while searching on walthers.com for info on the atlas turntable for another thread i also checked on the atlas roundhouse
HO turntable = $25.75 on sale for $19.98
N turntable = $21.75
O turntable = $175.95 !!!
HO roundhouse = $27.95 on sale for $20.98
N roundhouse = $28.50 on sale for $21.98
O roundhouse = $209.95 !!!
man ! now i know why i don’t model in O scale . wonder what they’d charge if they did a G scale version ???
Look at the O gauge TT prices at AAA Turntables.[:O]
O gauge is expensive. Much more so than HO scale.
When a B&O wagontop Caboose in O gauge costs 65 dollars RTR, Engine starts at 400 and goes up from there and other rolling stock ranging from 40 to 80 dollars or more each with wish books carrying exotic engines for thousands of dollars… it’s definately not my scale.
I could sell out of HO scale and get into O gauge and have a small loop, a train and some buildings and that’s it.
No, O gauge is a market for those who have the funds and enjoy being able to recreate thier child hood.
Some people don’t realize the size of O Scale. I was down at a O Scale club and it’s huge. A 100’ turntabel is probably 5 feet long.[{(-_-)}]
How about comparing prices between O scale (2 rail, not Lionel) and G scale?
Keep in mind an O scale mode has 8 times the volume of an HO scale one.
Smoke,
You obviously don’t realize the size of O Scale either, it is 48:1 so a 100’ turntable would be just over 2’ long, not 5’ long. A 135’ turntable, which is big enough to turn a Bigboy, is LESS than 3’ long. A 3’ long turntable in O Scale would be the equivilent of 144’ long, which is longer than any real turntable that I know of.
I am a multi-scale modeler, both HO and O, and yes some things are more expensive, but not nearly as much as many people make the difference out to be. There are many nice traditional O-Gauge engines in the $200-250 price range. Also a lot more can be done in a smaller space in O-Gauge than many people not familiar with O-Gauge would realize. With the minimum curvature being O-27 (13.5" radius) or O-31 (15.5" radius) you can do a LOT, even on a 4x8 layout, and if you go to a 5x9 it makes a huge difference, while not taking up much more floor space. granted there will be more over hang on curves than would be prototypical, and you will be running shorter trains, but it can still be a very enjoyable way to model railroad. I have Lionel LionMaster series Bigboys, Challengers and a Cab-Forward, that will all run on O-31 curves, and the detail on them is very nice.
It is too bad that more people don’t understand O-Gauge better. Something that many people don’t know is WHY Lionel adopted three rail to begin with, so many years ago. Think about wiring reverse loops and WYEs in two rail, in three rail, there is NO SPECIAL wiring at all needed to accomodate these track plans, and is why you will see many three rail layout plans with multiple reverse loops and wyes. Also things like activating a crossing signal or track signals, is as easy as ins
You’re talking Lionel 3-rail toys here, not 1/4" (O scale) models. The curves you describe are far too tight for scale models to look or run well, unless we’re talking two-axle industrial switchers, maybe.
Sharp curves in O scale = 35" radius
Broad = 60" radius
My compromise: On30. Trains that run on small-radius curves but with all the superdetailing possibilities of standard guage.
yes i realize O is much larger than HO or N . i also realize the cost of making the molds for the models (which is usually the most expensive part of the manufacturing process) is probably not significantly different from HO to O but there will be some difference in the amount of plastic etc. used so some price difference isn’t surprising . also the motor drive is included with the O TT . still $50.00 total MSRP for the HO vs. $175 MSRP for the O seems rather steep
note that the O turntable is 24" in diameter
note that going from 7.5" in N to 9" in HO results in very little price increase . and yes i’ve noticed that 9 to 24 is a bigger increase than 7.5 to 9
A lot of businesses have the idea of “charge what the market will bear”. O scalers are used to paying higher prices so why not charge what you can get? I would be curious to see what the manufacturers profit percentage is on O gauge compared to HO or N.
IMHO, it’s not a “charge what the market will bear”, but rather a need to amortize high fixed costs over a very limited and finite market. Lionel has yet to come out of bankruptcy. MTH has admitted that they are not real healthy either.
An HO or N turntable (at least the Atlas-sized ones) can be fitted into a 4x8 layout. Their O scale TT will not fit in any likely 4x8 layout. Any guess as to what proportion of layouts in the country are 4x8 or smaller? So we have automatically limited sales by the size of the TT.
O is a minority market, much smaller than HO or N, even with the 3 railers added in. Assuming the TT is available in both 2 or 3 rail versions (I have not checked, don’t have room on my O layout for a TT), sales cannot exceed the number of layouts built in O gauge.
3 Railers, because of the sharp curves tend to have smaller layouts. And because of the ease of wiring with 3 rails, reverse loops and wyes are common. These 2 factors would drive down the 3 rail demand for a TT, which is way more than half the folks in O.
The dies for the HO TT were orginally cut back in the '50s. Their cost has long since been amortized. Not so for the O version.
Yes, O scalers are used to paying higher prices. So are folks in S, G, HOn3, and Z. To date, the only scales that have been able to beat high prices are HO, N, and On30 (by taking advantage of a lot of HO components).
just my thoughts, yours may differ
Fred W
Well DUh! Considering that HO scale is half the size of O!
I would be interested in what you people think an acceptable profit % should be. As a manufacture in a completely different industry I’ve watched our profits shrink year after year, while our costs keep going up and up. Do you think 10% Net is acceptable. I think most people would be surprised that its much lower than that. Oh well … just curious. So what do you think suppliers are making? Huh?
GUB
GUB-My parents bought a printing franchise about 20 years ago. The franchise said we needed to make a 65%-70% profit on our product to be successful. You took cost including labor and tripled it for a ballpark quote. We had a hard time getting 30-40% in the area we were in. The competition practically gave their stuff away just to turn dollars and make their books look good so they could sell the business and get out.
A few other companies got all their materials on credit. Produced a bunch of product and sold it real cheap and fast, never paid their vendors, closed the doors and filed bankruptcy. They then would move to the next town over and re-open in another family members name and do it all over again.[V]
When my Dad opened, he said if honesty and hard work mean anything, we will be successful! (It doesn’t and we weren’t[
])
Regardless of whether you use O 3-rail, O 2-rail or On30, on an O scale layout the footprint for structures, engines, etc. is 4 times the footprint for comparable items in HO and double what it is for S. This means for a given size layout you have less items in the larger scale.
Nothing wrong with having fewer cars, buildings etc., the tradeoff is in the larger scale you can have more detail and some folks like the presence the larger scale train has.
For me, S is a nice compromise, the engines and cars are about the same size as On30 but are standard gauge not narrow gauge (of course S scale 4-8-4’s and 80 ft passenger cars are bigger). The S buildings are about half the footprint of the O so you have more of a scenic setting for your railroad in the same space.
Enjoy
Paul
I am assuming that you are talking about Gross profit and not Net. When I started in my present job Gross Profit ran anywhere from 30 to 40% and net was around 10 to 12 %. Now nearly 15 yaers later our net is at 3 to 4% if we are lucky. Our gross on the other hand remains between 28 & 30%. Most people think we are making gobs of money, when in actual fact we are struggling to make ends meet, which I beleive is more the norm today.
GUB
Midnight Railroader,
ALL model trains are nothing more than TOYS, anyway and if someone enjoys three rail, there is no need to belittle their choice. As far as SCALE ACCURACY, forget about ON30, I personally don’t know of any 30" gauge railways (besides the ZOO LINER, here in Portland, OR) So your argument about ON30 doesn’t hold water. There may have been the rare 30" gauge railroad, in the far distant past, but I doubt many people can name any of them. So if you want to criticize someone Else’s choice as not scale worthy, please don’t fly the ON30 flag while doing it (if you like it, all the power to you enjoy it) ON30 is just a poor man’s excuse for O-Narrow Gauge.
&
To get back to the topic. Do the HO and O turntables mentioned in the first post have the same capabilities? If not, you really can’t compare the prices. Keep in mind that some HO turntables cost much more than 175.00.
This isn’t a serious answer but I don’t care…
With all the weight of the Oscale models, It probably broke the axle of a delivery truck, so they have to raise prices for the repairs to a WHOLE lot of delivery trucks, which is why the major manufacturers used trucks that have strong axles to bring in da dough ($$$).
Told you I wasn’t serious!
Look at how much bang for the buck you get with Z scale.