IGCC/coal to liquid fuels plant planned for Roundup Montana

Trains Magazine General Discussion
1

If Solzrules ever gets his New Milwaukee Road rebuilt over the old ROW, this’ll be one of his biggest customers, both coming and going! (Roundup is right near the old Milwaukee mainline through Montana)

http://www.missoulian.com/articles/2006/10/03/news/top/news01.prt

Two coal plants planned near Roundup

By MIKE DENNISON Missoulian State Bureau

HELENA - Gov. Brian Schweitzer and a coal-energy partnership Monday announced plans to develop a $1.5 billion to

$2 billion coal-to-liquids plant and accompanying “clean coal” power plant south of Roundup.

The announcements, made by Schweitzer and a partnership that includes DKRW Energy of Houston, mark the first concrete proposal for a Montana plant using coal to produce diesel fuel - a technology heavily promoted by the governor.

“They all have experience; they all have deep pockets,” Schweitzer said of the developers. “They understand what they’re doing, and when they announce something, it’s for real.”

The plan is for construction of a refinery that will convert coal to diesel fuel at 22,000 barrels a day, using coal from the Bull Mountain mine south of Roundup.

Also part of the proposal is a new, 300-megawatt power plant using Integrated Gas Combined Cycle technology, thought to be the cleanest method of using coal to generate electricity.

The partnership includes DKRW, which is working on another coal-to-diesel project in northern Wyoming, Bull Mountain Companies, which operates the coal mine south of Roundup, and Arch Coal of St. Louis, the second-largest coal producer in the nation.

Developers said construction of the plant would create 800 jobs, as well as several hundred to operate the plants once they’re operating.

Evan

2

Crap. I am going to need a whole bunch of ties in a hurry…

Anyone got a deal on really good welded rail?

Anyone have about 5 billion dollars lying around gathering dust that I could have?

Anyone?

3

The rail atlas shows about 147 miles between Miles City and Roundup - the ROW is still pretty much intact - figure $2million/mile for good quality track - 300 million should get you going.

4

The sheer size of the project, the environmental permits required, questions about where the money will come from and a number of other factors suggest that the plant will never get built.

5

Based on the eventual rising of consumer petroleum costs, eviromental pressures and growth of energy demands, this is a welcome and forward thinking plan that deserves a chance. If successful, this could be the proverbial tip of the iceburg in regard to utilizing the huge amount of coal reserves we have. As much as I would like to see railway transport get it’s fair share of monetary benefit, you would think that liquified or slurried pipelines would be the main means of moving this stuff, unless they generate KW right at the source. Interesting development…

6

I hear them doctors at the Mayo Clinic are a fairly rich bunch with plenty of discretionary income for investment purposes. Maybe they will take stock in your project. In fact, I hear they’d like to rip up 600 miles worth of “dangerous” rails somewhere in South Dakota and Minnesota. Perhaps you could re-lay that rail![swg]

7

Ah, but you forgot legal costs and enviromental studies.

300 million - build and run a railroad

4.7 billion - legal fees and court costs.

So really I was right on with my figurin’ right?[:)]

8

I’d have to say that you’re probably right about the court costs and legal fees…[censored]

  • Erik
9

Slurry pipelines for moving coal are not too likely because they require a lot of water and the aquifers under the Western states are already being overused. Another factor against coal gasification, oil shale and other similar technologies is the volatility of the price of petroleum. They may be economically viable at the current price of petroleum but not if the price falls.

10

Deja Vu all over again. In 1984, I lived in Gillette, Wyoming. The town was booming, thanks to coal and oil production, and the ramp up to the E.T.S.I coal slurry pipeline, and the Hamphire Gasificaton Project just getting ready to start. Oil prices dropped, and both ETSI and Hampshire evaporated at the same time. So many people were leaving, I almost had to get in line to use the highway out of town.

When I read about wonderful projects like this, I hope that people involved have a plan B, if it all comes to naught.

On the brighter side…isn’t this place only 100 or so miles from the end of the DM&E at Colony, Wyoming?

11

About 230 miles as the crow flies, probably more like 300 following the best rail-suitable profile. Why, are you planning on joining forces with Solzrules, building west from Colony into Montana while he builds east from Roundup, and having your own golden spike ceremony somewhere near Volborg?

If so, I’ll bring the cider.

12

heh heh heh heh…make sure it is the really “sweet” cider…

it should make my massive debt seem a little less massive. For a little while.

13

Hey, just put in for an FRA loan like DM&E is doing, maybe a little more since yours is a true transcon project. Say about $4 billion? That will get you from Colony to Roundup, right through the Montana PRB fields, and should get you as far as Lombard over the old Milwaukee ROW. Make sure the State of Montana gives you all the ED rights you need! Once to Lombard, see if you can get temp rights over MRL (you might have to reciprocate similar rights back to MRL over your ex-Milwaukee line so they can avoid Bozeman Pass). Then you’ll need another FRA loan for the Western Section, from St. Regis on the MRL back onto the Milwaukee ROW. Use the bulk of that money for the new lower elevation tunnel under St. Paul Pass using the original Milwaukee surveys (you may want to pop in and consult with Mr. Sol for that purpose). Get the ROW back from the Forest Service all the way to St. Maries, then get trackage rights over the St. Maries River Railroad to Plummer, build right up to the Washington border. From there on, you need to head to Olympia and the WSDOT Rail Office and convince them to provide you all the ROW you need to get from Tekoa to Tacoma - maybe enti

14

According to Mr Sol trains should never have stopped running there.!!!

15

He also said that dieselization was a bad thing for railroads in the 1940s-50s, so take it with a grain of salt

Bert

16

Actually, according to most of the rail shipping population of the Northern Tier and their supporters, those Milwaukee trains never should have stopped running there. It is only rail industry mythmakers who state otherwise.

17

No, what he stated was that the massive debt financing for wholesale dieselization was shown to be a bad thing for the railroads. The ROI stats of that era seem to back up that hypothesis.

Not real suprising you would intentionally misrepresent what he said. Typical ilk.

18

[quote user=“futuremodal”]

Hey, just put in for an FRA loan like DM&E is doing, maybe a little more since yours is a true transcon project. Say about $4 billion? That will get you from Colony to Roundup, right through the Montana PRB fields, and should get you as far as Lombard over the old Milwaukee ROW. Make sure the State of Montana gives you all the ED rights you need! Once to Lombard, see if you can get temp rights over MRL (you might have to reciprocate similar rights back to MRL over your ex-Milwaukee line so they can avoid Bozeman Pass). Then you’ll need another FRA loan for the Western Section, from St. Regis on the MRL back onto the Milwaukee ROW. Use the bulk of that money for the new lower elevation tunnel under St. Paul Pass using the original Milwaukee surveys (you may want to pop in and consult with Mr. Sol for that purpose). Get the ROW back from the Forest Service all the way to St. Maries, then get trackage rights over the St. Maries River Railroad to Plummer, build right up to the Washington border. From there on, you need to head to Olympia and the WSDOT Rail Office and convince them to provide you all the ROW you need to get from Te

19

Hey solzrules, I think I found your rail. This weekend, to my surprise, I observed that most of the rail is still in place on the Milwaukee line going east out of Rapid City, S.D. (At least the first 10-15 miles.) Why would this rail still be in place, when it hasn’t seen a train in over 25 years? Also, there is 100+ miles of this same line that runs from Kadoka, east to Chamberlain, that will probably never see a train again.

20

Heh heh wouldn’t it be funny if we could rebuild the Milwaukee Road to the Pacific with all original Milwaukee rail and ties? It might be better shape than it was back in the 70’s! (The 100 year old spikes would be driven in a little farther, I mean…)