how much fuel does a diesel locomotive use when sitting at idle? I see yard locos and some short line locos ideling all night in cool weather. just tonight I saw chatooga and chickmauga CF-7 #103 it has been parked and runnig since friday when they finished their run[:)]
I have seen fuel conservation stickers in the cabs of sd-40’s stating 45 gallons per 8hrs hour at idle. Have no other data to back that up.
i remember reading it was something more like 8 gallons per hour for the typical sd40. i think a lot of the new engines idle slower, which in theory uses even less fuel.
So why is it considered better to let all those engines sit and idle all the time and burn up all that fuel then just start them when you need them like a car?
a sd-40 will burn 55 gallons of fuel in 10 hours at idel…
csx engineer
becoues locomotives dont have anit-freeze like your car dose to protect the cooling system… thier is a risk of the water freezeing if the ambiant temp drops below 32 degrees and the prime mover is shut down… so unless the unit is equiped with an APU… that will restart the prime mover when the water temp gets to the danger zone… you have to leave the locomotive running to keep it from freezing up…if the unit should shut down and cant be restarted when a risk of it freezeing…all the water has to be drained out of the cooling system to protect it… and belive me…its ALOT of water and that will take a while to refill from Empty… so in short…that is why in cold weather the units are left to idel…insted of being shut down
csx engineer
I now I saw a fuel useage report at idle for a 645 series engine is right around 1/2 gallon per cylinder per hour. A 16 cylinder would use 8 gallons per hour and 6 for the 12 cylinder and the fuel hog would use 10 gallons per hour. A semi engine at idle burns 1 and 1/2 gallons per hour at 1000 rpm. I ran mine there to make sure I did not have oil build up in the piston. Leaving a truckstop after 8 hours you can tell those who raised teh idle and those who did not.
Here is a chart for fuel useage
Considering I was going from a 10 year old memory I was not to far off.
to add to csx engineer’s remarks – which are completely correct. – and to anticipate the question, why not use antifreeze? – there are two reasons: first, enough antifreeze to protect a good-size diesel would be very very expensive (priced anti-freeze lately?) and second, leaks are not totally uncommon – most diesels are not pressurized cooling systems (unlike your car) and small leaks are common enough. Just plain water wandering loose isn’t much of a problem. Anti-freeze, however, in the engine oil is an oil change, assuming you catch it before the bearings fail. As csx says, the ‘modern’ approach to the problem is to have a small APU runnng all the time to keep things warm, or to have either an APU or the main engine equipped to start automatically if things get too cold. A number of newer engines are set up this way. Of course, the second option implies that a) you have some way to notify someone if the engine or APU doesn’t start and b) that someone can make it to the unit in question and either drain it or get it started before it freezes up. Not a problem in a yard or engine service area, but presents some interesting questions if you’re tied down in East Overshoe, Iowa or someplace…
The shortline I work for uses 3 GP-9s (2 ex-GTW 1 PRR-CR-NHN) with small 1200 gal fuel tanks so the local fuel dealer likes us. But even after being built 50 years ago they are still the best locos for the job at hand.
Thanks you and CSX good answers. Only question I have left is that if it is a freezing concern why do they still do it in a sweltering summer? (Now granted I’m talking from old memories of Hobson yard in Lincoln, NE maybe they don’t do that anymore)
I know in NY State there is an ENCON law that prohibits excessive diesel ideling if the temp is above freezing. If memory serves me right I think the max allowed time is 20 minutes of stand still idle unless the unit is being worked on or is in active switch duty. I dont know who is going to stand there with a stop watch to see if the 20 minutes are up.[:p]
Hehe yeah. As a boy in the '80’s I saw 20-30 units at a time sitting at Hobson engine terminal idleing all the time. The only time I saw a locomotive shut off was for maintence or it was in storage. My father at the time told me it was better for the engines to idle always then start and stop, but I never really fully made sense of that.
It is easier on the engines to keep them running, not so much for cold, but wear. Just like any engine, from a Chevy 5.7, truck diesel to EMD’d or GE’s, all engine have the same problem. 70% to 90% of all engine wear, (bearing, rods, cams rings). etc, comes form startup. When things are hitting hard and pushing heavy and there is no oil yet around the parts. Thats’ straigth friction and nothign kills metal faster then friction. (I am not nut sure, but I do not think the locomotive engines have pre-oiler pumps.) So, yeah, ironically, it is easer on the engine to leave it run for 12 hours then to shut it down it down for 11
Watch your motor’s at home if you have a oil presure gauge. Newer cars are the worst. That fuel injection dumps fuel and revs the idl up and your oil gauge wont move for a bit. Ouch[V].
I know alot of small towns around here, but I don’t recall ever seeing/going through that one…[:D]
Ah ok, it’s all about engine wear. So are some of these new/remodeled engines going out to CA have better ways of dealing with cold starts?
I have been working for the Belgian State Railways (NMBS) for 25 years and the diesel engines had to be shut down if they where not moving for more than 20 minutes.
Maybe here we think a little bit more about the enviroment and the future for our children than about cost effectifness
There’s something more important then the bottom line?
one other concern is that BIG diesels take BIG batteries to start. and the railroad environment (vibration, temperature extremes, benign neglect) means that the batteries in locomotives often are not up to the task of cranking a cold engine, especially in cold weather.
Too, there’s a bit more than just slamming the door and turning the key in lighting up an EMD or an early alco. . . (no experience with GEs or Baldwins but I imagine they’re similar); to combat that tendancy to leak that someone already mentioned, it’s important to open the test-cocks and roll the engine for 5-10 seconds to clear any water, condensation, crankcase oil or other foriegn matter from the engine before you actually try to start it. Failiure to do so earns you a black mark with the mechanical department even if you don’t tra***he engine.
the sequence for a nw-2 or gp7 goes something like:
close air tank drains.
inspect trucks and couplers.
unlock cab
read engine log.
main switch on.
radio check.
pre-oil (if equipped) on).
remove stack covers.
open 12-16 test cocks.
check engine oil.
check governor linkage and oil.
check water level.
check compressor oil.
check air boxes for debris and water.
roll engine for 6-10 revolutions or until all cocks blow clear air.
(if 20 revs don’t do it, you’re done. secure the engine and battery; alert mechanical department. note bad order in log and yard office.)
if you’ve got this far:
close all test cocks.
reset emergency cutoff.
turn on fuel boost pump. wait 20-30 sec.
pull gently on the governor override lever.
roll engine until you feel the governor catch it- be ready on the emergency cut in case of run-away.
secure pre-oil (if equipped)
observe stacks and listen for even firing.
reset ground relay.
let engine warm at low idle for 10-30 minutes.
all in all, more like pre-flighting an airpla