carloadings and weight department. HSR and heavy tonnage/ heavy haul freight are largely incompatible in a practical $en$e. I don’t want to see the “Twist” parameters for a Klauder spiral applied to a freight conventional spiral curve…the alarm bell would never go off.[(-D][(-D][swg]
They probably came back to recheck on the shortline we connect with (they got hit pretty hard last year) and got us again since they were in the area and we do handle passengers - which is also a factor in their visit, I’m sure.
Our major slow order (two miles, which reportedly resulted from about 10’ of out-of-gauge track) has been lifted as our MOW folks were out on the line the next morning with some gauge bars pulling it back in. The other spot they hit us with with had a dip at a trail crossing. The speed has already been increased over the spot, and once they get some more tamping done, I’m sure that one will be gone, too.
The shortline involved had managed to get one slow order lifted by Friday evening when I worked a train over that line, but still had a couple of other spots to square away.
The Track Geometry Cars do not travel at “track speed”. They operate at lower speeds and measure the geometric characteristics of the track they’re inspecting. Those characteristics will determine what FRA Class the inspected track qualifies under and what maximum speeds will be allowed.
There are 9 FRA track classes. “High Speed Rail” (passenger only) will require Class 6 (110 mph), Class 7 (125 mph), Class 8 (150 mph) or Class 9 (200 mph) track.
Following is a link to a four page fact sheet published by the FRA.
I just saw them at Metra’s 14th Street facility yesterday (08/30) on my ride home from work. Perhaps they were requested by Metra for their own track inspection.
FRA’s cars do indeed test at track speed (been there, done that on the back of Amtrak 3 & 4 between 75 and 90 MPH) - Drawback: If the car has a technical failure, the train doesn’t stop while you fix it / test OVER…
BNSF typically tries to test at 40-45 MPH max, more as a way to stop in the middle of a failed test and also to get uniform results (precision index … there still is a big difference between accuracy and precision folks, they aren’t the same thing…)
The extra speed on a heavilly ballasted geometry car gets markedly different results than a little lightweight cookie-cutter car. Every railroad handles the geometry car issue differently, largely as a mattter of budget and theory.
NAW …just put two bubbas on the Amthrax train…put one on the viewliner with a half cup of coffee and tell him to watch it; put the the other Bubba in da Superliner with an empty beercan and tell him to put it on the top shelf and watch it…[:-,][:-,][:-,]