I remember seeing a post a while back about outdoor HO layouts, but I cant remember what was said about how well nickel silver track would hold up outdoors. If I try this, Im planning on using PVC fence rails(approx.2x6") layed on their side, elevated off the ground with additional PVC posts. Of course, I would bring in all rolling stock and electronics in between sessions. Also, I would cover the layout with plastic in between sessions. I figure painting the ties should give at least a little UV protection. What do you think?
Nickel silver rails do corrode, but that should not be much of an issue, as it does not hamper electrical conductivity. You need to clean the rails before each session, though. A bigger problem seems to be the ties, as they are not UV resistant and become brittle quite soon. Painting them is not much of a help. You need to be aware that outdoors layouts are subject to a lot of temperature variations, causing the rails to expand and shrink. G scale layouts can do away with quite some shrinkage, but HO layouts are a lot more sensitive to that.
HO scale, resp. OO scale layouts were (and still are) quite common in the UK, maybe you should check in one of their fori.
I be more worried about the heat.
On protecting the track from the sun you could try this. Get a good quality Automotive grade Clear Coat with UV sunscreen, it is going to run around $200.00 a gallon (you can get quarts) and spray the track. Then paint the track how you want them to look over the rails.
Cheap clear will not have sufficient UV sunscreen, that is why cheap repair jobs will peel after 3 years or so. (I was in Auto Body and Paint for 20 years)
Cuda Ken
This is the second summer for the patio layout and I can tell you N/S will corrode as does any metal with time. Gleeming or any sort of polishing will help slow the process down.
All I do is wipe the rails down before I operate and I’m good to go.
This question has come up several times over the years. Will give you the benefit of my experience. Have had an HO indoor layout since 1959 in various forms. Nickle silver is the standard and the only standard for HO indoors in my opinion.
I also have a garden railroad in the backyard, has been there since 1989. I use aluminum track made by a G gauge manufacturer that is treated and comes in 10ft flex sections, boy that is fun to lay. It is code 255 rail. Several years ago I laid some HO track in an area by the garden railroad just to see. The HO track lasted two years in Kansas City climate.
By the way, I use aluminum on the garden railroad because the railroad is radio controlled/battery power so the type of track was not important. I do know the manufacturer of my G scale rail also has it in Nickle Silver but the price is terrible.
Bob
Tell me about it!
We use nickel silver rail exclusively on our outdoor G scale layout. It is manufactured by Llagas Creek. The ties are UV protected plastic. If you’d like, visit our website (link in my signature) to see photos of our layout and track.
It has held up extremely well for many years now. It does require cleaning to get really good electrical conductivity, but it is not any more cleaning then you need with HO rail.
We run mostly battery powered trains, so we don’t have to clean the rail much at all. But we went with nickel silver so we could run either track or battery powered trains with a high grade rail.
I can’t comment on how HO scale rail would hold up outdoors. Our nickel silver rail is code 250 which is pretty thick when compared to HO scale.
The type of rail is not as important as the question of UV resistance of the crossties, which have no treatment at all for HO scale track.
Here in Arizona in the summertime the sun is so intense that HO scale rail would possibly get so hot that the crossties would melt, and I think they would be destroyed by sunlight in short order.
If you want to see for yourself, put a piece of HO scale flextrack outdoors for a couple of weeks and see what happens to it.
So the tie need to be UV protected. UV coating/paint and covering the layout when not in use should overcome this obstacle. Can anyone think of other obstacles? The fence rails are semi hollow, so I think I could run my feeders inside. Have some kind of connectors on the buss to plug in my DCC system, which I would bring outside ea. time I ran trains. I dont think I’ll have too much trouble with heave it I plant the posts below the frost line. Have I forgot anything? I like loong mainline runs, and with an acre and half of land, I think I could have some pretty long runs.
In three years, my NS has not corroded but I am in AZ. My railroad is on elevated bench work so even during the wet season (which is about 30 seconds in December) wet rail and corrosion has not been an issue… It does get dirty due to all the crap in the air, but hey, its the desert.
Providing shade is the key as our sun coupled with triple digit air temps make the rail very hot. Think red marks on your skin. A single layer of solar screening is not enough; I use two. Some areas are also covered by dense foam on riser blocks to allow air circulation. The rail stays at air temperature.
I like the gleaming idea.
A final comment as an indoor HO modeler and an outdoor G gauge modeler. I think you will find trying to do HO outdoors will not be easy. Structures will not stand up well, even the G structures on mine which are treated take a beating unless I take them inside in the fall. In Kansas City, we have some really heavy duty hail storms, can’t imagine using HO track in a hail storm with golf ball/softball hail stones, which we get at times. In fact, I have a shelter in the backyard and I run all the trains and cars into the shelter when we are under severe threat. I have had some G gauge track hit hard by hail.
It is easy for others to say go for it, when they have never actually tried it themselves.
But, if you are determined to try it, then do so and I will certainly wish you luck, I think you will need it.
Bob
Wow, softball sized hail? Im in mid Missouri which isnt very far from KC and I can count on one hand the number of times we’ve gotten hail larger than pea size. Just lucky I guess. Thanks for all the input guys, sounds like I should try a small experiment before plunking down some big $$$$. I let everyone know how it works out.
One other thing I would consider is the height the track will be off the ground. We elevate our indoor rail systems to a level that we consider comfortable, BUT we generally do not run our trains on a 6 inch wide shelf without some sort of “Fall Protection”. I would also consider designing and building some sort of battery powered radio controlled track cleaning car/loco system to clean and/or clear debris from the track. (I’m thinking how frustrating it would be to “Bright Boy” your available space). And maybe a storage building where the track runs directly into it with storage/fiddle yard so you can drive the trains in for storage when your not operating. My experience with outdoor G says if it takes too much effort to get trains from a shelf to the track, it will be significantly less fun, and trains left out in the sun will deteriorate just like the track. Just some things I think you should consider in your planning
Kevin
Will disagree with the cars deteriorating, at least the cars I have stay in pretty good shape, and they stay out on the railroad in the late spring, summer, early fall period, then go into a storage building. The only real problem I have with the G cars I have (and the diesels I have) is that the cars I bought and repainted and decalled did not stand up well at all. Paint faded, decals faded and started coming off.
I did leave a couple of old HO cars outdoors for one full year and they weren’t worth throwing in the trash. Distortions of the car bodies was the main problem.
Bob
It took a whole year? Here in Sunny Southern Nevada it only took a month. UV deterioration of the unpainted plastic was the guilty party.
UV also ate the ties on the one sacrificial length of Atlas flex. The only thing(s) worth salvaging were the two yard-long pieces of code 100 N/S rail. Everything else was dumpster filler.
Also, consider the effect of wind (we have straight-line wind speeds that approach hurricane force) and the impact of raindrops (thawed hailstones?) that hit with the equivalent force of HO scale artillery shells. If you end up having to build shed roof shelters over everything you might as well build indoors to start with. That’s what I did - retreated to the garage and have since gotten a good start on a respectable ‘last in this lifetime’ layout.
What happened to the sunburnt rail? It has since been incorporated into my hand-laid specialwork…
Chuck (Modeling Central Japan in September, 1964 - out of the Nevada sun)
I dont think I’ll have much problem with debris on the tracks, if I cover the layout after each use? As has been stated, the UV issue could be helped greatly by applying UV protectant paint to the ties. Do you think a silver colored tarp to reflect the sun would be the way to go as far as a cover while not in use?? This weekend Im going to Lowes to pickup some supplies for the experiment. The question as to how high to elevate the track is a good one. Hummmmm, not sure about that one, I was thinking around 50in.