Okay, I’m back. I didn’t have a problem with the staging being on the upper level. I like it being accessible. You could have hidden it with a backdrop. The older I get, the harder it is to bend down and get into tight places.
I see what HI says about the tight turns. I can get away with it with small steam and 36’ cars, but anything bigger than a geep… Are you planning any panneger service?
Thanks for the observation and good input. I compromised. Extended to 40". The arrival track can hold a train 80" long. Currently, I’m expecting to consist about 10-12 cars maximum (depending on type), ~ 60" plus loco. See #2 in plan. I have some work to do on my sidings.
Again, good input. I did not like that S curve anyway. I was planning to switch Elgin with a local out of Taylor. See southeast of #5 in plan.
Latest incarnation of upper level. I now have to also work on that area at #1. Also, I fixed all the radius to 24+ inches. I had one or two that were a little shy.
http://home.austin.rr.com/tomsandy/Garage_k_shinorar_upper.pdf
Lower level. This is working out better than I had hoped. Thanks HighIron2003ar for the input. [8D]. I was able to split the two staging yards and gained an extra 10" or so by moving one along the straight, plus, it’s easier to get to from the side.
http://home.austin.rr.com/tomsandy/Garage_k_shinorar_lower.pdf
Again, let me thank everyone for the excellent inputs I
Okay, good progress is being made.
Let’s start with Taylor. You’ve increased significantly the capacity. If you use the two upper tracks as AD, the part below the main can all be used for building trains. This is really good news.
The bad news is that the AD are isolated from the yard lead. Can you get the main to be the top track and attach the lead to where they can service the ADs.
And with the increased capacity it is now vital that you yard lead be as long as the longest yard track. You have the space.
IF you don’t do it you will kick yourself the first time you have a couple guys over to operate and they are sitting fouling the main waiting while you classify half a train so that you can get back to clear the AD. This is more likely to happen if every train requires extra moves to break down.
Elgin is still a bit of a mess. My suggestion just for playing around’s sake. I don’t know how closely you are following the prototype here or what your ultimate goals are.
If you look Elgin and disconnect the main from both ends you see three parallel tracks. My suggestion would be to make the center one the main. From the top of the drawing, that would mean extending the main about 3" to connect with the now nonexistent extension of the middle track of the 3 parallel tracks.
Form the bottom of the drawing the main would extend straight to attach to the middle track in the center.
Leave the right parallel track attached to the main and you have two runarounds so that you can switch on either side of the main and clear the main for through freights and passengers when needed.
Changes (revision k) - http://home.austin.rr.com/tomsandy/Garage_k_shinorar_upper.pdf
Tom,
I think your solution to the Taylor Yard will work. It’s hard to see the interchange off the lead, but it seems doable.
I’m going to assume that you are going to be operating and that you trains will be running both directions. If that is the case, you still have a couple problems. Imagine you have 3 guys running. One guy has a passenger train running counter clockwise. He is going to be stopping at every town and he has right of way. You have a through freight running clockwise and you are running a way freight clockwise and switching as you go.
You need passing sidings to let trains pass each other. Ideally, you will have you passenger stations in the vicinity of a passing siding (either on the main or on the siding) so that traffic can continue while passengers are being boarded. Likewise, you may want sidings at your major switching areas. These are not requirements, just if you don’t, operations will be more interesting.
Also assuming that your way frieghts will switch in both directions, you need runarounds to handle both Elgin and Lycra. Putting a passing siding between Elgin and Lycra could kill three birds with one stone. This would also eliminate the need for a runaround on the right side Elgin. You might as well save the $$ for the turnouts.
At this point, I would start a new thread and call it Draft 2 or something. Obviously, people have thought they have given their input and this has become a dialog between you and me. Keep up the good work. IT keeps getting better and better. You are moving towards a layout that will be fun for you by yourself, and I can forsee 4 guys (or kids) operating as a team and having a great time.
Look at the Taylor yard.
See the double crossover on the right center area near the number 2 and above the words “South-North”
It is my opinion that removing one leg that is already duplicated by the ladder on the left near the number three will help alot.
so if a train passes number 4 and enters the yard near number three it can continue over to the “east” main without making so many S curves.
If a train on the rear track entered from behind number 2 it can climb it’s own ladder without the vicious twisting presented by the double crossover if it wanted to proceed to the “South”
as a final argument for devil advocate’s sake… that double crossover takes away valuable siding space.
If you insist on having a double crossover somewhere Then put it one track down to the “East” towards the bottom of this paper and put it in the exact middle of what appears to be a long passing siding between both yards.
I hope this helps. I tried to be very precise with words because my artisitic imagary is quite bad.
The rest of it I love it!!!
The first thing that grabs my attention is how close the tracks are to the edge of the layout / bench work. this has potential for the pride and joy testing your ability to replicate feats of superman (Faster than a FALLING Locomotive) in the event of the unpredicted derailment… Of particular concern are the points at either end of Smithville
Are you going to need all the tracks in the off layout staging area? How much clearence will you have between the bottom of the bench work of the upper level and the top of your rolling stock on the lower level? Will you be able to recover any derailed units easily or are you going to have to move a lot of other trains to get to the offending unit?
Where were you linking your down grade on to the upper level? To achieve a more Point to Point feel two smaller staging yards could be used, running from the outer(wall side) track. If the down grade started from arroung the current double crossover near “2” and near “5” behind Elgin. This could incerase the depth for Scenary or an extra track at Taylors Yard. the length of grade will provide a good clearence in staging yards located underneath the main layout but be aware of how much bending is required to check and access those trains in yards.
I hadn’t seen the updated draft with the relocated double crossover. My previous post was IRT the original plan. I like the potential for the double crossover in this location but moving the main line swich to the north a bit, add a right hand swich to the loop, a crossing (on the swich lead) and double slip onto the inner (edge) track at Taylor Yard
With the revised plan how are you going to disguise the access to your staging yard?
Will there be a viewblock between Smithville and LCRA Yard or are they in close proximity in reality?
Could a passing loop be included at Elgin? The requirement for this would depend on how many operators you plan to run in a session.
The duplication of the passing loop at Smithville seems to be an overkill but if you are running LONG trains this is the only place that two could pass.
Thanks for the inputs Peter. It’s the weekend [:D], so I get to spend time workin on the railroad as it were.
On your specific questions.
I was thinkng about making the peninsula at #6 and #7 a model of the town. Lot’s of interesting buildings. Got these off the internet. If you note from the map, the trackage in Smithville is in the town. I have some other better pics of the LCRA yard from a weekend or two ago. Also got to speak with a railfan living there. They said a train goes through this area every 30 minutes or so during the week.
Thanks. I’ll need to think about this. Maybe some of the confusion is because the “main line” is not visually evident. I’ve noted on several CAD layouts posted through out that the mainline is highlighted or darker. I’m not figured out how to do this. Put it in a different layer ?
On the real railroad there is no way a train would ever run from Taylor yard to Smithville. Waco to Smithville, yes. Eureka (Houston) to Smithville, yes. Taylor to Smithville, no.There was no physical connection to permit going from Taylor yard to Smithville (without a bunch of backing out and sawing around).
Taylor yard and Smithville yards never interacted. It was like they were on two different railroads, primarily because they WERE on two different railroads.
If you want to do the MP, go Taylor to San Antonio.
If you want to do the MKT, go Smithville to Eureka or to Waco. Smithville was where the MKT line from San Antonio met the line from KC to Houston.
Dave H.
The map answers the questions re Smithville LCRA Yard. The photos of buildings around Smithville look good and will ad a sence of place for those who have been there.
Keep Chugging along
Peter
Dave, I’m confused by the following links. From these I thought the MKT had at least trackage rights from from N Texas, through Taylor and on through several smaller towns (track almost parallels State Hwy 95) on to Smithville and then on to the Gulf. I thought I saw that the Missouri Pacific came from the east into Taylor, on to Austin and then to San Antonio. Maybe my timing (year of model) is off?
http://www.katyrailroad.org/map.htm
http://www.trainweb.org/mesquitebelt/smithville.html
Regards,
Draw a cross.
On the top of the cross label Ft Worth/Waco.
On the bottom of the cross label Smithville/Houston.
On the left label San Antonio.
On the right label Valley Jct.
The vertical line is the MKT. The North-South route through Taylor is the mainline of the MKT railroad.
The horizontal line is the MP. The East-West route through Taylor is the mainline from Valley Jct (Ft Worth, Texarkana, Houston) to San Antonio/Laredo.
The point where the lines cross is Taylor. The yard is on the leg to the left of the diamond, on the south side of the MP main. In the northwest quardrant there is a connection track to allow a MP train from Ft Worth to exit the MKT and enter the MP towards San Antonio and vice versa.
The MP had trackage rights across the MKT from Taylor to Waco (or they could operate on the longer route over to Valley Jct and turn North to Waco).
Only MP trains operate on the east-west route. Only MKT trains operate south of the diamond. Both MKT and MP train operate north of the diamond.
In 1980 the MKT ran 2 regular 2nd class freights in each direction through Smithville, No 103, 105 south and No 104, 106 north. They also had a 183/184 schedule that ran to Taylor which actually was a MP train, but they had a schedule to cover it.
Dave H.
Again, Dave, Thanks [:)]
I think I know where I got confused. On my plan I had Taylor with the right side representing North and the left side listed as South. In that case only MKT would traverse the route I have. Actually, as you’ve pointed out, trains came into Taylor from all directions. I Google Earth’d all of this path. It works out exactly as you’ve stated. What I had in mind was for the lower level staging to represent all points outside of both Taylor and Smithville. Therefore I should be able to have MKT traveling both from the South and from the North through Taylor. I will only have MP coming in from lower level staging into Taylor via the North (I’ve now corrected to indicate this is both North and East) and terminating.
I was able to trace out the route (you can see the railroad) on Google Earth from Taylor to Smithville on east a ways to a junction just east of Smithville and then south to Flatonia which is just slightly west of Valley Jct. From there it follows west to San Antonio - just like you’ve indicated.
I also got a really good snapshot (don’t know when the satellite captured this) of the entry to Taylor yard (east) showing a train coming/leaving [?] from the South,
Again, thanks for taking the time to provide so much valuable info. I really would love to know where you know even the train numbers that traveled this route.
Regards,
I reside in Georgetown, TX and I am looking for help with my layout. My email address is jlclark124@cox.net. Would love to make contact with anyone in or around Georgetown. John[:)]
Would like to see your layout but can’t open your webpage i have a similar space available and I am just starting to layout some ideas.
Alex. (ozzieladd)
The wye leg in the SW quadrant was a 1990’s addition post MKT and probably post SP merger. In the 1980’s it wasn’t there.
Dave H.
That explains everything!
Thanks
Could it be the file format? The file on the web is a PDF. You’ll need Adobe Acrobat reader. Free at www.adobe.com