I need help finding a screw for a steam locomotive

Model Railroader General Discussion (Model Railroader)
1

I have an old HO Mikado steam locomotive that is missing the screw that connects the linkage between the side rod and the piston on the right side. See the following photo https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/47680512622_0d31d877b1_m.jpg. This locomotive was supposedly made by John English.

I took the screw from the other side and measured it and this is the resulting drawing https://live.staticflickr.com/65535/33856226488_8dca9d39b7_m.jpg. The gray area represents the threads. I made a couple of tests in a piece of aluminum. The test 0-80 hole seemed to be big in diameter and the 0-90 hole to small.

Does anyone know what the thread size might be? Even more important, does anyone know where I might find a screw to fit the locomotive?

2

Welcome to the MR forums.

Try Micro Mark.

https://www.micromark.com/

Mike.

3

It’s probably a metric screw. Do you know where it was made? If its an import I almost garantee that is a metric screw.

Almost all locomotives these days are metric screws since they are made in China.

Mcmaster Carr is probably your best bet if Micromark doesn’t have it. McMaster has by far the best selection of screws of any company I have ever seen and its super easy to navigate their website to find what you need.

Also do you happen to have a thread gage? comes with a lot of tap and die sets. It should tell you what the TPI (teeth per inch) is. for example a 2-56 screw is a #2 size and has 56 threads per inch. that will help you figure out what kind of screw it is.

4

The instruction sheet for the John A. English & Co. Mikado shows their address as Morrisville, PA. I don’t know where the locomotive was physically made. The only two dies I have are mentioned above. The 0-80 is slightly large and the 0-90 is slightly small.

5

Thanks for the welcome. I have posted on the forum a few times, but they all disappeared for some reason.

6

According to the charts, if that is true, it would be a 1.2 or 1.4 mm. The Timonium show has dealers with all sorts of parts and screws, but the next show is months off and may be no where near where you are.

If your representation of the shape of the screw is accurate, it was made for the purpose and not an off the shelf screw.

[#welcome] to the forum.

Did John English have anything to do with Bowser or where they just near one another?

Bowser acquired English. Long shot give them a call.

7

Lee English and Bowser are very much alive:

http://www.bowserorders.com/.sc/ms/cat/HO%20Bowser%20Parts--Screws%2C%20Nuts%2C%20Bolts

“Crankpin Screw” is on this page:

http://www.bowserorders.com/.sc/ms/cat/HO%20Bowser%20Parts--Side-Main%20Rods

I have emailed Lee English with parts requests and he has always been helpful. Use the “Contact” link or call and see if you can get some help.

Good Luck, Ed

8

The valve gear for John English steam locomotives was made by Central Valley, and was an add-on kit.
The connection between the main rod and the crosshead is a hollow rivet, and the hole should be 1/16" (.625" - roughly halfway between a clearance hole for a 00-90 screw - .0520" and that for a 0-80 screw, which is .0670").

John English dates back to the mid-'50s or earlier, and is long gone. I doubt, too, that Central valley would have any rivets left from so long ago, but you may be able to get some suitable rivets from Bowser.

You could also make a hollow rivet using 1/16" brass tubing. Drill out the centre at one end of a length of tubing, using successively larger bits in a pin vise, until you’re left with a piece of thin-walled tubing.
Punch a slightly larger than 1/16" diameter circle from some fairly thin (.005") brass sheet, then solder that to one end of the tube.

Place the capped piece of tubing on a hard surface, with the capped end hanging over the edge to avoid deforming it.

Using a utility knife or your X-Acto, place the blade on the tubing at a point which will cut a piece of the capped end from the tubing, yielding a rivet as long, or slightly longer, than needed for the repair.
Now, carefully use the blade of the knife to roll the tubing back and forth, scoring its circumference while preventing the blade from wandering. Continue this operation until the rivet is cut free - it doesn’t take long.

If necessary, clean-up the cut end of the rivet with a file and, if needed, file the rivet to a suitable length - it needs to be long enough to protrude through the parts being joined, with some extra length to be deformed by placing pliers over the assembly, one jaw on the soldered-on head, the other on the open end of the tube. A gentle squeeze or two should deform the open end enough that it can’t back-out of the con

9

Yes John English stuff dates from the 1950s so an earlier poster’s speculation that screws would be metric is unlikely.

Bowser bought the inventory and rights to John English but to my knowledge never put any of the John English/Hobbyline stuff into production (something they had to clarify since they were close proximity in Penna and both headed by guys named English, plus Bowser had its own version of the Pennsylvania RR A5 0-4-0 which was one of the mainstays of the John English line - but the parts were NOT interchangable). I do think they used to put exploded-view parts lists for John English stuff in their parts catalog even if they didn’t sell any of it.

AMENDED POSTING: the exploded drawing of the Mikado on the HO Seeker webside says the screw you are missing is part # 102-3. Unfortunately it does not give sizes for any of the screws in the kit.

They MIGHT have access to useful information about sizes of John English stuff, screws and rivets, you’d need even if they do not sell it. If it is valve gear rivets you need, don’t overlook the fact that Precision Scale Co. (PSC) is under new ownership and their online catalog page 182 shows a variety of valve gear rivets available, as well as a good many parts of interest to steam era modelers. It is yet another example where the Walthers catalog no longer gives a complete sense of what is really available out there.

https://www.precisionscaleco.com/

https://www.precisionscaleco

10

This is my John English Pacific, acquired “used” in 1956. I added the Kemtron vestibule cab (now available from Precicion Scale) some years later, along with the scratchbuilt tender and the extra detailing…

I think that my father had done some work on the siderods, as some of them are cut from sheet brass, and he also added the Central Valley valve gear before giving the loco to me.

While it still has its original open frame motor and is a good runner, it’s currently torn down for a complete re-build, including new drivers from Greenway and a gearbox from NWSL, in addition to a can motor. I’ll also redo the detailing, and change the Elesco fwh to a Worthington SA-type.

Wayne

11

A screw for a steam locomotive? Do you want to give a steam locomotive and get a screw, or give a screw and get a steam locomotive?

12

Golly, my late brother had a couple of John English steam locos and I could swear they had the standard 0-80 hex head shouldered crank pins. I don’t remember any American made HO steam locos using anything metric. That came along later, when the Jpanese brass stuff started showing up. (My first O scale loco was a $25 KTM “Convertable Tank Loco” with everything metric–including the brass driver axles! What fun!)

Deano

13

I can’t give you an answer to your specific question but, I can refer you to two suppliers of miniature fasteners for the hobbyist:

https://www.microfasteners.com is my go-to supplier of small hardware. They have an enormous selection in both SAE and metric standards.

https://www.fastenerexpress.com lists a wide variety of miniature fasteners for the hobbyist and may have what you need.

Good luck in your search. I hope you can get that mike back on the road.