I bought and read “Basic DCC wiring for your Model Railroad” (Kalmbach). It focusses on wiring the layout, not really about installing decoders. The “DCC guide” (also by Kalmbach) is in the same price range and is probably more comprehensive - I probably should have bought that one.
Simon
EDIT: My mistake, there are a few pages on decoder installs in the book about Basic DCC wiring. My apologies to the author.
Thank you for the continuing replies, much appreciated. I’m still reading and researching.
I’ve been in the hobby since 1954 as a teenager. I bought my first DCC system in 2016 the NCE Power Cab. It is the easiest to use for beginners. Decoders are universal and work with any NMRA standard system. However the technology is chnaging rapidly. Soundtraxx just announced a new decoder that will work with Blue tooth and your an app for your phone. Best way to learn is on the internet YOUTUBE channel or find a local hobbyost with DCC who may want to help you.
I have an NCE Power Cab because my HOn3 modular club chose NCE over 10 years ago.
With Blackstone being out of my price range when they finally came out with the C-19, none of my HOn3 locos have decoders. All have needed/need tinkering to make them run well enough on DC to consider installing decoders.
Same is true for the 1900-era steam fleet made up of NOS and used Mantua/Roundhouse and similar kits.
But really there is no reason for DCC on a small single operator layout. I only operate one locomotive at a time. The only real selling point for DCC for me is adding sound to the locomotives and layout.
Fred W
…modeling foggy coastal Oregon, where it’s always 1900…
Does DCC allow for better MU (i.e. more than one diesel operating as a team) operation?
I prefer to operate alone and sound doesn’t interest me. But multiple diesels does interest me, so that might be the only reason for me to consider if it is a factor. Otherwise I thing y’all talked me out of DCC.
You will get differing opinions on this,
In my opinion, if you have similar locos with similar motors, gearing, and speed ranges, you probably don’t need DCC.
On the other hand, if you have one loco with a top speed of 80 smph and another with a top speed of 100 smph, with DCC you can adjust the speeds to more closely match each other.
In addition, if you want the top speed of all your locos to be limited to a specific value, say 60 smph, you can do that with DCC.
Now some will say that when multiple locos are consisted (DC) and pulling a train the load will balance out. Maybe. On the other hand I have seen (DCC) three unit sets of six axle units pulling a 32-35 car train with the wheels on one of the engines happily spinning (grinding?) away because it was not speed matched with the others. Obviously I just imagined that.
One thing that the anti-DCC users are not willing to climb out of their high cupolas to recognize is that DCC may be a blessing to some of us, even if we don’t want sound. For example, my “railroad” will never be more than a glorified loop with some industries to switch. I also have some staging tracks.
My downfall is that I happen to like locos, far in excess to what I need. What to do with them if I don’t want to take them off the tracks? With DCC I can park them wherever I want. No need to have toggle switches, relays, and so forth.
As a matter of fact, if I were willing to dispense with power operated turnout motors, then I would have no need any control panels.
Yes it can. I can mirror what Maxman had said. Without DCC I could never run my five 2-10-0 steam locomotives. They are from five different manufacturers and have five different motors and gearboxes.
The downside of DCC is complexity and costs. Some people just can’t get programming down right away. But eventually it becomes second nature. Standardization of the basic CVs is fantastic. But after that each maker does their own thing making lighting and sound programming confusing. Computer programs are a godsend sometimes.
While costs can be a downfall. That is debatable. I have seen and operated on some very sofisticated DC cab control layouts. They had miles of wiring and switches, power supplies, cabs, knobs and complex wiring. The cost of all that would rival the cost of a great 5 amp system with simple buss wiring. When my former club switched from DC to a three booster DCC system. We stripped out more than 43 pounds of copper wire, sixty rotary switches, hundreds of toggle switches and 4 varyarc transformers. And that was just in a three level 6x30 layout.
Sound is optional. So I will not comment on it.
Hope this helps.
Pete.
Maxman and Pete, ditto for me.
I’ve read quite a few comments in various threads that the main reason for having DCC is sound, and if you’re not interested in sound, then go with DC.
I’m not interested in sound, although I have one locomotive with it. I don’t use the sound much.
I like my DCC system for the same reasons listed above, not because of sound.
Hello All,
A resounding- -YES!
When I first got back into this great hobby I had only known DC control from my previous experiences in the early 1970s.
My presumption was that DC would be cheaper than the more technical, and “expensive” DCC.
Having been a theatrical lighting technician (electrician) I had firsthand experience of the evolution from analog to digital lighting control systems.
I knew the simplicity of digital- -yes you read that correctly- -and the complexity of analog control systems with its banks of switches, relays, and literally, tons of copper wire.
At the current price of copper ($3.34/lb. as of 9/23/2022) its $143.62- -that’s just the salvage price!
Now factor in the other components and you are probably looking at around $200.00, at current prices, for a “moderate” DC system.
As has been posted, this is where DCC really shines!
A sentiment I respectfully disagree with, especially if you want to run several locomotives or utilize Advance Consisting.
[quote user=“maxman”]
My downfall is that I happen to like locos, far in excess to what I need. What to do with
Maybe, but I would think that the main reason for having DCC is independent locomotive control, not sound.
Rich
I agree. My point was how often I’ve read comments that claim the main reason for DCC is sound.
Hello All,
Well, you’ve expanded the discussion to the second page…[;)]
As far as sound goes- -there are several DC systems that can enable sound-equipped DCC locomotives.
I don’t run sound, but I do run several consists.
DCC, DCC, DCC, that’s for me!!! (I apologize to Gene Wilder and Mel Brooks.)
Hope this helps.
Sound came out a lot later than DCC. There were early sound units. Crude, horrible and little to no customization. The early Soundtraxx (I had one) decoder was HUGE! And it was only sound. It also operated on DC. Actually it sounded better on DC. On DCC it hummed and sometimes when powering up had a high pitch squeel. It was also very pricey. A few years later, this little German company started selling motor, light, and sound decoders. They required a 100 ohm speaker. Priced comparable to a very good motor/lighting decoder. With a special separate programming unit and computer you can customize and even change sound sets. The decoder even had BEMF at a time when even TCS was using Dither. The worst thing about it was the volume of the horn/whistle and the speaker.
Sound is optional. Just about all my steam has sound. It was just recently I started putting sound in my diesel fleet. I still have nine locomotives with just motor/lighting decoders.
Pete.
i believe it’s simpler wiring
Not only is the wiring simplified, the amount of it is greatly reduced.
You don’t need to run wire between the throttle, switches and blocks if you want something beyond a simple layout.
Just two wires, with a lot of feeders.
As someone who more recently switched, I had a few reasons. For one I like sound but I also like the juciers for turnouts, a real game changer for someone who likes small engines. Also most new stuff out there is DCC for motive power.
I love how we gloss over the feeders every 6’ like that is not wiring? Somehow it is not “wiring” because it is rock simple?
I don’t have feeders every 6’ on my DC layout? Typical control block 30’ to 60’ feet with only one feeder run thru an inductive detector for signaling.
And power district and circuit breaker wiring can get pretty involved as DCC layout get larger.
I’m not being anti DCC here, let’s just tell the truth.
DCC wiring can be very simple, or complex, depending on layout size and operational goals.
The exact same thing can be said about DC.
Dr Wayne powers his DC layout with two wires - mine will have thousands for my adavanced cab control that includes signaling, one button route control of turnouts, local tower control panels, walk around radio throtttles (yes in DC), CTC and more.
Things that keep DCC wiring simple:
Signaling, advanced turnout control, very large layout, throttles for lots of operators will all increase DCC wring requirements.
Operational Philosophy
This is the real question.
DCC lets you be more like the engineer and less like the dispatcher. That’s why it was originally invented.
And long before sound there were lots on Command Control systems that are not DCC, all of which worked,
how do you deal with less than reliable rail joiners?
When I was building the N scale Dream House layout, construction began in 1990, if I have my dates right.
I bought a massive (ridiculous) fleet of Kato N scale locomotives. If you remember the shortage of Kato undecorated models from those days… I caused it.
Everything was DC. I do not remember the timing of DCC becoming available, but I think it was either very new, or just over the horizon at that time.
As I built the layout, I knew there had to be a better way. The wiring was getting unbearable and way too complicated.
For a large multi-operator layout, I would never suggest DC to a novice. The advantages of DCC just far out-weigh any downsides.
For a layout that is small, DCC really adds a lot of fun, you know, pretending to be an engineer and just “playing trains” for a while.
-Kevin
Solder - I have been soldering all my rail joints within each control block since before I was in this hobby. Meaning, my father was a “holiday” modeler, setting up a very elaborate 90 sq ft HO layout every year for the Christmas season.
It was built with Tru-Scale ready track. He soldered and unsoldered every rail joint every year.
At age 10, we had finally had a house with a basement where we intended to stay a while. He built the layout in the basement, and in two years it was mine.
I changed it, expanded it, years later built several new layouts at home, became a member of the Severna Park Model Railroad Club where I learned more track skills than what my father had taught me with the Tru-Scale products and hand laid the track on the next few layouts.
So, for 50 plus years, no electrical issues with rail joints.
Sheldon