Well, I guess I’ll rant a little about my current situation with the layout that wants to be. I’ve been in the building stage for a while and I have ripped the layout apart once. The same old situation as a lot of people get themselves into on their first layout - too much track and too tight of curves. The original intent was to have a double deck layout because my available space is only 10 x 12. Well, to make a long story somewhat shorter I have abandoned the double deck idea. Of course this only occurred to me after spending monthes building a double tracked helix with 30 and 33in radii 8 layers high. So, I’m currently dismantling the helix and salvaging as much track as I can but the going seems slow. My motivation is down because it seems like I’m going in circles. I think I have a nice simple trackplan now but this hobby is supposed to be fun. I, for the life of me, haven’t been having much fun at all the past year or so. Anyone else go through this?
I know the feeling. I have been trying to work out a track plan for quite some time now and as a result I am spending very little time in my layout room.
I don’t think you should necessarily fight this feeling, or the implications of it. I know of several posters here with whom I exchange emails daily who are taking breaks from the hobby, or at least from their layout development.
Look at it this way: you keep learning things about what your assumptions were at one time, and you keep finding that you have to discard them. I would be a happy man if that were the tale of my life. It is when you persist, despite knowing that you are into the diminishing returns, or are on an outright wrong path, that you should feel badly.
So, you have found, after a lot of what must have been interesting reading and helix devlopment, and even its early construction, that it’s a bust. You are actually further ahead…except that your overarching goal was to have an operational railroad by last Christmas, or most of it.
Take stock of your lessons, but also take stock of your original purpose and knowledge base. Is what you contemplated really going to make you happy when/if you can get it done before Easter? If you’re not very sure, maybe you need to step back and re-evaluate your entire approach to a layout. Your sub-conscious is digging in and making you uncomfortable…even unhappy.
If part of the problem is with a significant other person whom you had to convince to let you go this far, get the confession over with right away, and get that bear off your back. It would be nice to have something concrete in its place to share with that person, but you could at least admit that you no longer need, or want, to pursue your original assumptions and their expression in your layout development to date. Go away and figure out where you need to go from here. Maybe that would be done after a few weeks of distancing yourself from the hobby.
I have been going through the same thing for the past 20 years. I may get as far as laying track, then get bored or don’t like what I have. My layout room now is similar in size to yours. I was always trying to cram as much track in everywhere I could. I have no imagination when it comes to designing a layout. I can see it in my mind and see how it looks, but just can’t get it right. I finally gave up and gave in and had someone help me with the design and that was the best thing I could have done. He kept me in check as far as not trying to cram track everywhere. I have just started with the benchwork and laying track. I have now made it farther than anyother layout to date. I also thought of having a double deck layout in this room but after talking to him I saw that it would not be a wide investment. I bought all the layout design books to help me but I still couldn’t get it right.
I started my layout rebuild (11x15 HO 2 level) last January and made significant progress through the year, but pretty much stopped in November. I had the benchwork done, the lower level track laid, wired, and tested, and the outside main line on the upper level completed. Then it all came to a screeching halt.
There was a number of reasons, but the kicker was my brand new Bachmann 2-8-0 “throwing a screw” and spacer and it just disappeared. I finally got ahold of Bachmann and went thru a not so funny comedy of errors with them, just trying to get a couple of replacement parts. This lasted about 3 weeks, and it killed my layout enthusiasm. Well, Bachmann finally came through, but then the Holidays were upon us, and my annual Christmas Ebay sales (finished last week) began. Sooo, I just shut the door, and didn’t touch it until this week.
All is well now, and I’ll get the rest of the track laid, wiring done, and testing completed in the next couple of months.
The thing is, this kind of lapse in enthusiasm is just not all that uncommon, and I guess it happens to most of us more than once during a layout build.
One point I would like to make, is that if your lapse is due to your dissatisfaction with something on the layout, think it out carefully. Then, either accept it or fix it, but don’t let it go if you are unhappy.
Yeah, I agree with what you are saying. In the end I want a functioning railroad that I can scenick nicely and run some nicely painted and detailed rolling stock. It doesn’t have to have the most realistic operations in the world - in fact I’m leaning more and more for a roundy round. I kind of like the idea of scale railfanning but may want more after a year or so of that. I guess that’s the hard part for me, figuring out if I would even enjoy switching or timetable operations and the such. I plan on putting in some switching for industries but to what extent - I don’t know. I have to say that even though I’ve been doing and equal amount of tear down and building I don’t consider the time to be wasted. Hell, building that helix taught me alot. Now if I ever need to build a helix in the futre for a bigger railroad, I’ll know how.
No, she doesn’t but into my hobby. As long as it keeps me happy that’s all she cares about.
I guess I just need a win or something that seems like one. Maybe after I get that helix torn down I’ll feel like I’m on the right track again.
Another thing that sometimes gets me down is lack of time. I still am fairly young (38) and work full time. By the time I get home in the evenings (7:30 most nights) there is only enough time to eat dinner, visit with the wife and kids, give the pets some attention and then it is 9pm. Don’t have alot of energy to work on the railroad. When I get time on the weekends, I’m not always in the mood to go crawling around on the floor. Oh well, one day.
I am on and off with the layout. I spend more time in the forums than the layout but I do manage to find time. When in a lull make sure you always have some track laid so that you can run the trains. Also this is the time of year when clubs have open house. Visit them and get some ideas.
A 10x12 room can keep you plenty busy without a second level. I like the idea earlier of bringing someone in for ideas, even if they don’t help with them. Kids are great to use as well, because they think about what is fun and outside the box.
You can also buy a model train program that you can set up a layout and run trains to see if it’s for you. I forget the name of it but I tried it once.
interested minds want to know,why did you abanden the helix ? to big for your room or operational problems… I ask cause Im still kicking the Idea of a helix but a 26 24 radius oval down to a stageing level…Jerry
Chris, been there… done that. I have a pretty nice layout room, all the benchwork done, mainline laid and have been working on scenery, buildings etc. But in early December, due to a variety of reasons, I kinda sorta lost interest. I closed the door and hardly went in the room for a month, but now the doldrums seemed to have gone away.
The lesson I learned from it was that the worst thing, for me, that I could do was to keep trying to push ahead on the layout when I really wasn’t in the mood for it. It just made things worse. But, I’m back to ballasting track now ---- UGHH!!— even though it the one part of model railroading I detest.
Sometimes you just get stuck, either in layout design, how to do a certain area… whatever. If you have a modeling friend that you can ask over, just to sit down and have a cup of coffee with and talk about it, they sometimes come up with things you never thought about.
I’m retired now but it wasn’t long ago that I was like you, coming in late and tired, things to do, things that had to be done yesterday. It’s not easy but every retired model railroader on this forum empathizes with you.
It’s a mind-set thing, and I even forget that to this day and have to be reminded of it. Like you said, you’re only 38 with many, many years ahead of you, and this is just a hobby. Do what you can, when you can and try to enjoy what you get done.
Sound more like the first layout blues where we bite off more then we can chew…Its always better to start with a simple temporary layout and start operation.From there we will gain knowledge what we need as far as operation,scenery requirement and curvature…The second layout will be far better and after then comes the layout.
Over the years I seen new modelers dive into a major layout,become discourage,throw up their hands and quit the hobby…
Thankfully I escape that experience by studying what I wanted to accomplish then made a list of my givens and druthers,slim that down to a manageable size and then start construction of the layout.Of course I had a good teacher and absolutely no infomercial layout design books.
I then plan my track work…I place the structures where I would like 'em to go then place the track.
As alot of good folks pointed out I just probably bit off more than I could comfortable digest for a first layout. There was nothing wrong with the helix except maybe that it was too huge for the space I have. It was over five feet in diameter and the frame work to hold it was even larger. Just too big to make sense for the room. The size the helix took up ended up being almost half the available square footage of the layout. I needed a minimum 30" interior radius (double tracked), to accomodate my long wheelbase 2-10-4 brass steamer. A helix that large in a room that small just didn’t make a double deck layout remotely worth it. After it was built it then became clear how large it actually was (things just seem way different on paper) and how much I actually hated being in the layout room because it was soo miserable to move around in. That’s when I new it had to go and I had some serious re-thinking to do.
I’m going to throw a couple of things out here as well. I’ve gotten into the same stuck on stop pattern several times over the years. Like someone mentioned, time is a big factor. Between work, Scouts, coaching soccer for him, soccer for her, Little League, basketball, and all the other stuff, by the time I look at the layout room, it’s just “nah, forget it” and go collapse somewhere.
Now I also believe there’s another factor. This one will probably cause some controversy, but I never the less believe it’s true for many of us. That’s the “you aren’t doing it right unless …” syndrome. You know the one where you have to have multiple operators, using command control and a dispatcher, to thread a lot of long multiple unit trains through several towns with outstanding scenary. So to do it right we try to fit a towns, helixes, multiple decks, and everything else into our railroad too. Only we don’t have a basement with plenty of helpers. We have only ourselves and have to fit it all into a spare room – the one that was too small to really use as a bedroom. And oh, by the way, it also has to hold the wife’s sewing room. We’re basically set up for failure before we start. So, we get down in the dumps and think about chucking the whole thing.
Well there is an alternative. Simplify. Less is more. Instead of multi track mainlines with lots of towns, drop to a single town or two that can fit in the room. Even if we stay with two decks, simplify the line to fewer tracks and more scenary. Do we really need multiple trains and command control or do we in reality only run one train at a time? What really turns us on? If scratchbuilding an old store is fun, then do that and don’t worry if we aren’t having an ops session. On the other hand, if ops is the thing, then maybe David Barrows’ minimilist approach will let you spend your time on what m
jmb wrote:Now I also believe there’s another factor. This one will probably cause some controversy, but I never the less believe it’s true for many of us. That’s the “you aren’t doing it right unless …” syndrome. You know the one where you have to have multiple operators, using command control and a dispatcher, to thread a lot of long multiple unit trains through several towns with outstanding scenary. So to do it right we try to fit a towns, helixes, multiple decks, and everything else into our railroad too. Only we don’t have a basement with plenty of helpers. We have only ourselves and have to fit it all into a spare room – the one that was too small to really use as a bedroom. And oh, by the way, it also has to hold the wife’s sewing room. We’re basically set up for failure before we start. So, we get down in the dumps and think about chucking the whole thing.
Well said! [tup] I couldn’t agree more.
I will add this…Once you get your basic track laid start opearation/running trains because like that old saw says: All work and no play makes Jack a dull boy…You see you can take a break from doing scenery work,ballasting track etc.operate(run) trains for awhile then back to the required work.
I know of a guy who worked on his layout for seven years, only to find out it will not meet his expectations and running trains will be a problem, due to a too narrow radius selected for his helix. Even at slow speeds, all trains either derailed or cars uncoupled. To say the bloke lacked motivation when he found out would be a gross understatement. He was on the verge of chucking his hobby for good. I developed a new plan for him, less complicated, smaller - chunks he could easily swallow without chocking. He is now back in the hobby and the work he does can only be described as superb! The layout he is building is a simple shelf-type layout around the 4 walls of his basement, not deeper than 24", based on a real prototype and incorporating the scenic highlights of that line. The track plan is also based on the real situation, selectively compressed.
He now enjoys the progress of his layout as it turned out to be fun and not only a chore.
Check out Atlasrr.com. They have their layouts that you can download. Although it’s not complete, it can give you a good starting point. Another source of layouts is the Model Railroader Subscriber Extras. There is a “Track Plan Database”.
I ran into a similar problem about 7 months ago. The track plan got too complex for the room and for what I wanted to do. A helix to connect my planned second deck to the first was driving me nuts in terms of planning and building and the resulting loss of floor space. I stared at the project for close to three months with no work other than putting together a couple of “needed” structures.
Last month, my wife decided that she was going to turn over an oddly shaped guest room to the trains as opposed to forcing me to use a larger space in our house that created the need for two drop in sections for regular access through the room. Regardless, this turned out to be a blessing in disguise because it made me realize a few things.
First, I needed to get one deck finished to let me “play” with the trains. Second, a full-fledged helix wasted too much floor space in the now smaller layout room. Instead, I stepped back and realized that I could use several “blobs” spaced in the corners of the rooms and in the center of a long wall for multiple purposes. In effect, I took the helix and split it into three separate miniature helix (helii?). The third benefit was my realization that creating sections for the layout that can be broken down in the future is probably a very good idea in case we have to move again for work or if my wife moves the layout again. This in turn, led to benefit four, which was the standardization of my block sections to a more modular concept.
Regardless, I now have three hilly areas that I can use for scenery applications in addition to running a two level helix inside and under the scenery blobs. I’m very satisfied now because I can generally corkscrew my layout to the top deck while still getting a running layout on the lower deck first.
Don’t let it get you down. It happens to most everyone. Many things bring about the blahs, mainly no progress does it. Not enough time to devote and a few “wrong” decisions here and there add to the frustration. I know about the wrong decisions, I would say I’ve re-layed my track more than most because my wants and desires changed, but I bet that would only spawn a ton of replies telling me I’m not. One thing’s for sure, you will experience nothing that someone else hasn’t experienced before. Well, within reason.
My advice to you, if asked, would be. Do not get frustrated and quit. Keep plugging away in your spare time, what little you have. I, like most, often walk into the layout room or area with good intentions only to sit or stand there for a bit and say “nah, not in the mood” and walk away. I may not touch mine for a week or two at a time. But it’s there. So don’t give up. You won’t regret it. What you will regret is saying you’ll tear it down and rebuild when you get more time. Trust me on this, you’ll wish you hadn’t. Unless of course life forces it because of the need for the room etc, but don’t do it because you don’t have time or the free cash. The RR will wait for you. That way you will still have something to tinker with and spend time and money on as they come available.
From a guy who’s been there and done that. Put it aside to wait, now I wish I hadn’t. I missed so much.
I really don’t understand everyone’s lack of imagination and inspiration. Sure, even the best of us will get down in the dumps once in awhile-- but you can’t let lack of a basement or an undersized bedroom keep you away from your love of the hobby. So what if your wife needs the spare bedroom for a sewing room? So what if your dreams and aspirations are bigger than your basement-- you can’t let a little thing like THAT get you down, no sir-- not when there’s the ROOF to consider…
You gotta admit, most people don’t ever consider the largest single section of square-footage they own. There are generally very few encumberances, perhaps a chimney or a standpipe or two (don’t stick your nose in one, btw-- don’t ask me how I know…) Its flat, its big, its wide-open and just begging for some tracks! True, in some cases it may be slanted, but you know, sometimes you just have to play the hand you’ve been dealt. Stop looking a gift-horse in the mouth and all that. Afterall you did just discover 800-1200 sq feet you’ve never thought of before. You want it to be level too??? Besides, you can level it up, just add taller risers on one side is all you need to do.
Another nice thing about modeling on the roof is that visitors don’t track mud through your house to get to the layout room. They can just stand out in the yard and see everything. Or maybe if you have a really tall layout, in your neighbor’s yard-- and you gotta admit, that’d be better, right?
And when your wife complains that you’re not getting “outdoors” enough-- well, that’d shut her right up, wouldn’t it? You’d have your nice big layout AND be outdoors at the sam