I just purchased a steam locomotive, a Bachmann Spectrum. It’s DCC equiped already. I’m brand new to this hobby, and I’ve heard that steam engines have a pickup in the front right and back left of the tender. Will this cause problems crossing a plastic frog?
I may have been reading old info. I’m hoping newer steam engines have pickups in the tender AND in the engine, on both sides.
Thanks.
Brian
Most of the newer plastic or ABS-cast-metal combo steam locos appear to have pickups on all driving wheels and at least part of the tender wheels.
In the ‘olden days’, with cast and brass locos, they mostly picked up power on the engineer’s side of the drivers, and the fireman’s side of the tender. The wheels on the opposite sides were insulated. Newer brass adheres to this technique.
Your Spectrum most likely picks up from all the engine drivers and at least four of the tender wheels. Advances in electronics have allowed all of the engine drivers to be ‘live’. I shouldn’t think you’d have any problems with plastic frogs unless your engine is a VERY short wheel-base and you’re running very slow.
Tom
I have a Spectrum 4-4-0 with DCC and the pickup is six wheels on the engineers side and six on the firemans side from the factory. It runs very nice and is better with sound. I just remembered the loco does not have traction tires.
Rich
There can be NEVER ENOUGH pickups for steam wheels.
I found that my Roundhouse 4-4-0 with the DCC and Sound is inadequate over some switches with plastic frogs. That engine is being replaced with a BLI Light Mike until Spectrum or someone else produces a 4-6-0 or similar with MORE pickups AND traction tires; DCC/Sound equippted too.
Some engines have a pick up on every axle while others rely on the tender and some drivers.
Long ago I think it was the AHM 4-4-0’s that had the motor inside the tender only driving via a shaft to the cab.
Wow. Thanks for all the replies. I guess I’ll just have to wait and see for sure on my Bachmann DCC. I got it from a website with a clearance sale, so I only paid $89.00 for it. It won’t have sound, but that’s OK for now. I purchased a diesel that will have sound. I just know my boy is fascinated with steam engines, and their mechanics, so I had to get one.
Is it normal to add pickups? Can that even be done?
Thanks again.
Brian
I was wrong on the Spectrum 4-4-0. One tender truck picks up on one rail, the other truck picks up on the opposite rail. All four drivers pickup on their respective rail. So that is a total of four wheels picking up for each rail. I will modify my Spectrum so each truck picks up from its rail which will give me a total of six wheels. I have done this with a IHC old time 4-4-0 and a Bachmann old time 4-4-0. I will add a keep alive capacitor in the Spectrum.
My Roundhouse 4-4-0 tender picks up from all the wheels. I love the design. I only wish I could get some from Roundhouse. The engine, only two drivers as the other two have rubber tires. Someone from another group and I are installing a keep alive capacitor to prevent stalling. His is doing fine. I am waiting for the capacitor to arrive in the mail.
I will also close couple the Roundhouse. It looks better. I found an article on how to do this.
rich
Are you having any problems the way it is configured now? Do you need the added PU for future sound? Or do you just want some added insurance in case of dirty wheels/ track?
My Spectrum has sound in it but I want the insurance anyway. Stuff happens.
rich
Safety Valve–
Your Roundhouse 4-4-0 may still be picking up only from one side of the loco and one side of the tender. If so, you might consider investing in a package of Tomar Industries pickup sliders. They screw into the frame between the driving wheels on the uninsulated driver side, and between the wheels of the uninsulated tender trucks. I’ve installed them on just about all of my brass and cast locos, and the difference in running quality is amazing! The package comes with enough sliders to do two locos, and very clear instructions on how to install them. You might want to check into them–they really WORK!
I have a feeling that your plastic frog problem will be a thing of the past.
Tom
Check your track for continuity,especially older Atlas. My Roundhouse 4-4-0, which has pickup on all the tender wheels, goes over all my crappy uncleaned track that has been checked for continuity. Atlas track tends to have electrical problems with age and not all the rails get electricity.
http://www.pacificcoastairlinerr.com/atlas_switch_wipers/
My Roundhouse 2-8-0 with the Tsunami and only pickup on all the tender wheels has no problems. Probably you have bad sections of track.
http://www.pacificcoastairlinerr.com/1905/roundhouse_sound/
Just a thought
Harold
Whoa, thanks for the responses.
The Loco was visiting a different railroad one evening when we encountered the plastic frog problem on the main. The trackwork is flawless as the layout is progressed to the ready for scenery stage.
I will check into the pickups problem on my own.
I am intriqued by the references to the “Keep alive” capacitor that apparently provides power in absence of track power for a short time.
Does anyone have a specific procedure, parts and instructions on how to install such a thing into any loco? I would assume that this item will connect to the two wires that feed from the track on each side of the locos.
What about duration of the Keep Alive? Does it regulate it’s own output? Will it blow up on over heat/charge or shoot the decoder by giving all it’s potential energy at once?
I was thinking about installing pick ups in the pilot and running the wire back as necessary. How big is this capacitor?
I think that if they did install Keep Alives as standard equiptment in HO Scale locos it will only improve the performance.
A DCC decoder must be designed to accept a keep-alive capacitor. It has to have the external connections - often pads - to solder the capacitor leads. The connections must be on the motor side of the diode bridge to avoid placing the capacitance directly across the rails.
A capacitor with enough charge to be useful is quite large physically, especially if it is to keep the motor turning. It would take some careful circuit design for a keep-alive not to wreak havoc with back emf and pulses for slow speed control. More often, the keep-alive capacitors are employed to keep the decoder and sound circuitry from resetting during power pickup dropouts.
As far as motor drive is concerned, a flywheel performs the same function mechanically as the keep-alive capacitor does electronically. Again, just like a large capacitor, a large flywheel can interfere with fine back emf control of the motor.
Got to love all those design trade-offs!
my thoughts, you choices
Fred W
Brian,
You don’t specify what scale you’re in. I’ve got 6 HO Spectrum steamers, and all pickup from all drive wheels, and one side of each tender truck.
If you look at the engine upside-down, you may be able to see small “wipers” just inside the drive wheels on the loco, and a metal wiper contacting the axle on each tender truck.
What an interesting thread this has turned into. Thanks for all the repsonses.
Pondini, I’m working in HO. I just received my 2-8-0 yesterday in the mail, and I just looked at it upside down. The tender gets a pickup from the front right, and back left trucks. All of the drive wheels have a pickup. But as I pushed each drive shaft back and forth, one of the pickups lost contact on either side. I guess I shouldn’t be worried with that many pickups. I did see the little “wiper” things you were referring to. They look so fragile.
My other hobby is woodworking, where things aren’t so fragile. With all the detail and plastic pipes running on this steam engine, I just feel like I’m on the verge of breaking it. But I’m not complaining…I love all the detail.
As a follow-up question…do I need to oil or lubricate this new engine in any way?
Thanks.
Brian
Brian,
Usually the wipers will make contact – the axles rarely will shift side-to-side very much (and the main drive axle, 3rd from the front I think, doesn’t move sideways at all).
Yes, the wipers look fragile, and if they get bent and/or catch on bad trackwork, they can get messed-up. But they’re actually fairly strong, and can be bent back into shape, with some practice. If you hear strange noises from the loco while it’s running, check the wipers. Before I figured this out (the hard way, of course), I’d managed to get one twisted like a pretzel and had to just cut it off! But it still runs fine.
As to lubrication, you should have gotten a small instruction sheet, perhaps with an exploded diagram. I think Bachmann does lubricate new engines at the factory, but I’m not sure anymore. Now that most models are made in China, some manufacturers (BLI for one) don’t lube them so the l
Here is a link the the keep alive capacitor information. I have installed a 1000ufd, 16 vdc cap in the boiler smoke box. It connects to the 7805 voltage regulator on the tender pc board, pins 1 & 2 which is the 12 vdc input and common from the full wave bridge rectifiers. I measured 12.7 vdc on my locomotive.
http://www.members.optusnet.com.au/mainnorth/alive.htm
The link looks a little weird. Do not know why.
rich