Grade building using Gargraves...how steep

Classic Toy Trains Forum
1

I need to know if a half inch per foot is OK to climb to the next level. I have 16 feet to use and need to go up 8 inches. This is my Fall project. I have this planned into my existing 15ft. X 26Ft. “L” shape layout, but I have not done any testing yet. I use post war, modern, & every thing in between. Motive power is Lionel, Williams, Kline, MTH, & Weaver. Any advise is welcome. Thanks gang.[:)]

Dennis

2

Grades are computed as # inches vertical rise / # inches horizontal run * 100, so 8 / 192 inches of horizontal run = 4.2%. This is steep, but do-able.

Real railroads go this steep in mountanous terrain, if they can’t help it. Usually, grades are kept to 2% or lower.

That said, it’s your pike. Do as you please.

Tony

3

I once had a very steep grade, which also ended on a curve! I first used Super 0, but when I replaced it with Gargraves, there was a very discernable difference in the traction. My locomotives pulled a lot better with the Gargraves track. I don’t know if it was because Magne-traction worked better with Gargraves, or if the three foot sections gave it a better footing than four 9" Super O sections, but it worked. In other words, I found that you can get away with a steeper grade using Gragraves, but don’t push your luck. 4.2 is pretty steep, and toy trains operate under the same rules of physics as the real ones do.

4

I have a 4% grade on my layout, using Gargraves. (See pic below)
If you can make it out in the back ground. I also have a turn at either end.
Every engine I have will make it up, although the number of cars will differ.

Typically a post war will pull about 4 or 5 cars.
A modern era, 5 to 7 depending on engine. Dual motors about 10.
LTI to present, (again depending on enigne) at least 14, this is all my reversing loop will handle.

[img.nr]http://sc.groups.msn.com/tn/03/70/ZAKSTRAINS/2/d.jpg[/img.nr]

5

Just finished a new layout using 1/4 in. rise every 7 1/2 inches…that works out to 1.9 Deg., no problems with K-Line and Lionel engines.

Your 1/2 in. rise in 12 inches works out to 2.4 Degrees…did this calculation with AutoCad, a graphics drawing system. Seems like a good choice, if you approach 4 degrees I expect you will have problems.

6

Althought the grade is pretty steep, my opinion is you should be fine. However, f you run a lot of steamers with smoke, the mineral oil will settle on the track. Thus oil gets on traction tires and wheels. So keep your track very clean. Once too much oil gets on the traction tires, 1) the wheels start to slip (and it is tedious and hard to clean off ) and 2) oil attacks the rubber eventually making it swell and the traction tires get loose. Once they get loose, they have to be replaced if they don’t throw themselves off the wheels.

I think eZAK gave some good numbers for cars that can be pulled. Aluminum passenger cars may be less than those quoted above.

7

Thanks guys for the help. I’m going to see if I can get any more length out of my run. I sure don’t want to be dumping any coal at the bottom of the hill somewhere.[:D]

Dennis

8

Dennis:

To gert a longer run, try putting curves in it. Do something like start off in one direction, curve away from where you want to go, then curve back to it. Something like a horeshoe shape. In fact, the PRR built Horeshoe Curve in order to add horizontal run space to reduce the grade on that section of the line.

The denominator for your grade would then be the length of all of the track. Adding an O72 horeshoe, you could add 4 or 5 or so feet to the run.

Or course, you’ve got to have somewhere to put that horeshoe…

Tony

Tony