Is a grade of 8 to 10% too extreme?
After eyeing a new addition I checked the gradient and found it to be 10%. I did some minor changes and have eased it to 8%. Realizing that the flow of traffic for this section will be going down the hill I still wonder if this grade is too extreme.
Changing it now means ripping up another line for about 5 feet and then easing its grade by doing major carving of styrofoam.
I hate to break the bad news to you, but yes – 8 to10 percent grades are extreme. The rule of thumb that I have always followed is not to make your grades above 2 percent, maybe 3 percent if absolutely necessary.
Fergmiester,
Alas, 10-8% is really too much. You didn’t say how long the grade is, but going up the grade, you’d be limiting the number of cars you can pull up to the hill. Perhaps you could lash on enough helpers to get all your freight up the hill, but going down hill could bring you a fairly nasty surprise. If you have weighed your rolling stock per the NMRA standards (I’d recommend that you do as the incidence of derailing drops dramatically), there would be quite a bit of weight bearing down on your locomotive. All that weight could not only push your engine off the track, but also result in a run away string of cars looking for a place to jump the rails.
Imagine this, put together a string of cars on a completed section of your track and go into god mode and move the rolling stock with your hands. Once you’ve obtained a scale speed of, oh, say 20 mph, come to a quick stop (not a sudden stop, a fast slow down if you will). Feel the weight of all those cars?
I don’t the details of your layout, but I am guessing the reason you have the high grade is to save space, and that there is a turn close to the bottom of the grade, your cars are going to want to push whatever is in the curve straight.
I sympathize with your dilemma as I too have had to go through some tough decisions on my layout that I did not want to do. My advise is to talk to some of the old timers, (I did and have benefited from their mistakes), they can help and guide you on your quest to make a fine layout.
I hope this helps out. I certainly don’t want to give the impression of criticizing, just don’t want you to go through the time, effort, and expense for a result you may not like at all.
Hi Fergmiester
Well yes, 8 percent is maybe too much even if you are modeling a logging railroad and running Shay or Heisler locomotives. ( would anyone modeling logging railroads like to chime in here?)
From what I recall reading, a grade of four percent is about the most you would want to use to model mountian grades with helpers.
You have the same problem as the railroads in the early ninetieth century.
I understand you don’t want to rip out what you have, but the only alternatives I can think of is to ease a few cars up and down the grade at a time. You would need sidings on both top and bottom of the grade long enough for the locomotive to run around the train. Another thing the prototype did in that era was to build switch backs in the side of the mountain.
To make any of those scenarios look plausible and prototypical in operation, you would need to operate ninetieth or early twentieth century equipment. Modern stuff just would look out of place.
Is it possible for you to add length to the grade by looping it around like the Tehachapi loop?
Hang in there friend and don’t get discouraged. Remember we’re all in this together, we’re pull’n for ya!
G.
Thank you for the encouragement. After I read MABruce’s reply, the track (about 6 feet of it and partially ballasted) started to fly. At the present time I do have a 5% grade which is negotiable by my bigger locos.
Thanks for the info
I neglected to recheck my figures and ended up with a section of grade at 3%. Looks dumb but operates really great. A train (3 engines, 25 cars) really gets down on it’s hands and knees and crawls up the hill. I was going to relay the entire section but am going to leave it now - proto type operations. But I sure wouldn’t do anything more than 3%.
Sorry about my rather blunt reply. [
][:I] It’s just that one of the biggest regrets I’ve read from others who have built layouts is the steepness of their grades. Steep grades are not impossible to work with, but unless they are intentional, it can be a disappointment to those who watch their prized locos unable to make grade while pulling their normal loads.
Understood but lets be honest 8 to 10% grades are far to extreme and as of now the grade had been brought down to 5% and the cork bedding should be back in place by tonight. Unfortunately It has created a dominos effect as I now have to level off another section. Oh well better now then later
Once again, Thanks for the advice guys
Think of 2% Grade needs 16 feet of run to climb 4 inches. 8 to 10 % whew…
In my LHS Layout there are grades of about 4% I think we run a Bachmann 2-8-0 with 6-9 cars up and down those without too much trouble. But on a 4x8 layout that is considered a “TRAIN”
In a grade Ill simply add locomotives until I can get it over the top, just like the prototype. If the train is simply too long or too heavy (Or not enough locomotives; weak power pack) Ill break it into two sections and double the hill. (Three sections if necessary)
Keep up your efforts in trying for a better grade for your trains, your engines will thank you for it.