I am going to start my very first hydrocal plaster work shortly.
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Any special concerns when mixing hydrocal with water?
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-Kevin
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Start with water, then slowly add the hydrocal. Sprinkle the powder in while stirring. You need a lot more powder than you think. Or, start with less water.
I use a stainless steel mixing bowl and a big stainless steel spoon that has the same curvature as the bowl so that I can scrape the sides of the bowl as I go.
The solution gets hot as it reacts. Not burning hot. Just kinda warm. Nothing to panic about.
Robert
Don’t wash any excess mix down the drain. Let it harden and dispose of the dry material. Don’t ask me how I know [:$]. Plumbers are expensive.
Joe
I found that we can buy this plaster product down here in Florida at Home Depot and at Lowes. It is called finishing plaster.
Is this anything like hydrocal? Has anyone used this?
It is reasonably priced and easy to obtain.
-Kevin
Always read the MSDS (SDS in the US.)
It tells you exactly what’s in stuff.
This product is basically Plaster of Paris with a bit of silica sand and another ingredient probably a catalyst of some sort.
Yup, dolomitic hydroxide also known as hydrated quick lime (calcium hydroxide). An accelerator for plaster mixes.
Hard to see how quick setting plaster is an advantage over regular stuff in our hobby. It will get pretty hot as you mix it.
Knowing what is in the product is of little help.
I was asking if anyone has used this, or a similar finsihing plaster, on a model railroad and if it will work similar to hydrocal.
Looking for real experience, not theory.
-Kevin
Well at the risk of provoking you I advise that you are very wrong there. Dangerously wrong. Utterly, completely 100% wrong.
In Canada we developed the WHMS system of mandatory MSDS precisely because of the attitude you display.
The very first thing you should check is the SDS (MSDS in Canada ) and it is intended for the uneducated as well as the professional. There is nothing theoretical about MSDS, understanding what they say is a matter of life and death or can be, which is why the system was implemented and why every manufacturer and supplier of such materials is required by law to make the MSDS publically available.
There’s just no excuse for not following proper safety procedures just because this is a hobby.
Plus, had you done so you would not have needed to ask.
You obviously did not understand my question and do not have the information I need for an answer.
Another thread has been ruined. I hope a moderator locks this one before it gets worse.
I will repost the question at a less hostile time.
-Kevin
Hi Kevin
USG make Superior plaster products that I have been using in construction most of my lifetime.
I use a lot of them but I must admit I have not used diamond but know what it is for.
It’s application is a finishing plaster that’s mostly used in commercial buildings where a more durable finish for abusive areas such as stairways.
My understanding is it drys super rock hard and would be a lot harder to shape and carve after it is dry much like DuraBond is.
Perhaps a little more spendy but this USG product could be a modelers better choice. A lot more bang for your buck than WS
$22.99 on eBay free shipping
This USG plaster is only $7 per bag at Home Depot and works great for adding a layer on a shell I have found. It gives you an hour to hour and a half working time before it sets up. A softer plaster, easily cut, carved and shaped. Maybe too soft for some applications
If you want a shell hard as a rock and not water-soluble DuraBond is the way to go. Works great with dryer sheets. Not good for shaping or easily cut after it’s dry though
TF
If you are refering to MSDS (Materials Safety Date Sheet), in the US we refer to them as MSDS, unless something changed since the last time I completed my OSHA 8 hr Hazwoper refresher.
Actually, you are mistaken. OSHA makes it clear that an SDS “is not primarily intended for use by the general consumer, focusing instead on the hazards of working with the material in an occupational setting”.
The general consumer may rely on the packaging itself regarding directions for use.
Rich
I use US Gypsum 20-minute casting plaster almost exclusively for scenery work. Hydrocal as a brand name isn’t at all important for building scenery.
Actually, I am not mistaken. I know exactly what I’m talking about. It is within my area of legal expertise. You think I said something I did not say. I was very exact in what I wrote.
On American websites (including the US Gypsum) their .pdf material data safety sheets are named SDS on the link so I repeated that acronym for clarity. In Canada these sheets are always labelled MSDS or should be. I am not expert in any American law and do not pretend to be. I am expert in Canadian law, particularly industrial safety.
These sheets are intended for the safety of the ordinary working person and are required to be functional for that.
Ergo, they are also suitable for use by any consumer.
If you don’t already know what’s in it, read the MSDS if you can locate it.
There was another recent Woodland Scenics hydrocal thread. I’m not going to look for it. The OP was disappointed with the WS brand. There are multiple Hydrocal concoctions and USG is pretty fuzzy about the distinctions. They don’t even offer a uniform set of comparisons between the different versions.
If the MSDS is so important, what are my risks working with it?
edit There is an SDS
OSHA says the SDS is a specified format of the MSDS to provide guidance to help workers who handle hazardous chemicals to become familiar with the format and understand the contents of the SDSs.
If I’m messing with a 50# bag, I’m a worker, even if no one is paying me.
WS doesn’t make their own, they buy it, somebody packages it, where and how long it sits in the WS warehouse is unknown. While it looks real convenient to buy a cereal size box of WS hydrocal, I’m afraid to try it and not because of the SDS
[#dots]
-Kevin
Sorry, but actually, you are mistaken. Trying to rewrite what you had previously written is fine if that makes you feel better, but the fact remains that under OSHA, an SDS "is not prima
Something did; the version of 29CFR1910.1200(g) after May 25 2012 substituted the term “SDS” for “MSDS” in the definition. So we need not dance around semantics or chest-beat about qualifications as to whether a MSDS is or isn’t an SDS, or think that the previous letters OSHA keeps as precedent to show what the interpretation of 29CFR1910 should be are ‘no longer valid’ somehow because the initialism changed.
Of course, anyone silly enough to trust that the MSDS/SDS adequately explains composition rather than acknowledged or statutory health concern evidently hasn’t read the MSDS for Hydrocal, which does not reference the trace of Portland cement constituent that actually ‘does the magic’ and only cites plaster of Paris as a material of concern. You’ll really go down the rabbit hole where formulary concerns on things like cleaning chemicals are concerned; the one for the Meyer Chemie Algorex product in a recent thread neatly tells you how to get advice for health concern without telling you the name of the hydrocarbon at all – at least they didn’t fall back on the old saw “petroleum distillates” that we’d see.
I don’t know if the old ‘formulary’ system for industrial trade secrets was superseded by the current OSHA law, but at one time the chemical information was listed as codes (sometimes like the names for color dyes) and the MSDS would include o
I said it before and I’ll say it again
I had an ex-wife once that was one of those know-it-all offensive people. After that I never had time for people like that anymore
A good friend of mine when I was young and still is my friend has a saying that I live by to this day. “Ignore a fool and he shall leave”
The bullheads still bite if you feed them
TF
[quote user=“richhotrain”]
Lastspikemike
richhotrain
Lastspikemike
Well at the risk of provoking you I advise that you are very wrong there. Dangerously wrong. Utterly, completely 100% wrong.
The very first thing you should check is the SDS (MSDS in Canada ) and it is intended for the uneducated as well as the professional.
Actually, you are mistaken. OSHA makes it clear that an SDS “is not primarily intended for use by the general consumer, focusing instead on the hazards of working with the material in an occupational setting”.
The general consumer may rely on the packaging itself regarding directions for use.
Rich
Actually, I am not mistaken. I know exactly what I’m talking about. It is within my area of legal expertise. You think I said something I did not say. I was very exact in what I wrote.
On American websites (including the US Gypsum) their .pdf material data safety sheets are named SDS on the link so I repeated that acronym for clarity. In Canada these sheets are always labelled MSDS or should be. I am not expert in any American law and do not pretend to be. I am expert in Canadian law, particularly industrial safety.
These sheets are intended for the safety of the ordinary working person and are required to be functional for that.
Ergo, they are also suitable for use by any consumer.
If you don’t already know what’s in it, read the MSDS if you can locate it.
I responded to the question about suitability of this product, only to be met with an all too common unconstructive response from this particular poster.
The facts are that the product asked about is Plaster of Paris with “dolomitic hydroxide” added which will act to accelerate the chemical reaction in the Plaster of Paris. It also adds to the exothermic aspect of the reaction, so, yes, there is a modest safety concern for anyone thinking this is just fancy Plaster of Paris.
That is not what the intended hobby use requires.
Additionally, this additive to Plaster of Paris will permit more water to be added intended to create a harder, smoother and thinner surface. It is designed to be a faster drying finishing wall plaster. This is also counterproductive to what model railroad scenery normally requires.
You’d be better off using straight Plaster of Paris than this specialized wall finishing product.
Then the kaffee klatch gang gets their knickers all in a twist.
A M A Z I N G.