The schedule is bloated. If Number 21 leaves San Marcos on time, more often than not, it will go into San Antonio 1 to 1.5 hours early, which creates a problem for the passengers and anyone who may be meeting them.
Do those meeting a passenger show up early on the notion that the train will be early and possibly wait for an hour or more, or do the passengers arrive early and have to wait an hour or more for their ride?
One only has to hang around the San Antonio Amtrak station at night one time to realize that it is not a fun place. I have taken the Eagle to San Antonio several times for meetings the next day before flying back to west Texas.
The schedule appears to have been put together by an Amtrak bureaucrat who sits in a windowless cubicle, eats peanut butter and banana sandwiches for lunch, and has never ridden the Texas Eagle or been to San Antonio.
That was my point in writing this thread. At some point time matters in selecting the train, just as it does the bus. Competitively the Texas Eagle is roughly only 2-4 hours faster than Greyhound if you compare schedules between Dallas and Chicago. If most of the padding was removed and Amtrak got a decent agreement with UP RR on run times, Amtrak would be more competitive as a travel option among a portfolio of travel options including the car and the bus.
Car trip to Wisconsin 16-17 hours from my Driveway, Texas Eagle from Dallas 22 hours. So if I am deciding between the car and train. Amtrak loses big time with the schedule padding. The truth is that Amtrak on this route just train moving time is probably closer to 17 hours than 22 hours and probably even less than 17 hours…rough guess. I would bet the Texas Eagle beats the auto travel time from Dallas to Chicago.
And I have to disagree that on LD trains end point to end point travel times do not matter. Typically “how long does a train take?” is the first question that pops into someones head and if the car is comparable or roughly comparable it will be the chosen mode in a lot of cases.
But, if you are going alone, aren’t you comparing 16-17 hours of intensity behind the wheel (at least until true self-driving cars become a reality!), to 22 hours wherin you can read, sleep, whatever. And you don’t say whether the 16-17 hours include meal stops. And few people I know would drive straight through for that long, without a sleep stop.
By my reckoning, padding or no, Amtrak wouldn’t lose on scheduling.
On the other hand, I agree that travel times do matter, at any length of time or distance.
Google Maps says the driving distance from Dallas to Chicago is 927 to 967 miles. The quickest driving time is 13 hours and 51 minutes. Does not include stops for gas, meals, and relief.
The typical cost to drive, using AAA’s fully allocated cost of 59.2 cents per mile for a mid-size sedan, would be $548.78 to $572.46. If only fuel is considered, which is what many people probably do, and assuming an average consumption rate of 28 miles to the gallon, with an average price of $2.18 per gallon, the out-of-pocket cost would be roughly $72.17 to $75.29. Does not include meals and tolls.
Greyhound has five daily services from Dallas to Chicago. Travel time averages 21 to 22 hours. The costs range from $44 to $69. Does not include meals, cost of getting to and from the bus stations, parking, etc.
Megabus has four daily offerings from Dallas to Chicago. Travel time averages 21 to 22 hours. The costs range from $30 to $55. Does not include meals, cost of getting to and from the bus stops, parking, etc.
The distance on Amtrak is 991 miles. Travel time is 22 hours and 12 minutes. The lowest coach fare is $102. Does not include meals. The lowest first class fare is $372. Includes meals. Does not include cost of getting to and from the railroad stations, parking, etc.
Typical flying time from Dallas to Chicago is 2 hours and 5 minutes. The lowest fare on Southwest Airlines, which has six morning flights from Dallas to Chicago, ranges from $55 to $110. Does no
Even if your business in Chicago is downtown, flying would save a lot of time. If it is in Chicago sububs, it would save more time. Factoring cost and being able to get a better sleep at home, it seems like a no-brainer for any business person, other than the rare railfan with time to waste. Or someone with aviophobia.
The airfare quoted above for a business traveler would be unrealistic. For one, departing from Dallas Love Field isolates you a lot from the airport network in this country and arriving at Midway in Chicago isolates you more as business traveler. Unless you own your own business your not ever going to get that travel segment by a large company unless all they do is fly Dallas to Chicago.
So the $55-$110 ticket is highly unrealistic for business travel and largely out of reach, lowest your going to get Dallas to Chicago is $400 RT advance purchase and higher for under two weeks purchase…and routing will be DFW to O’Hare. Southwest has to offer the lower fares because Dallas Love Field is pretty isolated from the airport network in this country and once at Love Field you don’t have a lot of choices for getting out of there like you do at DFW.
Also, I disagree on aviophobia. I would switch to LD trains if it is more convienient because i get sick of flying period (even when it is First Class). Some of the LD train segments are more convinent that flying. The Buffalo departure on Amtrak for Chicago is an example late evening boarding time and I wake up, time for breakfest and I get off the train in Chicago at a fairly decent time in the morning still. You can sleep on a sleeper on a train a lot better than in an airport or on a plane. So I subtract sleep time when making the train to plane comparison and include total travel time to terminals , wait time to board, etc. I could never make Buffalo to Chicago
All the Dallas to Chicago fares are one way. They are for travel on October 5th, and they are the lowest Internet fares.
According to Travelocity, American and United are quoting DFW to ORD fares ranging from $54.10 to $101.10 for October 5th.
Planning ahead usually results in a better fare than the walk-up fare. Not every business person can plan several weeks in advance, but many can and do. Each situation is different.
People who work for organizations with pay for performance systems, where the cost of travel is charged back to their department, have an incentive to keep costs low. One way to do that is through better planning, especially for discretionary travel.
Rather than give up Hope, I would add a regular scheduled van service to and from Tyler, which is a much larger community without rail service. I think such a service would double the riddership at Hope.
A similar situation exists with the Cardinal at Prince for Frostberg.
The closest Amtrak station to Tyler, TX is Mineola, TX, which is 25.7 miles away. Longview is 37.8 miles from Tyler; it is more than 150 miles to Hope.
So there is no hope for Hope for Tyler people who want to catch the Eagle, unless they are hopelessly enamored of the idea of catching a train from Hope, which must be a last hope.
Heck, if I were a business traveler from DFW to ORD this Tuesday, I could be put on a flight at 6:10 am → 8:35 am; go to the scheduled meetings and fly back 8:50 pm → 11:13 pm, all for $123 RT inc. taxes, etc. on coach. Sounds a lot better than 22 hours on a train, leaving Monday afternoon, getting to Chicago at 1:52 pm Tuesday. Maybe you could manage some business still on Tuesday, but likely you’d have to overnight in a hotel, conclude business Tuesday morning, catch the train at 1:45 pm, returning to Dallas on Wednesday at 11:30 in the morning. Three days vs. one; a lot more expense and two nights on a train. Even in a bedroom, my bed at home is far more comfortable. I doubt if many businesses would approve of such a transport for their employees and very few would ever choose it.
I’m ready to believe in the possibility that the numbers of these people have increased enough, since 50 years ago, to support some LD train services today. Business travel by rail will never happen again until restoration of overnight (preferably sleeper) service between major markets. And re-education of that market, travelers as well as the authorizing bosses.
I think before that happens most business travel, period, will be sidelined by modern communications. Then the airlines will be in the hurt bag, with an opportunity for Amtrak to go after more of the Mom-and-Pop market.
We’ll see. I also continue to think that, if we let Amtrak LD go, we’ll have to (expensively) re-invent it down the track. The freight railroads won’t help us do it for nothing.
As I said, those who have aviophobia. But rather than not travel or expect the government to provide for your trip, why not seek competent therapy with a clinical psychologist trained in treating specific phobias? Success is possible with evidence-based therapies, usually in six sessions.
There are people who cannot fly because of medical reasons, but can endure long train trips. Older people may have to use the facilities often, say once every hour. Disaster can occur when the seat-belt sign is lit and the need arises. There are other problems.
Further correction, I believe the Texas Eagle ran non-stop through Mineola, and the station I actually did use for Tyler was Troop, TX. Does that check out? Is it an Amtrak stop today?
Dave, Troup is on the former IGN, not the former T&P. I don’t think that the Texas Eagle ever went though there. I do not have all of my old Amtrak timetables here, but Longview is now the stop for Tyler, and Mineola is a stop.
OK well first, I wasn’t talking about the Texas Eagle as viable for business travel. I specifically mentioned Buffalo to Chicago then stated even that was not viable due to the lack of frequency of connections.
Back to the Business Traveler though…
The problem is you presume you set the meeting times and can control what is available to your company via your travel agency which you are forced to book though. Stand by what I said earlier, very few large businesses are going to get a fare that low, it’s unrealistic and if it exists, it is a one time anomoly for the dates given. Average fare for DFW to ORD for business travel is $400 min RT, maybe $300 if your really lucky Additionally most clients will want you onsite for more than a single day if they are paying for airfare…even sales folks, min 3 days typically. Also the decision for you to be onsite for an initial meeting rarely happens with 2 weeks advance notice, usually 1 week is all you get. With recurring visits you might be able to snag the 2 week advance purchase.
I would use the airline websites for fare quotes, travelocity is frequently inaccurate and is secondarily updated compared with airline systems with current seat inventory which leads to problems as well sometimes.
Use of one way tickets are restricted under most Frequent Flyer rules. You’ll find. If that was not the case you would find Business travelers using them to reverse the travel direction on seasonal routes that apply yield management for the cheaper fare…so they have restrictions on the use of one way fares on most FF program rules (and the airlines have gotcha programs monitoring one way ticket usage) and most businessmen are not going to risk cancellation of FF membership to save money on airfare when the client is reimbursing in most cases. So you need to be real cautious with one way tickets and usage of them. If an airlin
Cheaper fares are easy to obtain, even with only a few days advance warning. I was not referring to a consultant or outside contractor. I was referring to folks going to meetings at their regional or headquarters or the guy going to a trade show, where planning is done far in advance. Spending days on LD trains rather than a few hours on a plane is a non-starter. That’s why very few business people have used trains outside the NEC and one or two other corridors in the past 50 years.