I hang with a bunch of narrow gaugers and for awhile considered building a dual gauge layout. I eventually decided against it even though I still like the idea. I do have some dual gauge track and some narrow gauge spots as well.
I built one of the dual gauge idler cars:
A dual gauge split off:
I modified this ME turnout to have a dual gauge through track by adding rails and an extra frog.
Here is a shot of the current dual/ standard gauge trackage in the yard. The Chama oil dock loads narrow gauge on one side and standard on the other
I love the rustic feel of narrow gauge and have incorporated water tanks and other NG structures on my standard gauge layout… For now I consider my self a narrow (gauge) minded standard gauge modeler.
That track you modified is exactly what I would like to have, I do not know if it has a formal name, but I call it a Narrow Gauge Exit track.
I would employ them where the lines would interchange & become dual gauge.
The neat thing about those is that they are not a mechanical turnout, which is great!
I really like your work with…whatever it’s called. Chad, I call it a divergence, but I’m almost certain that’s not correct. And it’s not a draw, which takes you from side to side but WITHIN the SG rails. Anyone know? I can ask my NG buddies, but why not find out if there are more here who can contribute?[:)]
Guy’s trackwork is a very handy thing to have. I designed mine so that I when I needed something like that, I’d hack a dual gauge Shinohara…but that ain’t cheap any more – and wasn’t particularly cheap then, either. Guy’s solution is far more elegant. In fact, I may get all inspired and do something like the one with the points.
Now, the one Chad is asking about is no moving parts and always a thing of beauty.[{][}]
But they work great. Guy, was it very touchy to set up or pretty much watch your Ps and Qs and it works?
BTW, you are very much a narrowgauger in my book with work like that. I can’t say I fault your approach of doing a very NGish approach, but in SG. I just decided to bite the bullet back in the mid-80s, although I’ll admit I have my share of SG[:P]
Mike,
My Apologies, I was so excited about seeing that track…
I also wanted to comment on your awesome photo’s, they are excellent & I really enjoy the perspective on the difference sizes of the motive power.
Nicely doe!!
Thanks again for sharing your excellent modelling efforts & knowledge!
It’s great to se positive contibutions & sharing like this!
I gotta agree with Chad about the cool track work and the effort that you put in on this thread.
I wanted to mention a couple of things:
Over the past ten years, I have spent many hours bottom feeding on Ebay for switches. I especially like BK enterprises and Railway Engineering which are essentially Fastracks without the ties. I have bought lots of these. BK made/make?? Switch points with frogs. I used one of these on the modified ME turnout. I still have a bunch of these. Saves having to cut up stuff (Mike you really cut up Shinohara dual gauge turnouts??? That’s either dedication or crazy)
Here is a shot of a BK turnout and the BK points/frogs.
Here is a shot of my turnout box. There used to be a lot more stuff in it but there is still a lot left over………you never know.
Here is a close up of the double frog on the ME turnout.
Believe it or not I once thought about doing a thread on building the diverging track or whatever we are calling it (I’ll ask my NG buddies tomorrow). I started to shoot pics but the process of documenting things ground the whole procedure to a halt. I went ahead and
That is AWESOME!!!
I do have one or two BK parts, but not enought to do that, Yes, I gotta get off the the porcelian -to speak!!!
Those are excellent!!!
Thanks again for sharing & contributing!
You have revitalized my interest where I was stuck…
One Question, how did you determine & build the best ½Frog for the edge rail that takes the initial divergence?
That was my hangup, I can guage it out, but could not get the design down just right.
Thanks agian!
Brilliant! I never even thought of using BK parts. It’s not quite RTR but makes more involved dual gauge trackwork arrangements more of a “kit” type project. That’s close enough for me[:D] [bow]
This thread is gonna be a classic before it’s all over. I’m sure we’ve just scratched the surface of interesting hacks.
Yeah, it is kinda crazy to hack Shinoharas, but consider the price of custom work. I was barely aware of it when I started the current layout in the early 90s and bought most of the track then. My first NNGC wasn’t until 96 in Durango. I’m actually acquainted with Cliff Mestel, who runs BK from, meeting him there, although we’ve been on email lists together since. Good guy and his products are affordable and could definitely make neat little hacks like Guy has done a breeze. Here’s a link, with some further info useful for this thread.
There are a couple of different ways I use to build frogs. For me the most important thing is to draw out the angles first to get the diverging angle correct. If you get stuck here, simply lay a turnout with the proper frog number over the area and trace it. You can also print out templates from the Fast tracks website and use those to get angles and general turnout geometry.
Making the frog:
Method one is to essentially bend the rail in half to make the point. Material must be removed from the rail on the inside of the bent area to make this possible. Mark the rail in the middle. That will be the frog point. Then grind down the other side of the rail web and rail until it is thin. Bend the rail so that the thin area is on the inside of the point. You can adjust the angle pretty easily that way.
Method two is to make each rail that makes the frog point separately. I figure the length of each of the rails and then grind off the inside of the rails until they fit together at the angle I want, I then solder then together to form the point.
You may have a couple of do-overs while you get used to the process, but in general it is easier than it sounds. I am by no means an expert at hand-laying. Most of my handbuilt stuff works better than it should, given my skill level. Most of my turnouts are commercial products…If I can do it, anyone can.
Here you can see the flex track mockup of the area.
This shot you can see the lines drawn in for the rails and ties.
Absolutely right and one of the big reasons I started this thread. If people are thinking about doing some dual gauge track or just work the narrowgauge in around the standard gauge, there are ways to do it within the skill set of most of us.
Re: “swoose” – I’ve heard of swoosh or swish being used to refer to a draw, but this sort of thing is peculiar and localized enough that it could refer to different arrangements in different places. I’ll ping my people and see what they say.
Freight traffic was getting heavy in Durango for my poor little 44-tonner. More and more, it was being asked to move cuts of standard gauge cars, when it’s really up to just one or two at a time. So it was time to search the motive power desk, actually a motive power chest of drawers, for candidate into conversion into a heavier dual-coupler equipped unit.
It just so happens my old Walthers F-M H10-44 works. It has some easy off features. Pluck them off gently: the front step on one side, the SAME side on each end. The end railings pop off.
This install uses a Kadee 714 in the SG location and a M-T 1015 in the NH position. Putting the coupler in the orginal position won’t work. The mount hole is too far back. But we have to keep in mind the coupler retains the body on these cars.
Moving further in wasn’t good, but moving it out to take advantage of the cast-in buffer plate seemed feasible. I double checked with coupler length. Then I filed the buffer down flat.
There was plenty of room behind the pilot beam to install couplers, but I pushed them out by building a larger buffer by fabbing it from plastic.
I thought I’d throw in some action shots, err…well, actually it looks like the crew of 123 is stuck in the hole until the eastbound wayfreight and a westbound passenger roll by.
Mike, superb dual gauge work and coupler tutorial. When I leaped in, feet first, to narrow gauge, HOn3 in 2009 after 40 years in HO standard gauge, I had dreams of a dual gauge system so I could run some of my HO as well. I ordered several bundles to dual gauge micro engineering track to go with my 7 or 8 new Blackstone N.G. locos in 2010.
I had a dual gauge fantasy plan of my Virginia home based N.G. Atlantic and Danville linking to the Southern, N&W etc. but my little D&RGW engines, I felt, needed a Colorado nesting place.
Fortunately, I stopped dead and spent a ton of money on N.G. books (history, MR related, etc.)I read for about 8 months and realized I went to N.G. because it was the backwoods lore of the little road that intrigued me coupled with its WWII Uranium ore transport effort solely within the N.G. system. Having a dual gauge terminus seemed too busy and crowded, too cosmo. I wanted a “grass and weeds growing through the tracks” type system.
The one thing that I liked about dual gauge was the interesting track work and the use of those sweet little idler cars as opposed to dual gauge coupler systems which were certainly around on a few locos. As late retirement looms in April 2014, I hope to have much more time to finalize things on the Paradox, Uravan and Placerville.
I still have all that cool unused dual gauge track…Who knows…A small, separate Dual gauge Switching layout??..Heaven forbid…a little Plymouth switcher, too!
Thanks for your comments, it’s always satisfying to hear people appreaciate what you’re doing.
I always liked the complex look of dual gauge, so wanted some on my layout when I designed it. I originally wanted to include Alamosa, but the physical reality set in that my basement wasn’t that big. So I just “preserved” the dual gauge track that was taken up in Durango back in the 20s and hooked it into the main Rio Grande system with a SG branch.
It was also the pre-Blackstone era of HOn3, so I figured I could watch the SG go in circles while trying to get the NG going. In fact, I have both running great, knock on wood.[:o)]
A dual gauge switching layout would be cool. There’s all kinds of little tricks to design, but so long as you take you time, they’re nott too hard to figure out.
