What proposals have been drawn up for Amtrak? I am aware that privatization has been put on the table many time for Amtrak. Has the government supplied any other solutions for Amtrak besides privatization or the dismantlement of the entire system?
Perhaps it should be “viable proposals”!
There seems to be only two classic options: (1) Acknowledging the necessity of government subsidies (No profit minded investors are pounding down Amtrak’s door, are they?), and/or (2) making the company more efficient.
I believe that Amtrak’s President David Gunn has openly spoken about the necessity of the latter.
I just don’t understand with 100% of tax dollar funds from the government going to fund Amtrash could the government allow this to continue. Amtrak is a complete waist of tax payers dollars. With the increase of traffic on our nations hiways I just don’t get it.
It’s like Deja Vu all over again…Chad, can you give me a hand with the popcorn machine, here? Somehow I get a feeling it’s going to be busy on this thread…
I think popcorn eaters are nothing but a bunch of liberal neocons.[}:)][}:)]
Only a General of the Scoundrels could get away with saying that, Jay! [:P]
All fired up and ready to go.[:D]
[:0]Well I’ve been called a lot of things before, But I never been called that.[;)]
The gov’t hasn’t even figured out what Amtrak is supposed to be, much less how it ought to be organized and funded.
That’s why Amtrak and it’s funding are such a mess.
Government solutions[(-D]
to BNSF Railfan
I’m sorry, but I just don’t follow your logic
You mention cutting Amtrak’s subsidies and then you
mention congestion on the highways
are you suggesting that where a three lane interstate
is congested it should be automatically increased to
six lanes at the taxpayers expense to relieve bottlenecks.
The more cupboard space I install in my house, the more
clothes my wife buys.
Well since you mentiond this now I’m able to say what I was thinking about when I read BNSF’s Railfan’s post, our nations highways are the pits!!! For example if there was no Amtrak and the government did decide to increas a major highway like the PA turnpike or I 95 from three lanes to six lanes. There goes a toll increase and there goes high taxes. Then again increasing the lanes from three to six isn’t really going to do much with out Amtrak or any other form of passenger rail transportation because you would still have the bottle necks and increased traffic. In turn you might also see more accidents on these highways because, for example if the PA Turnpike were increased to six lanes you would have to up the speed in some areas from 55 to 65, in order to keep traffic flowing at a constant rate ( by deffinition of the highway engineers). Another reason for fare and tax increase is due to the construction overall. Here in PA we are currently undergoing a major "highway overhual of the PA route 309 (to us in southeastern PA we call it “The 09”) they are widening the highway from two lanes to three lanes in some areas four. They are also widening some the interchanges from one lane to two. This alone is costing the state about 2.3 billion. So, I could only begin to image how much it would cost the state or other states to widen a three lane highway to a six lane highway. Thats a lot of money there. PennDot is also doing other things to the highway, which is going to cost a
It is worse at my house. My wife stopped buying new clothes because all the closet space is taken.
I remember British Rail from the late 80’s You could get up in the morning, fix breakfast and walk to the station to work in London 120 miles away. Every day for a few bucks with a drink and snack car to ease the trip.
I think it’s time we bring back passenger rail but the Govt will not do it, the freight railroads wont do it and no one will spend any money for this.
Amtrack is probably not in a position to expand because they cannot be sure of thier annual budget and long distance trains suffer.
I have seen the interstate on the Jersey Turnpike (Eh? What and where is that?) grow over 20 years from 4 Lanes to 6 then 12 and the daily gridlock simply fills the volume of the new construction as it works south.
It is my opinion you can double stack and make 24 lanes out of interstates but folks will try to use the same off ramp and clog up the entire works every am at rush hour.
Here’s a few directions for improvements (taken from the minutes of the Railway Age conference):
"Observations and Lessons Learned
For the Public Sector Passenger Agencies:
-You are NOT entitled to run passenger trains on every track or right of way you can see or identify; Shiny rails will usually mean there are already lots of trains operating on those tracks
-There is both an asset value and a level-of-utility value to railroad lines; the level-of-utility value is generally what is important to a railroad, and that utility value can change, depending upon the capacity, condition and traffic base of the fixed facilities. This is the area where the public sector can work most beneficially with private railroads.
-You don’t need to own the physical asset itself: You do need to own the ‘right-of-access’ for your passenger trains, for a specific number of frequencies, and provision of a guaranteed minimum level of maintenance. You can negotiate these financial arrangements with a freight railroad to get where you want to be.
-Going the ‘political route’, or the media route, when you don’t initially get the answer you want from the railroad, will likely make your life more difficult in dealing with the railroads. The carrot works much better than the stick. Fighting your battles in the press changes the relationship. Trust is important, and, like in a marriage, infidelity may be forgiven, but is not likely to be forgotten.
-Remember, the railroads are not in the business of running trains. They are in the business of making money…… Using trains is how they do it. You and your project can either help them, or you can hinder them. Think about which one is more likely to make them cooperative.
-Whenever there is an issue to be resolved, hold the door open for a mutually beneficial approach to the objective you are seeking;
-Bring your lawyers and contract administrators into the foray ONLY AS A LAST RESORT.
Amtrak is not a solution for highway congestion.
Local and regional commuter rail can help, but 4000 autos/hour on the highway does not equate to any where near 4000 potential train riders.
Here “gov’t” should be in the plural. What other result should one expect from an government where every congressman, every member of the cabinet, and bureaucrat feels, rightly so, he has an equal say? In the end, no one runs it and no one supplies a vision or rationale.
Just be grateful the Amtrak mess doesn’t involve serious bucks, as something like socialized medicine would.
CG9602-Nice piece.
DSchmitt-No one suggests that rail will allow the closing of expresways. If it does nothing more than hold off the need for additional lanes for a few years, taxpayers may be ahead of the game.
eastside-All those groups may have, along with the general public, a right to make suggestions for the shape of the program, but somewhere there is supposed a leader who is to see that the progam is finally put together and sent out for approval.
Jay
Heck, I couldn’t figure out what he was trying to say. Especially:
Quote from BNSFrailfan:
“I just don’t understand with 100% of tax dollar funds from the government going to fund Amtrash could the government allow this to continue. Amtrak is a complete waist of tax payers dollars. With the increase of traffic on our nations hiways I just don’t get it.”
Back to me:
Amtrak isn’t paid for 100% by tax dollars, it’s subsidized, just like all other forms of transportation in this country.
Your very correct. But…
More and more Money WILL go into the Hiway bill and not Amtrak.
Out of curiosity, does anyone know how much income Amtrak takes in from fares annually?
Congratulations everyone on a polite and intelligent discussion.[tup][tup] I saw this topic yesterday before it had any posts, and cringed. I’m not sure it’s safe to unplug the popcorn machine, but so far so good.[swg]