I’ve had only one whisker coupler failure. I was very clumsy and over bent one wire whisker beyond its spring back point. I can’t imagine how you could break a whisker off the coupler shank. I’m pretty sure the wires are steel. They are more robust than the #5 bronze spring.
Sorry, didn’t read carefully enough. Anyway, they’re not brass either so I checked Kadee’s info to find out they were bronze. Whisker wires seem tough enough to be spring steel.
No, Athearn ones aren’t pretty good. Kadee are the best of the proper sprung knuckle variety. Athearn often fits Accumate which are reliable (two piece, plastic curled spring) but goofy imho.
The comment about coupling technique is important. These knuckle couplers are intended for realistic (very very slow) coupling speeds. They are robust but if you hammer them even half as hard as the old horn and hook style you’re going to lose a lot of knuckle springs. Mind you if you bash the plastic competing couplers hard they just break. You’ll never break a Kadee coupler.
As it is for losing golf balls though, you may eventually lose enough knuckle springs on your layout you will start finding them again…
I’ll see if I can get a picture of my two broken Kadee couplers with an air bubble in the shaft. This would be two out of maybe a quick count of 2,200 Kadee couplers that I have installed. Yep, I’ll agree with Lsm, I’d say you will never break a metal Kadee coupler under ''normal operations". Now how can I get that picture to see the air bubble?
Got the picture. One metal Kadee coupler fell off the car sitting in a siding, the head was laying on the ties. It was the last car in the string but that coupler was hooked up to another Kadee. So I figured I did something dumb and just did not remember doing anything and broke it off. So I pick up that car and just ever so lightly touch the coupler on the other end and It just fell to the ties. You can see were the bubble was in the shaft. Click on the picture to open to a larger picture then you can zoom in.
I read on a forum somewhere a suggestion to put a clear plastic bag (e.g. pliable produce bag?) over the coupler and your hand holding whatever spring pic tool you use. Hold the coupler with your other hand, from outside the bag. This should contain the spring from launching across the room when being installed. Haven’t tried it yet, but it seems like a good idea. Maybe use a rubber band around your wrist to close the open end.
I guess I need to point out a few things as this thread seems to have lost it’s direction, however, we do appreciate the good comments about Kadee couplers and such.
It seems the original problem was simply that the knuckle springs came off some of the couplers in the package, which is “not a factory defect or flaw”, it’s a result of rough handling of the package. Replacing the knuckle springs is really a part of using knuckle couplers, users need to learn how to replace the springs. The #5 and #148 couplers have the same head and there’s no top spring guard as on our other couplers so these couplers are the ones that have the springs knocked off easier during handling and shipping. The following link to our web site is our returns policy and guarantee info. https://www.kadee.com/shippinginfo.htm
Sam Clarke R&D Kadee Quality Products
Refitting coupler springs is just routine. Rarely do you need to do this twice for the same coupler. Maybe if you really hammer cars together (by mistake obviously) you might lose a spring but generally only the copies do this, especially the all plastic couplers.
I like the fact that you always seem to get extra coupler springs in genuine Kadee packages, very good customer relations touch imho.
I also like the way Kadee keeps innovating and improving existing product. The whisker coupler and the snap together gearboxes being two notable examples.
You basically can’t go wrong fitting Kadee couplers. Why buy them off eBay? They are already pretty inexpensive from Kadee or your LHD, considering what you get.
Since they don’t break and don’t wear out I always check out the used stuff to make sure it has Kadees already installed. If it also has Kadee trucks I buy it even if I don’t need or want the particular car, just to get the Kadee stuff.
I also tend to buy the bulk pack of No. 5 Kadees, there are always a couple (no pun intended) that the coupler coiled spring has popped out of - no doubt jostled loose in shipping from Kadee to the hobby shop. All Kadees use springs so it’s an issue with all of them.
As Mike points out, there are usually also a couple extra springs in the package.You can put them back in but it’s not easy. I remember someone suggested touching one end into something like tacky glue and putting that end in place first and letting it set so one end is kinda locked in place before trying to bend the spring to connect up the other end.
I don’t know who that somone was but I will support their message there.
Putting just a touch of glue on the long side of the spring before installation will help to keep the spring in place afterward. However, you still have to learn how to install the spring “before” you try using glue. Then you need to use “extreme caution” dipping into glue as too much might get into unwanted locations.
Eye sight, dexterity, patience, and a bit of bravado all are helpful if not required. I’ve had people ask me what’s the best way to get the knuckle springs back on the couplers my first answer is to “get somebody else to do it for you”…
Imagine our assemble girls sitting most of the day installing knuckle springs, some of them are very fast at it.
Sam Clarke R&D Kadee Quality Products
I should think it wouldn’t matter what vendor or store you bought them from, if they are genuine Kadee’s, they should stand behind them.
MetroLink Fan) As youve read, most would agree you cant beat Kadee for couplers. Quite simply - they are the best. I must admit, ive heard of a few folks losing a knuckle spring, but not as many as you said.
A few things about Kadees to help:
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Kadee produces a PDF called “Kadee Conversions”. Get this. It will help you determine which Kadee is right for your models. (They also make “Kadee Coupler Primer” which is an intro to Kadee couplers - wouldnt hurt)
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Kadee sells the knuckle springs seperately (among other parts). You can replace your lost springs without the extra expense of having to buy all new couplers. (and it does take patience to replace them if new to it. Experienced users can respring a coupler in seconds. Its that easy really).
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Kadees are pretty stout. They can take a serious beating before something happens. But losing as many springs as you have lends creedence to the thought you either dont have Kadees to begin with, or if you do, they are bad in some form.
Kadee is a manufacturer like any other. They make something for a price. And like everyone else they are NOT immune to bad manufacturing runs of product. Kadee WILL honor its product IF you bought it from them, or a licensed dealer. Since you bought it online you will have to take this up with your seller. If bought on the “bay” you are covered by the ‘bays’ refund program.
- I have had new in the pack couplers unopened that did have the knuckle spring missing. Either through jostling during shipping or maybe one of the Kadee “assembly girls” was having a bad day. This is why Kadee puts two extra springs in the pack.
Take a look at your faulty ones, find the reason. But do stick with Kadee. They really are the best out there!
Good Luck!
PMR
IIRC when Kadee’s patent expired, Couplers came out of the wood work. Yes, I left the Kadee camp for awhile just to test the waters you could say. It was not long after lost money and a Gondola with a “scrap load” half filled with Non Kadee plastic “feather or coil spring” head look-a-likes, that I ran back to Kadee Couplers. And never looked back, well…except maybe just a glance at those Sergent couplers.
Metrolink fan. I see a bit of confusion here that can be cleared up by asking two questions. I see nobody asked so I will. Are the couplers you have metal? Do you remember where they shipped from?
I do occassionally do have springs go rouge. either from a derailment, or in the case of locos just the frequency of use they break or bend. Or dam aliens steal them. (only explination for having it there when the car got to the location and gone when it was time to move it again)
If your having a lot of derailments, that will be a good cause of loss. The general concensus is you have knockoffs.
Shane