Eliminating the switch on the main is a good move. Not s sure about swapping which of the tracks is the loading track. Better game out the moves on paper:
How would loads and empties move throught the concrete plant yard if the lower right track is the loading track ? Key question seems to be “where would the loaded cars end up if the lower track on the right is the loading track?”
If loaded cars ends up directly across from the loading track (ie at lower left), you now start blocking the tail t
There’s a cement plant here in central Virginia that uses three or so spur tracks for what seems to be both inbound and outbound. Inbound traffic seems interesting and assorted, I do think you might want to consider this. They get coal hoppers for fuel, and I hear that the coal ash is then mixed with some of the cement batches as an additive. I’ve seen covered hoppers of gypsum companies, and a shipment of calcium carbonate, at least that’s what the cars said. Not sure what they do with the calcium carbonate. I’ve driven by there like a dozen times, and always check out the cars on the tracks. It’s always interesting.
While they’re located basically adjacent to a limestone quarry, I also understand that some plants are located next to clay pits instead (clay being an important ingredient for cement, in addition to limestone) and some of those plants use rail to ship limestone instead.
Ok i’ll admit it you lost me way back at the start but it seems to me your missing a good opportunity to use a loads in empties out arrangement for this area by putting 2 sets of buildings back to back and accessing them from either end
To me it looks me like the loader is at the wrong end of the plant. rock is crushed in the crusher which is the start. It ends in the bulk storage building. That is where I think the loading should be. One thing I would want would be a building to fill bags of cement, which would be shipped out in box cars. This building would also recieve paper to make the bags.
The crusher in this diagram is the unit that crushes the clinker after it comes out of the rotary kiln. The cement clinker is crushed into powder and then sent up the conveyor to be stored in the silos for loading out to rail cars.
I believe very large bins filled with bearings several inches across would assist in the crushing into powder. I think they rotate along thier length axis and periodically empty out, but not sure.
Coal fired fly ash either gets dumped (No epa around) or sold to ready mix plants to mix into cement to make concrete along with other stuff.
Decide which way the loaded cars are going to go and then route a train to grab them loads and out of there without so much scooting about. I will presume that the branchline upgrade past the loaded cars isnt where the loads are going.
Alot of cement places simply stuck the railcar directly into the silos themselves and unloaded straight down into the basement where the stuff is then silo’ed above.
If you are making cement and need to ship out You are going to have dozens and dozens going out each week to customers all over the place.
Now that things are not exactly set in stone or cured yet, take some time to think things through.
Is there any possibility of adding real estate by filling in the ninety degree corner of the aisle? A couple of inches there might allow the curved loading track in Stein’s first attempt.
As for loads in, your initial post seems to indicate that there is not really any open space on the other side of the branch from the silos, so I won’t go there. But would it be completely verboten to add a delivery track off of what looks like the mainline? Maybe it could nestle against the backdrop at the very top of the diagram.
And Dave – that’s brilliant. I’m going to have to remember that track arrangement. But I still might go with Stein’s because it would be easier on the caboose, picking it off of the empties in their loading track and tacking it on to the loads waiting on the branch, instead of backing the full loaded train onto the caboose waiting on the branch between the crossovers.
Thanks for the input. After many hours of studying and arranging paper templates, I have come up with this setting as shown in the diagram. The cement plant has been moved back and will fit in the area shown after I shorten the conveyor leading up to the silos. I have created a passing siding for the branchline so trains will have an easier time working the different industries in the area. I know a train should be able to work a plant without fouling the main, but then again this is a branchline and the only traffic is going to and from the customers located along the branchline.
A train of empty cement hoppers arriving from the yard can ease into the siding, cut off the power and then run back down the main to the cement plant lead. The power then pulls the loads from the loading track and then stages them in the storage track. Once the loading track is clear, the empties are pulled back and then pushed into the loading track. The power then couples onto the loads and departs back to the yard.
The track along the bottom of the drawing is now available for a new industry. I plan on having the loading track inside the building. The stub that sticks out the right end of the building will hold an EMD Critter that will shuffle the cars in and out of the building. Once all of the cars are loaded, they will be pushed to the opposite end of the track to be picked up by a passing train.
Your conductors are going to hate you if it’s going to require extra moves to switch out the plant.
There’s no reason that the switch crew can’t go in with the empties, swing the loads to the main, and shove the empties back in. In reality, that’s probably how a crew would do it anyways. There’s no reason to make the extra moves to the storage track back and forth.
The switchback for the new customer is unnecessary as well.
Either switch them off the siding, or get rid of that three way switch.
After thinking about this for a while, I was just getting back on to post my comments and I see you’ve made a decision. I always watch these discussions with some interest. Various ideas get tossed around, changes made, repeat. It seems almost invariably that I like the “original” better than the “final”.
I was going to suggest putting a plywood prairie in the area, setting up one of the arrangements with sectional track and actually run testing it. Nothing like really running a set up to discover its shortfalls. After a while of taking notes switch the track to one of the other arrangements and try it. Then choose.
I didn’t want to go to the expense of buying sectional track to do a dry run, so I made paper templates of track and placed them as in the drawing. I ran the switching scenario in my mind dozens of times and thought what I had drawn would work because the extra moves would slow down an operating session, but I don’t want that part of the layout to be a pain so it becomes the orphaned stepchild.
I think the last drawing works much better…but I could be wrong! Thanks for the help.
So, you have dropped the idea that your branchline main will have an incline from the midpoint along the wall up towards to the left ?
If your branchline main has an incline, your passing siding also will have an incline (since a passing siding is connected to the branchline main at both ends, and thus need to be at the same elevation as the branchline main at both ends), and you will have trouble leaving cars in that siding.
From a later post by Don:
You should should show where the passing (ie double ended) siding connect to the branchline main at the left end of the siding. The length of that double ended siding is a relevant design parameter when picturing how you will do your swit
Can’t slip anything past you, can we Stein? The branchline main still has a grade…and the siding is flat for about 90% of its length, then it also rises on a 2% grade to meet the main at the far left end of the drawing…remind me to never bluff in a poker game against you!
Sorry - I was not trying to “call a bluff” or any such thing, just to point out a possible operating problem. If the math of those inclines work for you, then by all means go for it.
Merry Christmas!
Smile,
Stein, who is a pretty lousy poker player - not good at bluffing at all [:)]
I don’t understand…where are you suggesting the double-slip be installed? Most prototypes would probably avoid a double-slip unless it was the only workable solution. I don’t see how a double-slip would help the situation.
I like your overall idea here, but working for a real railroad gives me a simpler insight. the delivering train would probably hold the empties, and proceed to the far end switch, reach in and grab the loads, then set them out on the mainline. then shove the empties back to a spot on the pit, cutoff and then come out on the opposite end switch to grab the loads and return to where it originated from…assuming that this was the last stop on the line, otherwise, they’d probably go back out the original switch, couple up and take the loads with them to the next destination in that direction. and if you were holding some additional cars on the head end for the “next” destination, this would work perfectly with that idea too.
I llike the one on the top of the page. I am also doing a cement plant, and have been looking at the ideas on this topic. I thought about doing a siding into the cement plant, and maybe one off to the side for extra switching. I don’t think I will have enough room on the layout for most of the ideas alreayd posted. I have about 2ft to work with.
If you mean your benchwork is 2’ deep, you should have plenty of room to work with. My benchwork in the area drawn is only 28" deep. I will have to modify the conveyor to fit the set of structures in place, but that shouldn’t be a problem. If you use all of the buildings as designed, the whole plant stretches out about 4’ in length (left to right).
